e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e hear me what can you hear me now e e good we're going to call the April 25th 2024 meeting to order Mr slam may I have a roll call please miss Brock Mr samaga here Mr Cantina Mr Krauss here miss pellet Dr Ross here Mr Sweeney here Mr Zimmerman here we have a quorum okay we're gonna go right into close session is recommend that the board enter to close session for the purposes of discussing legal personnel and student matters some action will be taken as a result of the discussions moveed by Mr Zimmerman second second by Mr Krauss all those in favor I I we are in closed session e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e okay all right we're going to call is recommended that the Bor return to open session uh Mr slam a new roll call please miss Brock Mr Sago here oh did we uh oh wait I'm sorry it's recommended the board return to open session may I have a motion please so move Mr cantino second second by Mrs pallet U all in favor I posed we're an open session now may I have a roll call please Mr slam Miss Brock Mr samaga here Mr cantino here Mr Krauss here miss pellet here Dr Ross here Mr Sweeney here Mr Zimmerman he will be back momentarily we have AUM and miss fedich miss federi here please join me Pledge of Allegiance IED to the of the United States of America and to the rep stand naice thank you reading of the meeting notices Please Mr slam the New Jersey open public meetings law was enacted to ensure the right of the public to have advanced notice of and to attend the meetings of public bodies at which any business affecting their interest is discussed or acted upon in accordance with provisions of the ACT buron Township Board of Education has caused notice of this meeting to be published and adequate notice has been provided and notice this meeting has been properly posted in accordance with the New Jersey open public meeting law uh just a couple of quick notes uh we have a work our next work session is Thursday May 9th uh the next public meeting will be Thursday May 16th thank you letter F you're going to be a presentation y I just have one I guess note that I'd like to say due to an anfor an unfortunate event we have another vacancy on the board of education we will be putting out an ad for filling that vacancy tomorrow probably within the next day or two it'll be sent to the um to the newspaper tomorrow but there's usually a couple days lag put actually will show in the paper next week we hope to fulfill it or interview people for the position at the next work session May 9th is that enough time it is tight very tight we should about the public meeting we'll do it at the public meeting okay so we will uh interview for the position on the 16th that's all I have and then letter F Mr slam do we need to move are you going to be using the screen yes I'll use the screen and how about lights would lights help or lights out um it'll be on that and this we're gonna have yeah I just turn it on let's see how how bright it gets yeah just let me know if you can't hear me is this close enough okay where can everyone see the that screen okay kind of maybe can you turn the front lights off maybe better thank you uh good evening everybody uh tonight I'm going to be talking about our final budget um and then also towards the end of the presentation we're also going to provide some more information on the separate proposal or as it's commonly referred to uh second question right just stay close to the mic please I learned my lesson from last time there we go so I always like to start off off with our mission statement I'm sure everyone is very familiar with it but I always want to put it up there as a reminder um obviously our priorities here are to support our students support our staff um ensure quality education and environment that's conducive to learning um not gonna read through the whole thing just because I I already know there's gonna be a lot to talk about tonight so I W to make sure I uh take that in account value everyone's time so one of the things uh that's important to understand about a budget is that it essentially consists of planned expenses and expected revenues so we're looking a year out um and looking at historic information current year information in terms of revenues and expenditures uh and then looking also at the needs that we anticipate for the next year uh to create that budget um so I always like to say that it's a living document um because you need to remain flexible uh because it's difficult to know what's going to happen a year from now uh but it should be as it says up on on the slide uh a financial expression of the district's needs and priorities so for the 2425 budget um I just want to talk a little bit about the process you know how did we get to the final budget presentation so the start of the process the most one of one the very important the first step is gathering information on prior year and current year spending which I kind of talked about a little bit already um I also like to go back a little bit farther than just one prior year uh for the you know comparison purposes to see if I can identify Trends you want to verify and validate your personnel cost for the district um so Personnel costs it includes you know salaries obviously but also things like health benefits um other uh benefits that will be provided um things that you might not you know think about right off the bat like Social Security expenses things things of those nature of that nature and that includes uh making sure that your position control roster is as accurate as possible again knowing that you know some things may change between you know today and and next year uh you want to look at your fixed costs um and try to anticipate any potential increases uh you know some of those six costs are obviously going a lot of this are going to be building related uh energy related um things that are required for the district to continue to operate on a day-to-day basis and you know you you want to meet with Administration uh you know building principles um any supervisors uh to get information on what we think the needs in the next year will be um and prior to that they're meeting uh with their staff with their teachers uh to try to gather that information and relate to me um so you know I look at the financial side I rely on them for the information uh the educational information the curriculum information those sorts of anticipated needs and then you know we're preparing the actual budget that's uh you know just account expense accounts Revenue accounts uh putting everything together for submission to the county uh which happened after our preliminary budget presentation uh in March um we did receive approval by by uh the county superintendent and the county ba so just a little bit about balancing the budget now with school districts they're pretty limited and types of different Revenue um that are available um and you'll see a little bit more about this later where I do a little bit of a deeper dive into What percentages of Revenue we have um so essentially you're looking at property taxes which are uh there's legislated cap of 2% increase on the tax Li uh and there are several exceptions uh one of which we'll speak about a little bit later there is state aid um which I'll also talk to you about later uh as everyone knows uh large cuts to state aid since 1718 till now um a little bit over s and a half million it was actually higher than that uh but this year uh there was an increase when we had anticipated a decrease so that was beneficial because we were in a pretty bad spot before that happened uh grants um this year uh or rather 2425 school year which is coming up in this budget is for uh there will no longer be any eser grants so the eser grants or grants related to covid um those grants are all going away so anything that was funded through S grants in the past uh would either need to be no longer utilized by the district or absorbed um into the general fund uh which is the budget that we're talking about right now and then Surplus so we'll talk about that more later it's very important here uh I have a couple of slides on that essentially it's what you end your last budget year with right and that's very important because that goes to two things it goes to refilling your 2% on reserved fund balance which uh last year we had to use 1% of that and that's kind of your emergency fund if something happens that's what get gets hit first if you run out of money in your budget um so refilling that and then excess Surplus which is directly utilized here and there's uh I'll show you there be a chart on it with a history of utilizing that the next year as a form of Revenue right so if you ended a year um without a balance or very low or a lower balance than uh the year before that use in terms of excess Surplus you're going to be short that amount of money in Revenue so basically you end the year you have we's say you have money in the bank and you're saying well I'm starting off the year with this amount of money so I can include that in my next budget now if that money's not there and you used it in the prior year budget you're starting off with less Revenue uh and then there's local Revenue um those are things like tuition um miscellaneous or there's not a lot of opportunity there um but you try to get creative to see if you can increase that so in terms of expenses um one of the biggest expenses is obviously Staffing um and then you have uh you want to make sure you're providing effective instruction program so supplies and support services for that uh you want to support District initiatives and we try to control uh expenses and we look at that line by line during the budget process uh you also want to explore shared services and other avenues for cost savings which is something since when I started in October we have started looking very closely at that uh so I talked about this a little bit before um the history of state A cuts and you'll see that we lost about seven a little over seven and a half million dollars in state aid uh which is roughly about 10% of our budget uh over that time period um and I don't think you can see it right now uh but if you look at that in terms of how much money we would have had uh if State a had remained flat um I believe it's around $35 million 39 was it 39 thank you I couldn't remember off top my head I appreciate it uh so obviously with some of the things we talk about with facilities and the cuts that have been made uh if we had received that $39 million that would have made it a lot easier to address some of our building envelope issues such as as rofes and other things that are going to be coming over the next few years that are going to need to be addressed so it does make a very big difference in terms of the financial stability of the district um and the ability to create uh balanced fiscally responsible bu budgets so what you'll see here and I talked about a little B before uh is the amount of fund utilization that has happened um and I went back about three years but you'll see that each year that budget require that amount of money in terms of Revenue to make that budget balance so you'll see it started in 20 20 uh 2122 uh about 2.9 Million was a little easier at that point because the district had a high fund balance that's coming out of covid there was a lot of fund 20 money which is your federal grants available uh to help offset some uh some of the different costs that were starting to be incurred due to the changes that occur due to covid in terms of how things are being taught you see it went up to 5.7 billion uh this current year we used 3.1 million so this is a combination of the excess Surplus that I mentioned before which is your ending balance and last year and this year a utilization of part your 2% unreserved fund balance this year you'll see we're proposed uh just under 2.8 million now the path towards Financial stability really includes first not using um the 2% on resered fund balance you want to enter a year with that money in your bank account um for any emergencies that might happen right um that is that extra buffer there so if something unexpected and probably very expensive happens during the year uh you don't run a deficit on your budget that's what that 2% is there for so if you're using that you're starting off you know behind already um so the next part that is part of this uh number is your excess Surplus and that is the balance that you're finishing the end of the year with so in this instance I believe the number of excess Surplus we ended 2223 with was about 2.1 million um if we hadn't had had to use the 1% fund balance unreserved fund balance in the year before uh it would have been higher because what happens is the first thing you do is you have to refill your 2% so we whatever that ending number was last year we refilled the 2% and then we were left with 2.1 million but you'll see uh for the start of this budget the last year we used 3.1 million so obviously they we're starting with less Revenue less money in the bank at the beginning of of uh next school year and that's why it's so important not only when you the budget process is really a three-year process you should be looking at three years at basically every single moment you're looking ahead right to see you know what are you anticipating in the future you're looking at today and trying to manage your current balance uh with the mindset towards two things one you need to be able to support the budget that you're creating for the next year with revenue and two The Next Step Factor no longer relying on the 2% and trying to lower that excess Surplus is to try to get money in your capital reserve or your maintenance Reserve right so capital reserve is very important uh because that's where you're going to pull money for projects like a roof um if we have a roof that needs to be replaced you would pull that from capital reserve right so if you're always utilizing all of your money to refill your 2% and to fund your next budget you're never putting any money in the capital reserve and that's where you you need that money to do projects you'll see later on there are some small projects this next year that I believe are safety related um that we should address so we will be pulling money out of capital reserve to do so but that's just something to keep in mind when you're looking at a budget and then the other year you're looking at obviously is the year being audited on and that's important because that feeds into the budget you're creating with that ending balance so this is a little bit of an overview of our fund balance uh the June 2023 so that first number you'll see there um hopefully everyone can see it okay uh is that $2.1 million that I spoke about so that's the excess Surplus amount um that we the essentially the balance we hand last year with after we refilled our 2% uh unreserved balance so that number uh is part of what makes up that 2.7 million that I spoke about in terms of the money we're utilizing to create next year's bud budget as Revenue you'll see that 899,000 that was actually used in this year's budget as Revenue so that both of those funds are gone so that's one's been used for next year one was already used this year you'll see capital reserve at 2.5 million that's as of June uh 2023 though that doesn't account for the money that got pulled out for projects right so there money that got pulled out some of those projects are completed you'll see um if you're at meetings or have been maybe following the agendas uh there's a project at Walnut Ridge to address a keos issue so money was pulled out for that um there is an issue with a fire pump right so money is pulled out for that um and then SDA window Windows projects now some of that money will go back in um by that 2.5 is before it came out so when everything is said and done yeah that's you ended with money came out and know is a lot money's going to go back in but at the same time we're going to pull other money out so when it's all said and done next year I project we have about $730,000 in our capital reserve so that's not a great number for the size of a district and I'll get a little bit more into detail because I know it was a lot of movement but that's when I kind of say all three years are connected at the same time uh maintenance Reserve is almost nothing we have about 2,400 hours in it um year end encumbrances those are just POS that are encumbered that are rolled forward um and then designated for subsequent years expenditures that was already um utilized in the current year so if you add that 2.2 and that just under 900,000 that'll get you to that 3.1 I mentioned uh I'll go back on that slide and that was used as Revenue to create this budget um unassigned fund balance that's that 2% that I mentioned uh so for next year's budget we're using the 2.1 and then we're using I think it's about a little under half a percent of our 2% fund balance in order to fund the 2425 school year budget so that just kind of I wanted to provide a little bit of an overview again I did talk about this at the preliminary uh budget presentation but I know there's a lot of numbers and it's not exactly intuitive because you're always waiting to have the prior audited before you have these numbers so it doesn't affect the next year it affects the year after that just due to the timing of when your audit happens so for example uh 2023 is audit will is affecting the 2024 2025 budget and not the 2023 2024 budget which is where we are right now so some of the key impacts um talked a lot about it already fund balance and excess Surplus um it's a huge pretty big part of our um Revenue here that we use from one year to the next um we started out with about $930,000 less and that was that $3.1 Million number um versus the 2.1 million uh that I showed on the previous slide uh we have some projected increases that I went this year just and again these aren't all the increases these are just the larger increases just to give you an idea of some of the increases things uh that are occurring that you don't necessarily have a lot of control over right um so the 7.6% that's approximately an increase of $831,000 uh so the one thing I want to be clear about with that is that's just not the health benefits expense line that's the health benefits expense line and every other account that falls under 110 291 so that's a series of accounts they all have to do with employee benefits so it's things like Social Security um pension um health benefits is a is a big portion of it uh and then also um liability insurance right so it's not just health benefits so when you see that 7.6% increase that's all those accounts together compared to last year right whereas the health benefit increase is actually higher than that uh Transportation that's about a 9% increase so that's about $650,000 um so when I'm telling you these numbers just kind of think back to the Revenue slides I mentioned before and some of those um limitations we have in terms of Revenue right District liability insurance um 10% was uh it it may be higher than that um so I have 10% for I think four of our insurance lines and about 133% for for one of the larger lines but that is about an increase of $150,000 um liability insurance right now fluctuates quite a bit um and in terms of cost it really depends on the number of claims um so we're part of safe which is basically a large group of school districts uh in this region of New Jersey uh we pull all of our risk together to try to save money uh to that insurance together as opposed to going out for insurance by ourselves which would be more expensive um energy uh projecting about 2.6% increase that's based off we're looking at last year the year before and this year that's about $125,000 uh and then salaries uh that's about an increase of $1.5 million or 3.9% so that would include um any contractual increases any step movement and any horizontal movement um so there's a lot that goes into these numbers I'm just trying to make them um just trying to show that we have so many increases in costs um then we have these losses in Revenue uh it makes it a very difficult budget to create um but I just want people to understand that there are a lot of increases in costs and we don't have as much revenue as we as we previously did due to Cate Cuts obviously part of that is the cost of supplies that we order you know day-to-day this year when compared to last year are more expensive right um I'm sure we've all seen that across the board and I know I see it when I go to the grocery store I'm I'm sure we we're seeing it in our day-to-day lives um it's it's unfortunate um but it it's kind of the reality that we're in right now um things are more expensive so something that maybe we spent you know $20 on before might be like 25 or $30 now and then just extrapolate that out for you our enrollment and our staff it adds up quickly um but with that being said we're always looking for ways to save money as well and I'll talk about a little bit on another slide and then just kind of to roll this all together um and I know I'm spent a lot of time on this slide but I think there's a lot of information um and a lot of important aspects to kind of discuss so with all those increases in expenses uh I did mention we're our tax will be capped at 2% so that's a $910,000 increase so you're looking at a lot of money increased cost but not a lot of ability to increase Revenue uh so one of those adjustments is a health benefit cost adjustment uh essentially it's an adjustment that allows the district to go over the 2% tax L be cap for an increase in projected health care costs that exceeds 2% of the PRI Year's health care costs um there's been a I've only seen you this happen when you have your Healthcare cost going up sorry a certain amount um this year our health care costs started out with uh so essentially we have a broker that deals with health benefits we're in the state health benefits plan the state health benefits plan doesn't release its rates until July or August so what our broker does is they review the information that's out there they review the market um and they also review reports that are essentially provided by Consultants that work for the state right so their initial letter to me said 10% increase and health benefits 4% and dental right um then when I was at on leave I got a phone call after the budget was already submitted there might be more of a 12% increase in health benefits and that's based off of a report that essentially says that expect a double digit increases for the state health benefits plan um there are thing there's not a lot of control with that when you the say health benefits plan you don't have the ability to negotiate that number is whatever that number is and essentially that's all the schools that are in that plan ping the risk of Health expenses together right uh and it varies from year to year but obviously I think we all have seen health care costs have been going up um so again it started with a 10% increase now saying more likely 12% increase um but unless you leave that plan and go to market and and see what you can find um that's where you are uh so essentially it's a to help the district absorb some of those C increases in health uh health benefit costs um and the proposed Revenue uh that will be allowed under this adjustment will be about $337,000 uh and you know from time to time we will test the market uh and I plan to do so um but you also don't know what the market will bring either because that will depend on the district's experience rate which is essentially the rate at which um benefits are being utilized and the expenses associated with that uh so essentially private insurers will look at that and then they'll say what they would offer to us in terms of costs of those benefits based off of that experience rate uh so we're not able to pull that uh until the summer uh but again it would be a very big change and it's not something we would do unless it financially made sense so that's this is that Revenue breakdown I had spoke about a little bit earlier uh so you'll see here about 68% of our revenue is the local tax levy um it used to be a smaller percentage because we used to receive a lot more state aid uh we're down to about 25% of our Revenue being state aid um and then it's kind of hard to see and I kind of talked about a little bit earlier those other areas of the P are a lot smaller um so the next biggest area is our budgeted fund balance so that would be that excess Surplus uh that I talked about earlier uh then that would also be the uh portion of our unreserved fund balance was that 2% that I talked about earlier so you'll see that's about 4% of our Revenue um so for example if we ended the year on zero we would be missing 4% of our Revenue uh in the next budget uh which would mean that unless you're able to find that 4% of Revenue somewhere else which is difficult to do since there there limited ways for a district to get Revenue uh you would have to cut that amount so essentially 4% expenses so those other small areas very small what uh they're all uh about 1% so it's extraordinary Aid um and then also uh withdrawal from capital reserve which I mentioned earlier the importance of capital reserve and I believe it's probably local revenues uh at the bottom there uh which should be Bank interest um any tuitions that we rece receive which is basically preschool tuition here uh one of the things that I did when I started uh was I negotiated our bank interest it was 0.15% um it's up to 4.85% um so this year I think we're on track for probably around a half a million dollars of uh Revenue that we didn't have um which is good U because without that half a million dollars in Revenue our balance would be a lot lower um and we need to try to manage that balance going into the next year's budget um so we can have adequate Revenue uh to avoid creating what I call essentially a revenue Cliff right so if your numbers of ex's Surplus are to Pi and then one year you don't end with it you're going to go off a cliff and that means lots of cuts and expenses um which as I think everyone knows um there have already been a lot of cuts here um last year or so going from 2324 and I think it's a little bit later in the budget 2223 to 2324 uh there's about 52 staff that were cut um so it's very difficult situation to be in um obviously it's not not good for the staff not good for morale and it's not good for the students so we obviously want to try to avoid that sort of Revenue Cliff um and try to slowly bringing that amount down so if there is a year where we don't end with it uh it'll be less in Cuts but also it be less likely that we won't be able to end a year with at least that amount because the lower the number is the more easily you'll be able to end a year with that balance uh but you can't do it all at once it has to be fiscally stable and uh and gradual uh so as part of next year I did budget um interest Revenue um so that's gonna depend completely on what the FED does um the Federal Reserve in terms of rates and interest um there's different differing opinions out there right now I I think they're definitely going to cut rates that that's that's what I've been hearing I think they pull back from that a little bit right now uh but I think there's still will be Cuts it's just a matter of of when and and by how much right so on the flip side if I were to over budget a revenue that's the same thing as me over budgeting an expense right so if I budget the revenue don't get the revenue that can also lead to a deficit in our budget right um so I always like this slide um it just provides like kind of a top level breakdown of where our expenses are going right so the thing you always want to see is you want to see instruction being where most of the expenses are going right so you got instruction yeah employee benefits which is again going directly to instruction yeah transportation directly to the student you want as many costs in your District as possible to go directly to the student because that's why we're here to support the students and the staff who also support the students um facilities that makes a lot of sense we have six buildings we need to upkeep those buildings there are a number of things that we're going to have to be addressing in the next couple of years uh in terms of you know building envelope and infrastructure so to me you know this is my first year here uh in the district but the way that this Falls makes sense you want as much money as possible go to students and supporting students um and part of that is making sure they have an environment conducive to learning where they can show up to the school building each day and feel safe and comfortable uh so they can focus on learning and not on how they feel in the room that they're in right we don't even want them to think about that all right so student Support Services again directly supporting students you got Central service admin and it a lot of that goes directly supporting students too um they have special education tuition right there if you can't see it on the screen and then at the bottom is capital outlay so part of the reason that capital outlay is less this year uh is because our capital reserve is projected to be fairly low um for our size District uh so you really only want to pull out you be very careful about the money you pull out of reserves uh when you're starting to get to that point because if there is an emergency that's the first thing you're going to pull for from if it's if it's a capital emergency if there's an issue with a roof or something along those lines that's where you would go first um and just so everyone know I will also um be adding this presentation to the business office website uh this is an updated version the preliminary budget presentation is already up there um but I will also be including this we've been revamping the business office portion of the website to provide um more information and then also include uh some of the presentations that I've been doing Rec so when I go into the budget I gather information um from uh directors so for example for transportation that was a pretty big effort to try to see where we think our routes are going to be next year do we think people are going to renew uh and that's important because the only way you can renew a transportation contract is if they follow the CPI the Consumer Price Index so this year the renewal was 5.81% um so you have to try to anticipate because the vendors won't really tell you at this point who will renew and who will not right and you got to assume that if they're not going to renew at 5.81% it's because they're going to come in all they're GNA come in higher than that um and with Transportation there's only so many providers so essentially you're kind of at the mercy of what they come in at when you go out the bid right there's only so many Transportation companies out there and it's very Regional uh so essentially as part of this um budget uh I started out with a much higher number uh I felt comfortable cutting that amount out based off of looking at a number of years of where our transportation has been looking at some changes uh with a reduction and somewh out of District placements because there's Transportation tied with that um and then also looking at some opportunities to essentially um consolidate or share routes uh through our local uh transport Transportation uh Consortium um so I looked at the Social Security budgeted amount over the last few years what we are paying this year projected out this year uh and felt that I was comfortable cutting around that much uh from what we had budgeted previously in the prior year so this is an example of going back looking at Trends and essentially thinking that that line had a little bit too much budget in it uh in the prior years uh and being in a spot where I could take that out without essentially um creating risk for the district right um facilities cuts um so we had a proposed budget um because of the constraints in our budget right now there are a lot of things that will need to be done and do need to be done with the facilities um but unfortunately uh with the cuts in state aid um where our reserves are uh and the current Financial State of the district um those are things that I couldn't justify putting in the budget um because our main our main focus was maintaining staff right we want to M maintain staff um have that support for the students uh in order to ensure that they have the support they need to learn on a day-to-day basis uh there were some Cuts in technology as well based off of what was proposed um part of that um did end up happening based off of an application that we sent to the state for stabilization need so we probably saw that at the last meeting if you tuned in uh essentially uh the phones throughout the entire District are no longer supported um they're pretty old um and we're basically kind of told by the Ender that hey you need to replace these or they're not going to work soon and we can't be in that sort of situation uh so we apply for stabilization Aid to the state um to be completely honest we're hoping to get a lot more than we received uh because of some of those capital projects and issues that we have uh one of those things we applied for was for the high school fire alarm um we did not get a large sum of money we got about $44,000 um so between that and some savings we're able to find in the it budget uh we were able to uh have approved at the last meeting those phones um which will be uh replaced um this summer and that's important because not only is that important for operating of the district but it's also a security issue right we need to make sure that people throughout the buildings can communicate with each other um for security purposes as as well as day-to-day operations um so that number is uh what I talked about a little B before so we had to use about $2.8 million in excess Surplus uh which included 0.47% of our our fund balance because as you remember on that slide it was about 2,1 181,000 so to get to the two point just under 2 we had to use part of our our fund balance as Revenue uh that's the unreserved fund balance we had that increase in state aid um so before we got that increase uh we were very much in a situation where we were going to have to look at staff which is not where we wanted to be it's where no one wants to be um so while I have a lot of complaints to the state about the amount of stadum they have cut uh because it's disproportionately affected us here uh compared to other school dist s um this increase was very important because if it hadn't happened we would be talking cots of C of staff today so I can't see my number was it a million or 100,000 all the way to the bottom thank you thank you Warren I appreciate it 91 uh so those were different requests that have been made for staff different decisions we had to make based off of the least painful decisions in terms of trying to address class size um that were proposed but we weren't able to include in the budget they initially started in the budget uh but in order to avoid um cutting staff they were removed right um again ideally we would love to have smaller class sizes so I'm sure all the staff feels that way we feel that way um but we have to be in our reality and our reality is right now uh being able to create a budget where we didn't have to cut farther staff is a win so so these are some of the actions taking to contain just cost um so we do use Cooperative purchasing so essentially what that is um instead of us going out the bid and so vendor oh just just bur Township going out to bid for something individually um there'll be another group like say at data uh or um yes NJ which is a cooperative for NJ schools and purchasing they'll say hey we're going to go out the bid and we represent all these schools that are members and vendors are a lot more interested right so there's a lot more competition involved uh which generally leads to better prices not always but generally and those instances where you know there isn't a better price that's when we will go out the bid and see if we can do better um we purchase our electricity and natural gas through Asus um we have e- rate reimbursements for internet and it so essentially for our internet as an example we pay a certain amount but then we get a percentage back as part of the E rate program um and that percentage actually just went up because our free reduced lunch percentage went up I believe it went up an additional 10% so I think it's at 60% now do you remember 20 around 20 no no no uh the E rate reimburse e rate 60 yes yeah it went from 50 to 60% so that's money back for the district um you put the money out first but then then you get it back which is a savings uh and this year certain areas I what I did was I accounted for the fact we're going to get it back so it's part of the cost is budgeted but that means that later on we'll get the money back and then that'll offset some other areas in the budget where I normally would have budgeted it uh cooperate purchasing for property insurance workers conversation talked about that earlier we're in safe so that is essentially a group of school districts taking all our risk and going to vendors together as opposed to by ourselves that that gets US savings um shared services with the township of Vernon so we've been having meetings uh to see where we can have savings and work together with the town uh very excited about that and I think there's opportunities there and uh that's something that we're working very closely with the town uh to put into place uh and then we have semi Federal reur program so essentially we receive Revenue U from the federal government for any health services um that would go to a student that would otherwise go uh to Medicaid because we're providing the services rather than go going to a p a private provider so uh the tax levy is being increased uh if this is approved a little over uh 1.2 million dollar um so you'll see the 23 24 which is our current year right there uh the top number is our general fund so that is the day-to-day operating fund of the district the bottom number is The Debt Service so that is from essentially those the payments in terms of principal interest due on the bonds from the last time the district went out for referendum uh so at the point when that referendum was voted yes the the payment schedule was put in place and then we it's collected each year until the bond is paid off so that's that's how that works it's separate from the general fund um so an important part of our of the impact of taxes is the town's ratables so ratables are essentially the total tax base for the township as ratables grow in value they help reduce the impact of any tax increase on an individual taxpayer um so you'll see that the ratables went up quite a bit from 23 to 24 um so they went up about just under 10% and you'll see right here so you see the tax levy information at the top there so that 2.74 one% is what our tax levy was increased so that's not the tax impact that's what the tax levy was increased by so that would be the 2% and then the extra $337,000 is what makes up to0 741 per. um so the average assess home value which I got from the town is about $289,000 so I want to talk a little bit more about this on the right because ratables went up significantly uh however based off of what's on the next slide uh it my understanding is that a lot of people in town have been reassessed right so it makes an Apples to Apples comparison a little bit more difficult I talked about this a little bit at my previous uh at the previous presentation I tried to include a little bit more information um in this presentation in order to make it easier for people to basically calculate what the tax impact would be on an individual basis right um so uh let's see uh so this slide I mean it's just a couple slight changes uh so the first thing you'll see at the top is 1358 per. so that is the school's portion of the tax impact so essentially that number times your assessed value would be the school's portion and this is an estimate the school's portion of your taxes bless you um last year you'll see the average assess value was just over 262,000 so when I see you go from 262 to 289 uh to me that means that there's a reassessment uh not if not on everyone on at least a decent number of people in town uh so again it's hard to do the Apples to Apples comparison but I wanted to include the schools tax rate up there so you could see what the schools impact is and then on the next slide I have some additional information too so for example if you didn't have a reassessment and your value last year and this year are the same then your taxes will go down if your ratables changed it's going to depend on how your rateable changed essentially from La uh from last year to this year uh so again there's that number again the 1. 358 per um and then I spoke uh with my kind of parts of the Town um right now the estimated uh tax rate for August 2024 again this is an estimate is 2.43 3% now that includes the county county library County Open Space School District and town uh and again similar to uh the other number you could multiply that by your SS homeone value uh and that's how you could have an estimated uh essentially estimate what your tax impact would be uh this is just an article I had it the last one as well uh noting where we are in terms of the county in terms of our average property taxes so it Compares it in Sussex and then also the average New Jersey house had a property tax of about 900 hours in New Jersey I talked a little bit earlier about some of the projects that I felt were uh important uh enough to pull money out of a cap Reserve that already is you know not where I feel is financially stable right um so the first thing is uh the stairs and ramp at the cosmetology building at the high school um it's settled quite a bit um the railings are not in good shape the concrete's not in good shape uh for me that's a safety concern uh so we've pulled some money out to address that um similar at Cedar Mountain Primary School there is uh stairs the parking lot I don't know if anyone has noticed it it's taped off right uh again bad shape that needs to be replaced uh near that towards the other end of the parking lot you'll see a wooden retaining wall um that is bulging right now right so that obviously is not a good situation we want to remediate that uh we have the SDA window project so essentially with that project the district applied for sdaa funds so uh with that project we' get um 40% back from the state right um another so districtwide I just have a note down here we're looking at an energy savings Improvement plan the hope with this and we're in the early phases of it is that it might provide us a bit of an alternate route to addressing some of our um facility issues right um so the way that works and I'll do just a quick summary is they look at your entire District they do an energy audit they look to see you know what Energy savings could you obtain through you know installing certain things it could include solar panels it could include you know changes to your boilers things like that and then they calculate how much that savings would be each year projected in your budget including you know they calculate increase of what energy expenses might be moving into the future so instead of budgeting for the energy costs in those budgets you a budget for the bond to pay for that and when they calculate that amount based off the savings There's an opportunity to do other capital projects so my hope and again very early not sure if it it's going to be possible because we still have to do audit will be that maybe we can address a roof through that without having to again our capital reserve is low we couldn't really do a roof for that amount right now so just an alternative way to try to get some of those projects done uh but it'll entirely depend on the results of the energy audit um so I'm going to move a little bit into the separate proposal now um so tonight there's a resolution on on uh which if approved by the board essentially what it does is allow us to move forward to ask you the public in November um you know yes or no uh to our questions which I'll review in a couple of slides so it basically says these are some things that we think would be very beneficial for the district and we're asking you would you support funding these these items um so if it does pass it would allow us to address some of those losses mentioned before that's the 52 and a half full-time positions uh you can see the largest cut there was the teachers right 35 teachers that's that's a lot of teachers to lose um and we we we lost staff across the board but I just wanted to point that out because obviously that number stands out we lost in CST and counseling support staff maintenance and custodial and it uh and we lost four administrative positions so some of the benefits to that and um I don't know Russy you want to jump in on this portion because it's a little bit out my talked about this before with the with losing the 52.5 staff hiring more teachers in K12 students to in K12 schools to enhance student learning and boost State uh test scores we would like to reduce class sizes to allow for more personalized attention of instruction for each student um personalized instruction and a conducive learning environment lead to better understanding and retention of material um additional teachers will provide opportunities for targeted interventions and allow for multi-tiered systems of support which enhance student learning we talked about that extensively when Anova mat presented at the last meeting um and instructional coaching to go along with that to support teachers an effective pedological approach enhancing the instruction so these are out of the uh 52.5 uh positions we're looking to bring back I believe uh 18 18 staff members in our in our second in our second proposal or second question or yeah so that wouldn't get back all the cuts that had occurred due to Cuts in state aid but it would it would get back a portion of that uh which would provide you know benefits to the you heard some parents at the previous board meetings talking about Sim the class sizes in different grade levels we'd like to address that through this proposal as well didn't show up quite as large as I wanted to on the screen but uh essentially uh we went through and looked at at the cost per p uh for 23 24 um for every school district uh in the county uh we have a no well we have a number of years let sit there uh but can you a way to get that on there is there way to zoom in by no I let me see I have to click off the slides to move this right here oh there you go quick hit the uh click for me good no I know but when you go to move again I want to make sure all right then go back okay I want to make sure we're F on um so you'll see uh is for the 23 24 proposed budget um so because this is always year behind right because it's from userfriendly budgets um and again we're going to post it all online um you'll see we're at $1,561 per student and that's the total budgetary comparative per people cost right so you can see all these districts um and New Jersey as a school district um you're required to put your userfriendly budget up so if anyone wants to go to these sites they can see their userfriendly budgets it should be on every school district website uh we have ours up for a number of years um and then past those years I included a link to the State website which has an archive that goes back more years than that so you can view those either through the state uh NJ dooe or on the individual websit you should be able to find them so it just kind of shows you kind of what we're spending per people um and again a lot of this is directly related to cuts and state aid because if you lose Revenue obviously have to cut expenses uh we were hit pretty hard um there are a couple other schools in the county that are also hit pretty hard with C Cuts uh but we're definitely up near the top um so uh I'm sure you've probably seen this already before but I talking about the SE proposal obviously I want to actually show you what the question would be um so this is a breakdown um Mr Roger spoke about a little bit earlier 16 teachers to reduce class size and support students through uh prek through uh 12 um so and just I not I might mention on another slide but for example this includes the cost of a staff member so it's not just their salary it would include their benefits as well um because obviously you need you need a budget for that too um increase security Staffing and then um restore additional cing staff to uh support student mental health so you'll notice that those areas are directly correlated with the cuts that were made to the cutom state aid again it's not going to make the district whole by any means um but it would obviously be beneficial to be able to bring some of those staff back um the question two and the reason we separated it into two questions uh was if you put it all in one question uh then you know it may seem like someone is May one thing in there right and you don't want to make them feel pressured into voting yes or two questions if they or one question if it has only one thing they want right we're trying to be transparent with this uh we know that busing is um a concern that's come up a number of times um and then we also have a skilled maintenance worker in there you'll notice back on that slide uh we we lost codo and maintenance workers and grounds workers uh during the cuts and again um that's salary and benefits not just salary but in this instance you could vote either way for either question as opposed to just only having one question to vote on um so this is the estimated tax impact um and this is a little bit more clearcut because I'm not comparing it to a prior here uh I'm comparing it to what the increase would be if both questions passed right I did it by uh 100,000 so basically for every 100,000 it's about a $59 impact uh and I will include it I keep mentioning but it will I'll put it online um so just a little bit to a little bit farther into those numbers right um because these are some questions that I I felt might come up um so earlier I mentioned what the estimated um impact percentage wise of just the budget would be uh so I felt that it would make sense to also include that for what the separate proposal would be uh so it would be uh 0.59% uh impact on assess value um so if you were to add the budget right and the separate proposal estimated rates it would be uh 1.41 7% uh for the total impact of the budget and the separate proposal if both questions passed and I'm sure you're probably tired of hear me talk but that's the end of my presentation for tonight it will be posted um online I do hope that you found this useful and um thank you everyone for your time thank you thank you Vicky thank you so much couple of things and then we'll have questions from the public thank you Mr slam appreciate it item G do we approval of the minutes can I have a motion to approve the minutes move move by Mrs pet miss pet second second by Mr Sager roll call please Mr smag yes Mr cantino yes these are the minutes not from the last meeting where I wasn't here so I can vote on them right that's correct okay yes Mr Krauss yes I'm stain we noted miss pet yes Dr Ross yes Mr Sweeny yes Mr zuran just stepped out okay I am not because of the length of the meeting tonight I don't have anything to report other than the vacancy that we we have um motion carries motion carries I was right so I am I I'm going to open up the meeting to the public for agenda items only and students uh anything that students would like to talk about so um presume that the budget will be oh it's the mayor you have the floor still on yes it is so specific to the budg it can be anything on the agenda sorry it's not your budget hearing questions related to the budget before you Che um I'm afraid that Mr Cales is correct thank you Warren I appreciate it so anybody have any questions about the budget meeting is open to the public it was Warren Cal live in the Williamsville uh State section of Vernon 42 year resident here town just a nocom uh relative to the second question identified 16 teachers to reduce class size one and a half $1.5 million and was there an average cost per teacher and average cost benefits that adds up to that and you have any more specifics as to what grade levels would be targeted and that we have usually at this time when we're doing the plans for next year we have an idea where those grade levels are but we like to make sure since it's being voted on later we want we want to make sure it makes the biggest impact there are certain grade levels right now that we're concerned about we did figure out that amount on a certain salary and uh he's going through the spreadsheet right now to look for the formula where we took a certain salary and a certain benefits P package that that to do that time 16 so you're looking like maybe a step at the beginning step or is it a couple steps up on the salary guide that you're looking I believe if you divide that by 16 or we somewhere in the 80 I this has been a while somewhere around the 86,000 Mark or so so with benefits and a salary it's it's probably the first couple steps and a a certain type of benefit but we'll get once he gets the spreadsheet we'll be a pull that information up for you yeah I I'll find it for you it is it's family that would say apply then to the additional counseling sta how many sta persons are and 191,000 that would include XML one full-time position with Benefits two or the same question would apply it's got the spreadsheet open so El uh so it's uh 95967 uh total and U I have to find the um the F the projected family uh benefits for next year I it's on a separate sheet I do have a a question still relative to the second question we talked about tax impact uh Mr lamb uh you noticed uh when you listed the rates on the assess value of the homes the different amounts and projecting that the taxes over one tax here uh my understanding that if the second question is passed in November that money becomes available to you you start hiring as a January and the the tax liability would occur in the first 6 months of 2025 this is according to the county office that they provided that so the numbers that you're showing here for instance on a $400,000 home close to what Minds assess that so instead of$ 23591 I'd be looking at a $471 tax increase for that six-month period that's in addition to the impact of the the school budget as well uh so it would hit in the 2520 sorry 2025 calendar year to Neil Kramer I had asked about I have it on my phone the answer he gave is that your a4f is for your regular budget that you if uh that starts July 1 and their next year split years this one here he's saying that uh the tax certificate whatever that form is I might don't know the number of that but that would be from January 1 of 2025 to June 30 of 2025 so it would be the 2025 my speaking of the Town my understandings be the 2025 year in total but what you're alluding to which what I think you're tax impact would be that first six months with a t.3 million I not clear on that based off of their collection schedule based off talking to the town uh because of when the vote would be versus when those taxes would be collected and when people in town will be notified but it would be over the 2025 calendar year for the town and not the normal split it would be which would be not the normal4 month and six months but this would be all in one year but I accounted for that in those numbers so instead of dividing it by two the impact by two like I normally went for a regular budget it it's the it's the one number for the whole year because it's all going to hit in one year as opposed to two years I believe that's what you're alluding to all I'm alluding to is that the impact will be will have the first six months uh the second six months of for the regular budget and then impacted by in that next six months in January to June you're going to have the full brunt of the second question added in to that the tax levy for the regular budget so I'm looking at that I could be experiencing anywhere from about uh $471 increase on my house alone just to support the the tax levy it's not how it's going to impact I just I just want to be clear I I accounted for that already so it would be the 235 would be the impact if you're saying you're close to 400,000 so you want I'm reading here that the uh the column that you have that in it says over one tax year November 202 2024 vot yes so that would be one tax year for the town not one tax year for us so one tax year for the town I've already accounted for the doubling that you're talking about so we wouldn't double it again it's already been doubl on that sheet but again the impact is going to be in that first six months of 2025 uh tax tax later than that based off of the collection schedules of the town but I'm working with them to find an answer to that question I have been talks to them about it already but because of when they send out their tax bills uh and when the votes occurring uh it may be later than than the first the first half but it would be as a total tax bill it would be the total 2025 tax bill and not the normal split between uh for example uh 2024 would be half the school year and then 2025 would be the other half this would all hit in 2025 but I have accounted for that in that number so if you're at $400,000 that $235 you wouldn't have to double it again because I've already doubled it okay it was it was half of that when it was split between two years then I doubled it so okay it would be uh as accurate and as transparent as possible what the impact will be okay thank you thank you Warren oh I have the uh the health benefits cost was about $ 440,000 for a family plan uh Mr Shell about $40,000 for a family plan okay thank you $40,000 for one family yep that's the cost of health benefit okay good evening Dorene Edwards I'm glad you said that because my question is has any of the faculty faculty um been involved in negotiations perhaps they could help share the pain and contribute more towards the health costs involved the answer is no and may I ask why we have gotten no response from Mr higgins's request you did ask and you got no response Mr Higgins did okay well Mr Higgin not is not on the board you guys are on the board yes I'm on the board I have a we have a contractual relationship with the vtea and the vtaa we committed to that relationship and we didn't ask well the only thing that ever is for certain is change so if we as taxpayers have to share in the pain I don't see why perhaps the teachers if you want to get more teachers on a board maybe they should be sharing the pain as as well um I remember back in the day when I was working I used to get annoyed which I wish I could say the same thing now when I worked in my husband worked and I had to put my claims medical claims through my company get the results copy everything and send it to his company boy oh boy I wish those times were still now because Health Care is very expensive okay we know that but there's got to be a sharing of responsibility I feel and and uh so when you're saying $440,000 for a family yep that's outrageous how many how many places did you go out to bid for um healthc care we're under the State Health Benefit Plan uh do we have to be uh we do not have to be okay uh but we have to wait till our experience rate is available what be over the summer and then you could go out the market and see what could be available but then in decision at that point would be based solely off of what so it's always a catchup game could never really get a good handle on it because if he would have did it last June then maybe would have been a better position this year when for example when the district went into the state health benefits plan um there was savings associated with that right uh but the market changes uh then you have to wait a certain amount of time to to get your experience when you're see health benefits plan and you need that experience rate in order to go out to bid and I just want to add a little bit information for your other question so there's something called chapter 78 and chapter 44 uh which is law in New Jersey which basically breaks down how staff members contribute to the health benefits right so chapter 78 uh originally uh was put into La I believe when Governor Christie was in office um and there was four tiers everyone's on tier four now um but essentially what that did was there was a scale and it's available online if you want look at it um that essentially shows someone's salary and then what percentage they should be paying based off of what plan they're a part of and that was a percentage of the premium of a plan right uh more recently chapter 44 uh came out I think that came out in I think it was 2020 but when the fact in 2021 it was right around covid um so that introduced a new typos plan uh New Jersey Health uh New Jersey Educators plan and the Garden State plan so that changed things a little bit and that was for the better um for the worse so it depends on your out your overal census of where your salaries are in a district so some districts benefited and some some did not uh but at this point uh based off speaking with the broker uh Vernon has has benefited but honestly either way it was a law we would have had to comply with it either way uh but essentially what it did was offer these two new plans where it calculated the um contributions differently so it's still based off of someone's salary uh and what plan they're in but the percentage is different and instead of it being a percentage of the plan premium it's a percentage of that person's salary and that's what they contribute now the idea behind this is that this plan is the premium is cheaper so between the cheaper premium um there's a savings for the staff members but the cheaper premium combined with the contributions there is the idea is that that would be a savings for staff uh and taxpayers right so is there um legally a plan that you have to offer to the teachers can you you offer them a lesser plan and still contribute the same amount that you negotiated but you have a lesser plan in place meaning less costs to the township and the taxpayers so we have to offer the New Jersey Educators plan and the Garden State Plan um through chapter 44 well I have to look at up and see what that's all about anyone uh I forgot the year now but anyone before um might have been 2020 uh could be in the chapter 78 plans which had higher um contributions uh but also higher premiums um and if you if you were on a plan then you were grandfathered in right unless you switch districts in which case you had a default the Educators or garden C plan the other thing I was interested in in the liability insurance and you said you're with a with a bunch of the schools how do you decipher which is the best plan to get in what what say you if we get in with another say there's 10 schools I don't know how many you participate in that but 10 schools and five of them have lousy track records how do you decipher which is the best way to go do you deep dive and say okay maybe it's not a good idea that maybe we should be on our own or um you follow what I'm saying yeah so um I'm not sure the exact number but it's more it's definitely more than 10 10 schools in safe um it's a pretty wellknown um group in New Jersey for insurance um this isn't the first district I've been in that has had safe but essentially it's run it's basically its own fund right uh and it's run by uh an insurance broker and they assess risk and they turn around and they say what do we think based off claims experience in the market uh we're going to need to charge for the next year in order for us so having said that so and we also have our own insurance uh we have an insurance broker tied to that that offers us advice in terms of whether they think there would be savings um from what I've seen you know based on my experience I've only been in one one District I think that went out by itself um is very expensive so uh it also is going to depend on your claim experience though just like health benefits it g to completely depend on your claim experience and what type of insurance it is um some insurances are a lot more expensive than others well having said that having you said that now we had some situations where it was brought up well can't I'm sure we have insurance some of the misguided things that were done in our in in our school SCH board in our towns where we lost money or they didn't keep Good Records or whatever and we said don't we have liability insurance is that a negative now being part of that that you don't want to go ahead and recoup some of the money that way so the there um I think you're you're talking about the friends of Cl there was no money uh lost um that's not the friends of Cl show so it wasn't like there was money lost or miss you know in that way um will it prevent you from putting in a claim I mean are there you know is there some kind of Unwritten quoted between the schools saying listen if it's this or below we're not going to do that we're not going to put in a claim we were put in a claim for for for example not directly related but um we had our sign headit right what sign well sign in front of I think it was so Cedar Mountain the sign there was an accident sign got hit um we put the claim in because we want to repair it and we want to get reimbursed for it another example might be like um at the high school there is water coming through Windows right yeah um and it's a process that we all see in our day-to-day lives where sometimes they'll give you the full amount and other times it costs more to to fix it than they'll reimburse you but right you try to fight that fight that's why you figure you know figure what you're GNA do all right I had some more but I'll let somebody else go and and figure that but I I am blown away at $40,000 uh family for health that's that's crazy he very expensive yeah because that's the to well I think we have to do something about that I think I would like to see the board do a deep dive I know you said you have you know uh contractual things but maybe going forward anybody coming on board you start changing that and there always like well as I said I've said this before many times oh Vernon we have to pay the most because we want the best well unfortunately that's tied in now to the health benefits also plus our scores are crappy so I I don't know where to go with that but thank you Mr slam I was he about spending the most our median salary is probably right in the in the in the middle of the pack or in the lower half of medium salaries in therea well that's not what everybody was saying years ago oh we got it no years ago years ago when other people were on the board it was different but now FS I hope so I really hope so and again I I just uh want to tell the board members a few of your you know question things Deep dive I appreciate that thank you thank you hi Bill Higgins I'm here as a resident not as a council member just want to make sure everybody's aware of that in terms of the presentation I've been going through this for 40 years and the ba you guys are well trained in giving some of the facts but not all the facts and some of them don't they're not your fault because the state tells you what to say in some cases so the cost per student on a $71 million budget is $27,000 per student not $220,000 you're told and you said it tonight that oh it's based on a different figure than the total budget it's based on the operating costs $71 million budget you're asking for it's 27,000 bucks a kid that's outrageous in terms of the uh salaries for the uh for the uh teachers in Vernon they are right around the middle now for one reason you just had uh 26 people take the quote sabatical the buyout the highest rated and highest paid people and that dropped that dropped the uh the cost per person in Susy County we're still pretty high but there's two districts in the county that are in the top five in the whole state High Point a walkill in top five in the whole state M Mr Higgins we let about 52.5 people go in positions last year and they were toward the lower end of the salary got that's then that's another point you let 52 people go you inappropriately hired 47 of them with the with the grant money that was supposed to last for three years so once again it's sematics we dropped 52 I'm saying you shouldn't hire those since I became superintendent I let 52.5 positions go which was one of the hardest things that I had to do my they were inappropriately hired we just we spent a year discussing how that happened somebody's going to take for reducing 52 whenever some of them should have been hired it's it's crazy and and on this uh the $40,000 cost health care cost per family so this chapter 78 everybody talking about was under the christe administration and it it it took five years to go and enacted and it meant that anybody making $100,000 or more paid 35% of their health care cost just like the average uh public or private worker was joined for 20 years before that and the union got livid they absolutely were crazy this board and not you people but the board in negotiations over a period of three years after 78 was was in force fully in forc as part of the negotiations started giving the teachers union back some of that money so Mr slam do you know how much the percentage is that comes out of a teachers paycheck making $100,000 now how much for healthcare uh it's still based off of chapter 78 and chapter 44 and it would depend on what plan they're on and what they're what plan they're on essentially so you can't say what the percentage is not no not well I knew it was 35% of somebody 100,000 or more that's a that's a fact and I know that it was reduced by a rebate so if somebody today we making 100,000 what percentage are they paying for healthcare so it's still the 35% but at the end of the year there's a a payment a refund there's a re still the 35 how much a re I believe contractually I believe it's 10% 10 per. okay so that's that's an answer instead of just saying they're paying 25% when it was 35 this board the predecessors to this board decided very nicely we're going to give you 10% back ah the average person still paying the money but we're going to give you 10% back what you were paying and that's just contrary to uh common sense and and and nobody wants to say that that's one of the holes in the budget and it happens to be true I just said it that's a lot of money 10% of a $40,000 family plan is $4,000 per teacher a lot of money another way that uh money money can be reduced the superintendent in the contract has the right to either Grant extra money for those teachers who have gotten Exel credits Beyond graduate school as part of their income so you can see people that are employed have Masters plus 15 Masters plus 30 ba plus 10 those extra credits are not college graduate credits they're training credits from outside sources such as the Excel program and it's a pro prodor of the superintendent to Grant extra money to those people so if you're looking to save some money that's that's your prerogative to to do that it's right in the contract those away so you're really asking for the public not only for a 2.74% increase and trying to say that it's less than 2.74 due to the reassessment of the houses it's 2.74 and then you really have enough nerve to put a budget question on the ballot I just want Mr Rogers on a personal BAS I like you I really do yeah I like seeing at the game stuff but you inherited some bad stuff here over the last two years this one's on you this is your budget we got a budget cut by 10% I'm trying to bring 3% of that back not all 10% you got a budget cut at 10% when the state aid that we lost you just got a million one on state a we lost 7.5 since 2016 before that we were down there's another question you lost $7 million over the course of six years and you're telling me it was 30 9 million how do 7 million State a the state aid in 2016 was $75 million more than our state aid is this year so if you received that every year and it had stayed flat we would have received 39 million more dollars if the state had stayed flat from that year moving forward and that's money they're taking away from the local taxpayers that that they sent to the state that they would send the Vernon that they're not sending the Vernon anymore they're sending once again you're not given a good representation you lost 9.9 million over six years and you got in one case you got 4.7 million on an extra stien during covid so all that Co money more that's a one- Time cost more yeah and more than made up for the 9 million that you lost so you're you're turning 7 million into 39 and trying to say hey taxpayer give us more money your budget keeps going up every year your personel costs are 3.9% higher so really what it comes down to I me we could stand up here all day but what it comes down to is this board everyone on this board has to stand up and and think of yourself as a taxpayer and and what you're getting for your money you're not sitting up there and saying I'm just going to go along with it which is the way it's been going along lately speak up we have one gentleman over here who does speak up Express his opinion it is different from everybody else and most of you just say nothing it really comes down to you on this vote and it comes down to you on the negotiations with the teachers union that's that's where the money is 80% of his budget is on Personnel costs and the people at the higher level don't care that much about the new people that are hired at 55,000 it's all about seniority so it's up to you please do your job and think of the taxpayers and force people to do a better job thank you anybody else good evening Carolyn incado from the susex side of Vernon thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight before I begin my comments tonight can I see a show of hands of uh which board of members have seen every line of this budget that the same budget that was sent to the county every single line is reviewed it and understand every single bit of it I so that's two I would just like to point out that that is operation and the board is in charge of policy so okay so what's confusing is they're voting on it tonight but they're not supposed to see it review it look at every single line because that is operations they don't create the budget that's my responsibility as a school business administrator to create the budget I'm just confused them so how do you expect them to have an intelligent vote I'm missing this I'm just totally confused how how do these people before us how are they supposed to vote on this enormous budget with this very large tax increase without having a working understanding of every line it it it doesn't feel like a hard question I don't think that looking at 300 to 400 lines is something that would happen at the board level it happens at my I present that information to them but they're voting on it something isn't right here no no um this is the practice in every school district can we can we just have one person talk when you get to the microphone you can talk I didn't mean to dwell on this question because I didn't think it was going to be a tough question so I'm going to keep going but we Now understand that they really haven't seen the budget so before before I continue uh we we've established that we we haven't seen the budget so tonight you have an enormous task before you you will be asked to vote on a budget that will seriously impact this community for years to come Mr slam prevented a preliminary budget presentation on March 14th a few short weeks ago where he told us the approximate projected increase for health and other benefits is 7.6% remember that number 7.6% the employees of the Vernon Township School District are enrolled in the State insurance plan and a 7.6% increase aligns with the increase expected expected and budgeted for the township of Vernon employees as well same plan same percentage I obtain the actual budget sent to the county business administrator and Mr slam included a 14.2% increase 14.2 not 7.6 for a difference of 6.6% or nearly $510,000 he told us in the very same presentation that our budget was short 337,000 in change so it was necessary to exceed the 2% cap to cover health benefits well we now know that's not true it appears the health benefits line alone was inflated by nearly 510,000 on March 10th the public was told one thing and the county of business business administrator received something different on today's agenda page 199 which we don't have in the audience but is online please note that there remains 500 nearly 542,000 in unspent health benefits with two months only left in this year 542,000 on that line item two months left in the year this line item is a great way to hide money and Pad the budget so the Vernon Township School District will have hundreds of thousands of dollars of leftover money in the health benefits account for this year and they still plan to increase that figure by 14.2% I will add that when Mr slam spoke earlier he talked about that whole section called personal services employee benefits the leftover balance in that account as of tonight is 736 th000 I urge you to vote no for this bloated budget tonight five seats are open this fall and it's a clear attempt to take money from the taxpayers send this budget back to be reworked and revised if approve this budget tonight and vote Yes you will be approving an inflated budget and the taxpayers will not forget it in November lastly the $2 million ballot questions look especially bad in light of this inflated budget having just completed a forensic audit there's a check tonight on the check register for another 29,000 and so to pay the Auditors having just completed this forensic audit that revealed sloppy accounting wasteful spending and missing records your timing could not be worse when teenagers go out and waste the money you give them do you just keep giving them more money no you don't the generosity of the Vernon taxpayers is running out we want results and throwing more money at a declining District without taking significant steps to address the problems will not change a thing before I go I would like to point out that on page 153 of tonight's agenda there appears a monthly check to the flex school for $3,575 70 it's on the register every month we haven't forgotten about that one either we anxiously await the agenda that shows that this same student will attend esy extended school year this summer at the flex school last year's topics at esy were to have us how to survive a zombie apocalypse and how to start your own country it's outrageous that this is what we're paying for put a waste put a stop to wasteful spending it's time to make tough decisions just like Vernon families do every day in this community when they have to go without extras because they cannot afford it raising taxes by 2.74% will hurt this community that is already suffering I urge you to vote no tonight and thank you for your time so a couple of uh notes uh just want to repeat again the 2.7% number is the increase in tax ly right so that is the tax ly portion of the revenue from one year to the next right but that's not the impact in an individual right so if you look on the slides I did calculate that percentage so you can use that based off your assess value which will show you what your individual impact would be based off of the assess value of your home um so again that's the increase to the tax levy right as a percentage of what the tax levy is but not a percentage of total taxes in the town or so I just wanted to make sure that was clear um and uh in terms of health benefits I won't read the response um that are sent to your Oprah request uh Miss Coronado um but just a couple of notes uh the number that you're looking at is from a report uh in the state budget software as named revised budget which is what the budget at that snapshot in time is for um health benefits right so that snapshot is at of February 1 um so that number is from that moment in time when I did my presentation additional funds had to be transferred into that line and encumbered on the health benefits uh purchase order because that's how we uh pay our B of purchase orders in the district so the percentage that is in my presentation is 100% accurate to that moment in time right so the number you're looking at is from February 1 uh I went into more detail in the response to the to the op request um in terms of additional information that's important uh since that time right additional money had to be encumbered on that pay payroll uh sorry health benefits PO for us to get through the rest of this school year right um so I just want to make sure that information is there because it appears that the math uh that you were looking at in your initial response uh was based off of that February 1 number uh which is before transfers went in uh to be able to ensure we can pay health benefits for the full school year um see I think that's pretty much everything I wanted to mention I'm only reading figures from tonight's board secretaries report so you're saying it's not right the the board secretary's report is not accurate this evening uh that would be the board secretary support for March so that's a month behind it's still very current we only have a few months left and we have over 500,000 on the Healthline left there's no longer 500,000 in that whole category yeah so additional funds had to be encumbered on that PO in order to pay our bill for this whole year so more money had to be encumbered after I did a projection of what our cost would be for the rest of the year so there's not that is outdated because that projection was done in April to make sure that we could pay our bill through Jun Beed in April board secretary's report which would be approved in may have to wait for the month of April to complete before you can reconcile there's still a significant balance there's significant balance you'll see in April that there is not a significant balance I'm sorry Mr Knight you have the floor I'm sorry thank um hi good evening my name's Peter and I I live in Pleasant Valley Lakes uh some of you may know from previous uh talks that I've given that I have a a business background um most of my career has been as a consultant to large corporations and prior to that being a senior manager or executive in Fortune 500 companies my specialty was in budget and spend management so I have some credible experience in looking at budgets creating budgets and in forcing budgets through the spend um I I want to address a couple of things first a question that I know you won't be able to answer tonight is have we when was the last time if ever have we had an energy audit uh performed in our our schools because I noticed that we're using fluorescent lights and that's all technology very costly there are other alternatives so maybe off by a year or two but I believe it was around 2012 uh and that was the last time that an EIP was pursued by the district part of that EIP um is the solar field that's actually located down the hill in that direction and then that I believe there is also improvements of boilers at that time um so that is part of the reason that I want to uh pursue another Eep and have a new energy audit completed because as you mentioned France lighting that's often a big savings uh at not a large cost so once we go through that program that'll definitely be part of that equation that'll help us use those savings uh to potentially address other Capital issues uh or facilities issues in the district well Mr slam it as always you you know what you're talking about um my concern is that we're talking about what 12 years that the last um analysis was done in a corporation that just that that wouldn't take place um You probably do recall that I'm I have two major concerns about our Vernon School System one is in the creation and management of a budget and second uh which is probably a greater concern of mine is the quality of Education that our students are receiving and the best measure of of levels of quality I'm afraid is in our test scores um I've used pretty strong languages language in the past about my feelings about the outcome of these tests um what troubles me there doesn't seem to be well first of all as you know I come to many meetings not as frequently as I want but I think I think only once did I ever hear um discussed um policies that addressed uh real education issues um I question whether there's a cost benefit analysis that is performed whether you cut money or you spend additional money in a corporation or a large business you don't make decisions without understanding what that impact will do and of course of course the most important outcome is the education that our children receive um so I'd like to see some more discussion or comments concerning how the budget has impacted uh the quality of Education uh and again goes both ways how it is how a budget will improve or how a budget fall short and we can expect negative results um I think 30 years as a consultant um I could spend a week here just asking questions and a great question that was asked was um the point that you made and it came right out of my head yeah what what really what shocked me tonight was in a corporation or a business and I I was a business owner um with a successful International Company um when I approved or my partner and I approved or our CFO approved the budget we looked at every single line in a corporation I was responsible ultimately as one of the U stopke keepers of looking at thousands of lines not a few hundred but thousands of lines not that I analyze whether um it was appropriate but if something climed x% over what my expectation would be I wanted to know why and my the whether I reported to the Chief Financial Officer or the CEO I had to be able to say to that individual why are we spending 5% more 10% more um trust me I would not sign off on anything without knowing the details and what I heard tonight is Mr slam I I know that you're a trustworthy person and but to to give that single responsibility to Mr slam is not is not a realistic or practical I I do want to clarify based off of uh mado's question and then the followup of your question I think I was misinterpreting Mr Inc car's question um so I was interpreting it as analysis of every line um which obviously I'm doing the Deep dive in creating the lines uh but in terms of actually seeing the lines that information is provided I'm sorry I did interpret your question well I know you're looking at it but my trouble is that people that have to approve it was stated that they don't look at it and again when you approve something there's a reason that you're asked to approve it not to take good faith that you're brilliant and never make mistakes so yeah so I just want to clarify uh that every line was provided in a budget book right so they every line was seen but not a deep dive analysis of every line which is why I initially um thought you were saying we we each get one of these um budgets that I'm holding up right here so I did Mis interpret so I apologize I say something real quick sorry to interject I did look at the budget obviously we all got the booklet of the budget the reason that I was not really confidently raising my hand is because I would never claim to understand it as well as the ba that's why I ask him questions about line items I don't understand so I obviously read the budget that was given to me and asked questions about it so let me if I may just posee this question that was asked before could I show see a show of hands of people that have looked at all the line items and determined that they were reasonable no oh I don't know if they were reasonable most of them are all right okay that's a better answer okay thank you thanks for the opportunity to speak with you have a good night anybody else don't love it's nice to see you nice to see you so just a couple of points like Steve dunlope um I came to these meetings for years and years often I was the only only one here or maybe bill and I were the only ones here it's nice to see a bigger turnout we had over 5,000 students and a 67 billion dollar budget this is going back a few years and then we get to uh we lose 40% of our students we go from 5,000 to 3,000 we have a $66 million budget now we're back up to a $71 million budget I don't know what the exact headcount is but I think it's around 2900 um I'm not a mathematician but if you take $71 million budget and you divide it by the 2900 students you come up to about $24,000 a student so I don't know where there's $199,000 per student figure comes from that's number one if you want to address that uh so it's the comparative budget number from the user friendly budget from the state uh it normalizes districts because certain districts for example don't have to provide transportation and things like that so it's looking at um and then it actually listed on the user friendly budget which areas um it includes but for example it doesn't include Transportation because not every district has Transportation so that would then be not a fair comparison from one District to another but if you look at the userfriendly budget it'll have a little um blurb on that page at the end and it'll it'll describe what the uh comparative uh total budget cost per pup uh is made up of but that's why it's used so you can have a app the Apple comparison uh among districts that may have different factors such as needing to provide transportation as opposed to not needing to provide transportations but having said that if we have a $71 million budget and we have 2900 students we're actually paying about $24,000 per student to educate them and it seems like a pretty significant number I understand the reason why some districts don't have the transportation but but we do and Steve kepis used to sit here and say we're getting more money than we're supposed to be getting we have to make Cuts we have to make changes we're going to sell a school we're going to move the eighth grade to the high school and whoever was on the board would always push back because the room would fill up with people that didn't want that and so none of that was done and then a superintendent came in and said he was going to cut department heads and the philosophy was if you weren't in the classroom you're not going to be here and then the next superintendent comes in the one prior to Russ and builds the support back up so we begin to get it administrative heavy again I know there's been some changes I know we don't have an assistant superintendent now but you start looking at the cost we have a director of a curriculum making $160,000 a year with a $70,000 a year secretary that's a quarter of a million dollars that we're paying two people to look after curriculum to make sure that our kids get educated and and to look at the results so much of this is not result based it's tenure based and I don't think that will ever change I just see another 3.9% salary increase everybody's deserving of an increase but I know a lot of companies that don't give increases every year my wife works for the largest steamship company in the world and she went five years without an increase because of what was going on with austerity measures there have not been austerity measures here from my point of view class size is the last thing I want to address Mr Z when he was the president of the board felt that the class sizes were too large and he wanted them lower grades to not have more than 12 students in a classroom I went back and looked there were 23 kids in my first grade class and one teacher God bless her Mrs farmer there were no assistants there were no AIDS there was 23 kids and a teacher I talked to a man the other day whose whose daughter is a teacher in the district and he said she has 23 kids at her class and I said does she have an aid and he said no there's actually two teachers in the class new jersey.com put out a report based on a company called Data rapper and they look at class sizes and they said that New Jersey the average was 12.1 students per teacher in the state and then they did it by district and that there's two numbers maybe you can explain this R Us one of them Says student to teer ratio by school and student to teer ratio by District so I don't know what the difference is between those two numbers but for example they show um Cedar Mountain is being 11 Point 11 to1 student and 12 to1 for the district they show lounsbery Hollow I'm sorry they show Rolling Hills 12:1 they show Cedar Mountain right Cedar Mountain 11 to1 Rolling Hills 12 to1 Glenn Meadow 11 to1 and the high school 11 to1 what year figures are those are 23 24 2223 okay 2223 so we added 43 teachers and that was supposed to be because of covid to get these kids back up to speed spent the money all in one year when we probably shouldn't have probably should have hired left and done it over a long longer period of time but that's in a rear view now they want to hire 16 more teachers and I look at the numbers and I go why 11 to one 11 to1 doesn't seem like an outrageous ratio at all we've had parents come to the board meeting class class size with one teacher in first grade with 28 students earlier in the year we have fette classes of uh 35 40 we have other classes 30 and above at the high school and at Glen Meadow as well so instead of looking at averages it's based on schedules and needs and a lot of those numbers are based on IEPs and uh specific student needs that I think students uh deserve in their IEPs I haven't been in school for 50 years but I remember when we went out to gym class there were often three and four classes released to gym at the same time with one or two gym teachers it just I just find it troubl when I see these numbers that are supposed to be from the state saying that we have 11 or 12 students per teacher and saying that automatically we need 16 more of them just uh so if it's from 2223 just uh in a note that would be before the the reduction staff as well so I understand that I understand that what were the state averages Again State average was 12 to one and these were ours were around 12 or 10 before ours were 11 the highest one was Walnut Ridge which which was 55 to1 and I guess that's because it was prek but 11:1 and 10 to one seems pretty low real but it's so it would be really nice if at one some point in the near future that you would put together a schedule that shows how many kids are in each class because I hear these stories about 23 and 24 when my daughter was here she told me they used to sometimes run from one class to the next to make sure they got a seat but that's when we had thousand more students in the district we never closed the school we never moved to e8th grade I just don't see where any real changes were made it's just let's just spend more money let's just go back to the well I can assure you you would not spent more money from last year to this year with the with the Cut's at over the years I hear like I said for me I keep going back to it but it was it was 52.5 full-time staff numbers that were C last week but when I hear these when I hear this tale that that we lost all this money and it was 30 something million because you do the cumulative the 7 mil what we lost per year we didn't lose near what it was made to appear that we lost because of the aid the additional Aid that we got the money that we didn't spend the whole time the kids were not in school because of covid but the point the point Still Remains that costs are going up we had an issue with the insurance last year we knew there was not going to be an insurance increase but it was included in the budget I do believe the budget is padded if you have $2 million from last year's budget that you didn't spend and you say well we're just going to move this forward to fund next year's budget it's $2 million that probably was over we're budgeted that's about 3% of the total budget so I just um want to provide a comment that might be helpful so there are things that happened during the year obviously everyone knows pluses and minuses to the budget um we're projecting a budget a year out right so for example uh something that could happen and it could move one way or the other depending on the year you could have additional kids that go out of districts which would have a cost with tuition and transportation or you could have a reduction in the number kids that go uh in out of District which obviously would be a CLA savings but when you start the year if you have that kid on rooll and you have that student unroll and this is just an example it's not the only thing that happens during the year that could go this way uh and I'm budgeting year out and I know this kid is currently here um the student is projected to still be here uh I need the budget for that but then if they leave obviously that that would be a savings uh for us but I can't budget and hope that someone's not going to be here you I understand we signif students with IEP is a significant number of students District kind of goes to other areas budg too that's why I say it's a living document looking at historic information looking at current information uh and we're doing our best uh to project a fiscally responsible budget uh that you know doesn't run we don't want to over budget but we also don't want to hit a deficit well I just wish in the near future you would put together a spreadsheet that shows the number of students per class in every class so we can really see it so instead of this oneof teacher has 23 kids in a class why does it not match it up up at all with the State numbers this is what's being reported to the state 11 and 10 students per teacher it's a big difference between 23 so if you do that I would appreciate it in your spare time of course thanks guys good evening my name is Morin MOS and I live in the sussek section of Vernon it is recommended that the last five days of school this year that the students have a half a day why why is it 5 days every month the students get out a half a day every month they get out a half a day early dismissal a half a day is considered a full day for the students being in school I think it's inconsiderate for parents that work half a day is inconvenient and why is it five days that it is being recommended that these students are off I think I spoke to this before if you see our calendar for next year you're not going to see that half a day every month so we I believe I did see it and there you told me there was going to be several days less next year yes there's many days left less I don't yeah no how many two maybe but but we we've reduced it considerably to what we've had from the last year to this year based on based on comments from and issues parents are they are really really are rate with the half a days too many half a days it's about to stop I address that going into next year's calendar the half days at the end of the year are been around the the high school final exam schedule and and practices for middle school and high school graduations okay as well that's that's been past practice but I want to let you know because I remember you talked before and that was a point that we were going to address I mean come on we these students lost so much with Co for for schools being shut down because of Co and now every and it's on Fridays last year it was on Thursday well compare compare next year's to this year's and you'll see the difference there's sign so it's a nice sign it's a nice long weekend and I and teachers are teachers are usually being provided training during that time it's not a nice long weekend necessarily for them we we've uh we haven't had the ability to train through the last several years that's why a lot of those days were added we provided that training this year and we're going to do them during Monday meetings next year so we we've addressed the half day's concern um but it wasn't it wasn't a half day where everyone went home it was for the teachers and staff is where they were stayed behind and were trained and given them training but please consider parents that are working and a half a day is an inconvenience that's why we Chang okay and again I address why is it that the last five days of school this year they want a half a day why what's the answer usually it is usually maybe the last two days is a half a day this is five days they have uh most most students have eight eight different subjects for final exams and it's been the practice for the half days to get so that they can take two exams a day but that's high school this is all schools the the younger grades do not take finals right there's preparation for the well it's other schools as well preparation for the graduation for glal and the high school five days it doesn't take five days to do that that is too many days thank you Mrs F and not only that but I go back to the students were off on Good Friday they were off the following week for spring break they go back to school on Monday and that Friday is another half a day again next schedule you are going to address that for next year right we already released the calendar for next year yes so you can see the difference between that number I I really believe I I thank you for taking that into consideration because this is absolutely ridiculous there was a topic I talked about before you even presented it last time I heard you talk about this in me wow it's a big concern and I also want to bring up it it's around town saying that people that taxpayers that don't have students enrolled in this District don't want to pay taxes that is incorrect I have three students that went through this District they are they are graduated they're on with their life I am willing to pay my taxes it's not all these parents that no longer have students in this District are complaining about the tax increase and that is incorrect because I have grandchildren in the district trying to provide them the same level of Education that your your children did when they were in school but I have grandchildren in the district right I'm we're trying so that statement needs to be corrected yeah we're trying to provide your grandchildren that in the district the same level of Education that your children then when they attended okay I thank you hello my name is Denise Hart I am from Vernon um a couple of things and I I think I speak at a different level than Warren Carolyn Mr Higgins I I speak at a trying to understand all this which I don't always understand but the first thing I want to mention is the energy audit for the folks just pay attention because when you do an energy audit and then you have to make changes and then you find out that the equipment you have that's old then has to be updated to keep up because if you know anything about an you know an old car and then you have new equipment you need to now change old equipment to make it work so just keep that in mind because we're going to hear about those expenses in the future with we just talked about this last week with the energy audit we're gonna have a cost analysis withs yeah so that would include um different options and the sa potential savings that'll be associated with it um and then different options uh in terms of what that might support in terms of capital projects you know depending on what the savings amount would be another thing that's kind of still um we still working on what we don't have a final answer on I think we mentioned probably a couple times is that we're working with Elizabeth toown natural gas and we're oh sorry uh another thing um that uh we've been working on uh we're hopeful about that I go like The Other Extreme sorry um is working with Elizabeth Town natural gas uh and our hope uh would be that they would run a natural gas line uh to our schools uh all the schools except the high school because geographically that wouldn't make sense so that's something they're exploring right now that if that if that went through that would be something also considered uh in any um it just depends on the timing so of course um as time goes on and you mentioned about some of the um Capital Improvements necessary like a roof I I hope the state has money to put solar on because that's the only time you want to put solar on a roof is when it's new because if you have to ever fix the roof and take down the solar that's a whole Rigo and a huge expense yeah that's the top to top number one on the energy audit what we're looking at because roofs are ready to be replaced right now yeah okay I mean and you see in other areas where you actually have parking lots covered with solar I I don't know where that money comes from in infrastructure I mean there's people who are in that industry and we've already had them outlooking Mr SL could talk about that yeah so um that's something we're also considering um based off the conversations we've had generally those um kind of over parking lots they have the like canopy setups generally those are more expensive um and usually at least based off of the talks we've had the best return is if you can put it on a roof uh but obviously you need as you mentioned you need the roof to be in good shape um but that's why uh as part of this um uh again very early I'm hopeful that maybe we can combine that replace a roof uh and and use so as part of the savings that would help us pay for that okay okay this is just a statement I don't expect a response nor do I really want to hear one Mr Rogers with all due respect and I know you've only been here a year and you've heard me say this before the previous administration made a decision to hire those teachers with money that came from the I say it wrong but the covid money in one year and lied that that money could only be used the higher teachers all came out in board meetings it's on record my heartbreaks they were lovely people that lost their jobs nobody wants to see anybody lose a job but please remember we know that that 52.5 that you mentioned that were teachers were not going shouldn't have never been there in that amount when you didn't have outgoing teachers retiring it was it was a very bad plan on somebody's part that's all I want to say about it because it hurts every time you say it because I am furious at the previous administration for lying to the board members and getting them to agree to something that was for not for the purposes it should have been okay moving on for that I want to point out the fact that inflation has killed all of us I'm going to speak to some numbers that work for me and please all check your checking accounts the average I I looked this up while I was sitting here the average household per 2022 in Vernon households income is 110,111 434 so I divided that by the average household income now I knew the percentage but I wanted to make it relatable 9.6 99.69% inflation and the cost of everything going up from your garbage to everything because not one thing in my life has not gone up 99.69% I don't necessarily agree with and I want to believe you I have no reason not to want to believe you but you mentioned I am the average household I'm assessed at 303 so I think it was around 248 was just the increase for the budget and then the questions when you said that I asked that's on top of that's on top of what you're already proposed if the questions get approved my my monthly should be about 25 just based on the budget and then this additional which I think is another 15 so the best way to know your exact uh you know estimated impact again it's estimated but should be close um would be to take your assessed value and I uh there's two numbers um and I I'll provide both of them to you so and again this will be online the slideshow if you look at um slid so so slide 20 you can't see up on the screen right now um but for the school district uh the impact would be uh 1358 per right um the estimated total from the town which is inclusive of uh County um all the all the county numbers the town numbers and and the school uh is estimated to be 2.4 33% and we're at like 2.53 now so if you take that and multiply by your C value that should give you an idea of what your taxes would be uh and then you could compare it to your prior your prior years assessed by prior years's taxes um you mentioned something and it's on a different slid so on page 29 towards the end um because I thought maybe this would be a question that information could be helpful um the separate proposal uh is 0.59% right so if you add that to the budget if this is if both questions were to pass um the school's impact would be 1.41 7% um so if you took that 059 % and added it to that overall number uh that would give you a good idea take the 1.35 plus the 0.59 that would be for the school's impact but if you wanted to see the impact of also the county that's me impact of the county and the I I actually just want to know about the school because very honestly we I can't control the county I mean that's that's a whole another story I did listen to the town council meeting Mr Sparta did get into that in the town council meeting and do know this just from um from my work yeah so just just for the schools impact um and the added number with those two numbers combined which would be the budget and both questions of the separate proposal uh would be 1.47% that's the estimated amount I took a screenshot of your okay and I again I'll put it on the website too okay so um where am I going with this I just want to point out that in my family as again I've earning tax paper my contribution my husband because he is the one with the insurance is $175 a week family it is $99,100 a year contribution for my family out of my husband's payche and then we don't even want to get into my benefits and I have Etna and my benefits are worse than the teachers because I've talked to many of the teachers and you have Etna so I know that the plans are different based on the you know just based on how they do plans with different groups yeah so we're um so for the state plan um there's a uh public workers and there's a school so we're in the school the school plan not the public plan I think that was something that came up earlier so we're we're in the school plan and it's Horizon although recently uh they're they did allow Eton to come back in so right now it's Horizon though but individuals do have the the choice at this point to either choose horizon or or Etna um they they're having an open enrollment just for that purpose a special open enrollment so the question I have because I went to chapter 44 I Googled it while I was sitting here and I did not understand what Mr higin was saying because I didn't have enough time really to read it because I'm really just trying to write notes is if a a base salary of 60 to 70,000 the percentage you mentioned percentages so the family percentage because I'll go with family because I'm family 4.4% of salary Sal salary yeah chapter 78 would be a percentage of salary and that's the employee contribution for chapter 44 it's the percentage uh of salary for chapter 78 it's a percentage of Premium there's two separate charts but you should be able to find both of them online so they fall under both not one or the other uh one or the other there's two separate laws so there's chapter 78 which was in put in place during Governor Christie uh does that mean that was put in place by Governor chrisy would be our tenured anyone that was here before 2020 that elected not to change the plan because they were grandfathered in so they had they had they had a higher contribution because chapter 78 was a percentage of the premium which was a higher contribution chapter 44 as well was just passed I think uh I think it was 2020 or was put in effect in 2020 I think or July 2021 um that is probably the the one you're looking at right now and that is a percentage of salary okay so percentage of salary for the employee who's been with us since 2020 on a 4.4% family um plan at a six at a 70 I went with 70 I just was rechecking my numbers because I got numbers all over the place the contribution by the teacher is $3,080 so chapter yeah so chapter 44 is uh essentially the law so that was I just want to point out I pay 90 we pay my husband pays thank God he has it and it's is horrible $99,100 contribution on top of the fact that we have a health fund and I have to pay um $2,000 my first 2,000 of expenses and then we can't even go on with that but just please I'm bringing all this up because you're talking about numbers for the children I I don't have a kid I don't have skin in the game anymore she graduated last year I'm here because she graduated last year because I can be here CH Ching CH Ching CH Ching CH Ching CH ching and my next question which you don't have to answer what if we don't approve your budget questions what if we don't approve them what are you going to do because you can't get blood from the stone so we're gonna have the same level of Education after where we are now and that's after all these these state aid cuts and this is what's been talked about what happened has been talked about over eight years but through covid and stabilization a lot of it wasn't felt well it was felt last year and I think we talked about that all the time so after covid and it kind of came up I think in one of the other comments earlier um fund balance went up and I think that was audu I forget who who comment or but fund balance went up because of covid and the different challenges and you know um educating from home and different savings associated with that but as you see in one of the slides I presented earlier our fund balance is now going down so we had a fund balance go up which helped offset some of those State a Cuts uh but fund balance is a one-time use unless you're continuously generating it so that is being cut down each year and you see the capital reserve is lower the main Reser is almost nothing um but um essentially if that doesn't pass it'll be the same level as now and we'll be basically um striving to be able to maintain that right because it always comes down to U what happens with state aid um they're supposed to relook at the state aid formula after this year because this is the last year of the S2 funding formula implementation um so if you do see anything on that and if I see anything on that I'll share it at a board meeting definitely please reach out to your representatives uh just to make sure that you know burning is heard um but anyway so that's part of it so it's dependent on state aid uh and then it's also gonna be depending on how the cost everything Rises just just as we all experience because limited limited revenues that we can generate essentially I'm gonna wrap up because Mr sweetie like to your five minutes around I want to make sure everybody gets hers I understand I I just I'm not a big history person but I just want to put it this way the the money we lost we knew about in 16 and uh the former super assistant superintendent who should not need to be named his plan way back then please check the YouTube videos was the retirement was going to take care of the two for one bringing getting rid of the higher paid bringing in the new the money we lost we also got money long before from the state that more than we were supposed to okay so we are where we are because of past history obviously we're working really hard to go forward we but we got here because of circumstances we can't fix them but let's not bury the fact that they they're here and you you we it's not our fault it's here you gotta find it's just not I wasn't on the board you know I was just taxpayer I wasn't even paying attention that much because I didn't understand it I was just watching videos not really understanding it going forward though you know like K said these line items I I mean I I they just really have to be scrutinized because I just feel like that's history repeating itself thank you for your time thank you Mr made $6,000 salary 307 don't they on top of that get a rebate at the end of the year reur R you sorry I'm having trouble hearing it health premium contribution somebody making 6 65,000 a year and they're paying 4% or so for their insurance which is 30 something hundred but aren't they getting a rebate back at the end of the year to bring the some of that money uh there is a 10% rebate I can't recall if it's chapter 78 it's just on chapter 78 So yeah thank you I thought it was chapter that was a local board decision it had nothing to do with mandating State the state said you go from year one to year six the percentage rose up to a maximum of 35% of the benefit cost that the $100,000 plus teacher had to pay if he had a $40,000 plan they pay 5% of that they will liveing this local board and I was on the board at the time and I got out voted in negotiations said to the teachers well we feel bad for you we're going to give you some of that money back in a form of a rebate so instead of them paying 35% of the healthare cost the locable board felt oh that's right we'll give you we'll give you a third of a fact so if you g 25% unnecessary just totally wrong I'm sorry Mr AG we heard that for and there's people waiting I know but I just clarify and in the chapter the chapter 44 if you have two employees in chapter 44 only only one coverage so that that's been a significant savings since transition over I'm sorry thank you good evening Ann Larson I'm also resent of Vernon so thank you for pointing out those wonderful numbers because just as a matter of uh record uh self-employed people who pay their own medical like myself and like my husband are 12285 a month per person so that's $30,000 in in premiums going out with $7,500 deductibles so I really have very little sympathy for people paying 35% of a premium plus 10% give back it's really got to go away so when you when you do your negotiating with the njaa and the njaa if that's what I heard you say this has to this has to come to an end this is insane that someone hasn't told them sorry we ran out of other people's money to spend we got to start spending your own money okay it it's become a blob a blob of just taking taking taking from all the constituents this is crazy this is just crazy and I I urge you please reject this reject this budget this is just bloated it needs to be trimmed and when it's trimmed it doesn't have to be trimmed from teachers okay we're tired of you know people always cutting first from the from what the students get um you know in my experience I've sold real estate for a lot years people are happy to pay taxes to have a good school district they're proud of it and it's a selling feature and it's it's a it's a matter of Pride you know we're paying a lot of money we're not getting the results you know you had that horrible display from the Anova mat person that came uh two weeks ago or however many weeks ago that was talking about retraining teachers teachers that used to have a blue ridon District I don't know who he wants to retrain I think we should retrain him and maybe maybe learn the way they used to do things so we'd have some decent uh results so just one more thing and I'm sorry if this sounds rude but Mr Sweeny you made a comment when you started earlier this evening you said that you're committed to njaa and njaa I think the real the real Factor should be have contracts with them you have a contract you know who you're committed to you're committed to the students and the taxpayers absolutely absolutely that was in reference to conversation that wasn't talking they need to know they're behind us that's it in the line I you know after me you come first after the taxpayers then they're first thank you very much they all taxpayers on agreed agreed but some of us don't reap any of those rewards agreed my name is Sean Clarin I live it here in Vernon New Jersey sorry sorry I live in Vernon New Jersey all right I'm trying not to get get loud tonight uh my three children went to school here they did an excellent job job they all went to college they all graduated all right I'm a happy satisfied customer okay I came here and I was looking to see the nuts and bolts we're talking about a lot of money we're talking about this we're talking about that there's one there's one type of class that was mentioned and it was mentioned here so I wrote down co uh cosmetology right did I pronounce that right yes she did okay I'm curious because way back I graduated 1979 okay and there was auto mechanics and there was secretarial School a large portion of the people who took auto mechanics just didn't want to take other classes and when they were done with auto mechanics they didn't go become a mechanic so I'm just I'm looking to enhance the quality of the education I'm also a real estate agent and if you don't have good schools people don't want to buy houses all right I they don't want to send their children to a to an average school okay we we are an average or a little bit below average New Jersey school okay all right the entire state where average are a little bit below that's not really not acceptable so I just was hoping to hear some nuts and bolts I was hoping to hear about where we're cutting costs I was hoping to hear what we're doing better to improve the education in this upcoming budget we're spending this money on this to improve the education okay I didn't hear any of that so when cosm cosmology came up I jotted down how many students took that particular course of classes in 2020 and how many are working in that field in 2021 in 2022 in 2023 how many students took those classes during their four years of high school and are working in those fields because if they're not working in those fields if you go back four or five years and you audit how many of those students actually are working careers in those fields if it's a good number then hey you're doing a great job great if it's not a good number why are you continuing to do that if you're not looking at the results of your work three four five years back you have no idea if you're doing a good job or not so I heard nothing that I came here to hear tonight all right all these numbers I really don't need you guys telling me what my increase is going to be based on the value of my house I really didn't come here to hear that and that's where the whole Focus was all right if you're doing a good job my house is worth more money if you're not doing a good job my house is worth less money I'll pay taxes I pay taxes you did a great job with my kids very very happy all right but you got to look at your production you got to look back over time to determine if you're doing a good job on if we don't need auto mechanics then we shouldn't have it we had the colleges come I saw online that the colleges came and they did their presentation and they were taking you know they're talking to the kids about colleges have you had Craftsman come the world needs more mechanics the world needs more more electricians the world needs more plumbers if you speak to the contractors in town that I deal with on a regular basis they're dying for employees they need employees so if you're not educating our and to be honest the plumbers the electricians the Carpenters they're making better money than the kids who graduate from college okay so if you're not educating our kids the way they need to be educated then you're not doing a good job all right so all I'm asking for hopefully maybe next year when we do the budget we'll hear about what you're doing to make things better that's what I'd like to hear about thank you very much thank you Mr hi I'm Colleen ranzan I'm the union president on the btea uh president and I just wanted to address some questions s um first of all the first woman that came up was asking about I think the raises that Mr Higgins had asked the board for I did speak about that last week uh or the last meeting and um no no members have um volunteer to give up our raises nor do I think we should if you want my $50 raise I'll write you a check because that's all I I get but the money I put into my classroom far outweighs my rise so there's that um the VTA members contribute to our Healthcare like Mr slam explained um we pay a portion of our health care there is chapter 78 which was passed by governor chrisy and we now have chapter 44 chapter 44 is our state health benefits plan and so the rebate that Mr Higgins is speaking about only goes to the chapter 77 the members who pay into chapter 78 that's what I meant 78 um the the members that like myself pay into chapter 44 the state health benefits plan do not get that rebate back which we did negotiate last time we had our contract so if you sit here and say the teachers take take take take take we give to so um and Mr Dunlap uh I saw on that website that you showed me um the 11:1 ratio uh I'm here to tell you that the majority of the classes in the district are close to over 30 students in every school uh so though that that information is not correct and the two teachers that you speak about or spoke spoke about are classes that are IEP driven their icr classes and they're there because students have IEPs that call for another teacher in the classroom so I just wanted to make that clarification that the VTA work with the Board of Education we we are a collective bargaining unit we come in um good faith and we negotiate we give and we take that's what happened we don't take take take take take thank you thank you Mr miss m hello hi I'm Vicky Smith um I so serve a dual purpose I do live in Vernon Township I am a taxpayer son of a um I am also an educator so I see both sides of the coin I agree with some of the information I wasn't too happy with the last Administration either in what they did okay I would love to see the trades brought back my husband is Carpenter my son is a carpenter okay I would love that um but I also want to make clear that a lot of our Educators live in our district we have a a we have skin in the game we send our children here we pay taxes we want a good school district and as gentlemen said in real estate if you have a really good school district you don't mind paying a little extra okay so any increase in taxes affects everyone and we are trying our darnest and I agree with Miss ranzan about the 11.1 I saw that number too and I was like where are they looking um and then somebody mentioned oh no they're counting all the faculty and staff with that number I don't have one class that has 11 kids in it the the smallest class I have is 16 but the rest are 29 to 30 I teach five classes I teach at the high school so um make sure that you're aware of the facts yes don't want to pay more taxes but if it means that children my children are out of school they are taxpayers as well in Vernon if it means that we are going to have a well-educated community I'll give up a dollar coffee a day I'll keep my 2016 Hyundai that's burning oil for a few more years I'll do what I have to do because I don't want to see the children of our town suffer because well you know we have to have 45 kids in a in a classroom we have to cut this program we're not going to have after school busing because you know sorry you know we can't afford that I want to give them what my my children had and my children are very successful son's a carpenter my daughter's social media they both went through Vernon I have nieces and nephews that went through Vernon my husband went through ver no he didn't go through Vernon he was too old my brother-in-law all right so keep in mind nobody wants to do it and I think that um Mr slam this is first time I meeting you you gave a great presentation and you answered all the questions thoroughly um if there's specific questions yeah ask and I don't think this board is hiding anything I feel very comfortable with this board as I said previous administration not too fond but I feel very comfortable with the spard that you're doing everything possible to do what's right for why we're here the students and that's what we have to keep at the Forefront if I had a magic wand if I won the lottery tomorrow we'd have new buildings I would you know donate anything I could but I have to live as well so if I'm willing to pay extra money my taxes I don't have children I live in Vernon Drive a crafty car okay you get all the facts don't go from this site to this site to this site to this site um there's another point I wanted to make and I can't remember it right now um lost but that's okay so I thank you for all your hard work oh the questions the questions if you vote to put the resolution on the ballot every voting member in Vernon will get the opportunity to vote Yes or No that's a democratic V so there's no harm in putting it on the ballot that way everyone in the district can vote their what is beneficial for them or what they believe so I am for putting that resolution on the ballot thank you thank you Mrs thank you for what you do every day Scott Castle from uh Glennwood I didn't want to miss out on the the party I'll be quick I know it's getting long in here um I just I mean first before I start I wanted to say it seems like at times some of the comments um are getting people upset or whatever and I think it needs to be uh remembered that you know these are just taxpayers that are trying to make ends meet trying to hang on to some money and not just have every scent that they get that's you know left over given to the district constantly so it's not personal attacks it's nothing personal I know the at the last meeting Mr slam you said you were getting a little uh fired up about some of the comments and things like that I think a lot of them were mine but um it's it's nothing personal it's just that you know I think there's this perception that when uh people come up and they make comments that we're trying to rip money away from the district and and hurt the district when in fact we're just is trying to keep our money the district's trying to take more money from us each time so that's you know that's the way that I see it anyway um and I think that you know that the schools are staying status quo and not in that great of a uh predicament right now so it's it's hard to justify you know huge tax increases um and I don't know why this changed I don't think anybody's vilifying teachers in in any way that from any the comments that I heard but um I will say that again this is going back to the last meeting um but I had a comment about you know it would be easier for proposed tax increases to you'd be it'd be easier for me to kind of swallow some of them if we saw scores improving and there was kind of a contradictory couple of answers to that because I know Mr slam and I'm not picking on anybody I'm just going back over over what what I heard Mr slam had said well we look we let go of all those teachers and so our scores aren't going to improve you know we need to get the teachers back but then later on Miss incar or Mrs encarnado had a great question on okay if we approve both questions how much will our scores go up which we couldn't answer so it seems like we can say without the teachers the scores aren't going to go up but if we add all the teachers I don't know if the scores are going to go up so you know that those those comments didn't necessarily sell anything um for me and I wanted to point too that that you know letting the teachers go was a district decision and as people have brought up I don't know that they should have been hired in the first place it does it is bad that they had to get get let go but it wasn't like we really trimmed down by letting these teachers go we had expanded and then we got back to to normal by by letting them go and now we're trying to act like we're you know we're missing I understand the class size thing um but you know there's there's tradeoffs all all the way through so I think that that needs to be looked at but I think both sides generalizing like looking at the overall average and then pick you know cherry picking a couple of classes that have 35 students in them isn't isn't the way to go either um another comment that I don't think was taken too well that I said last meeting was about uh constantly using you know infation which we all understand inflation you know I didn't need a lecture on inflation really um my point was that we're as taxpayers we already PL paying inflation and what I didn't see was the district doing anything on their side to cut administrative costs and I use the term administrative all the time administrative costs to try and offset that it was just we'll pass this on to the taxpayer so now we're taking a double hit on inflation um and it's you know it's tough for a lot of people um and I sorry but I I don't like I know somebody called in with this uh last last call too or last meeting too with the cup of coffee thing where it's just a cup of coffee per day and I would counter that argument which i' hate anyway but I would counter that with the taxpayers in this town have given up a ton of cups of coffee per day over the last few years and it would be nice if occasionally the cup of coffee was given up on the district side instead of constantly on the taxpayer side um so yeah um sorry I was I'm I'm rambling a little bit because I was writing a bunch of notes down while I was driving and they don't make any sense to me um another comment that was I think Mr Rogers made which was you're being asked to add things but you're also being asked to remove things and we're kind of contradicting ourselves I think on the surface that might be true but you know I'll speak on my end I don't speak for anybody else but I've never come up here and said I want to save my tax dollars by cutting teachers or by cutting late buses or by cutting sat courses or anything like that I've harped on administrative costs all the time because that's what I do at my job and I saw on that chart you know $4.2 million for admin and it I saw nowhere that there were any Cuts in admin um and I'm not saying that I know the whole thing because I don't know what's going on in admin but I would like to see that hey this is what we've got you know I would love to see admin costs from before the covid years the staff and then compare it to this year because admin just in general I know I do it in my job it tends to bloat over time you you you need something done so you hire something that job's done you keep the person because you don't want to you don't want to fire people I mean that's just how it is um but I think you know I would I would even love to have a meeting where we listed every admin cost that there was salaries stiens uh you know anything that there was that was admin related we have a justification for it and then we see can we are there roles that we can combine that we can save some money and I know it's tough you know for a ba and a superintendent you're working with these people every day but they are in admin jobs admin jobs are tough and when when we're when we're our choice is are we going to cut some student facing program or are we gonna affect the students in any way or are we going to make some really hard admin cuts for me 100% on the admin side every time even if people are freaking out about it because the the students need to not be hurt at all by anything that's going on and it does seem like sometimes we jump to the students um you know getting hurt and and it's it's horrible and that leads me to the the late buses um which is on that second question and and all of that I know Mrs paladini called in which I don't know her personally but she always has great things to say um she had mentioned that you know it shouldn't be on the the second question and I would agree with that because I can't understand and I don't have enough info on it to know and I don't know if anybody does but like these checks for the flex school that just seem to be endlessly written out um you know nobody ever explains them on some of the other checks that are approved I can't believe that we can't find I think it's like $30,000 a year for the for the late buses and I don't care how many kids take the late bus or don't take the late bus uh students have a finite amount of time in school they should never have to miss any after school activity because they can't get a bus because their time is limit they only have that much time and then any kids now that are missing class or missing some something they wanted to do after school because they don't have a late bus and their parents work that's horrible they don't get that time back it's the it's the worst thing in the world so I don't think it should be a second question I think it should be admin cost should pay for that immediately um and I think the only other thing I had was uh I just a a comment this isn't a criticism in any way but like with the negotiated Bank interest that's great that we renegotiated that but why do we have a bank that isn't automatically adjusting that based on what the FED rates are which is what normally happens why why do we have to do the work to go to them and say Hey you know you're paying us 0.15% and you're getting this money at a lot higher rate and on top of that they're using the district money I mean it helps the bank out so they should be doing the work and saying hey we're going to raise you up because the fed's Rate rates went up I mean is that something that we could tell them like do that or we're going to get another bank so cently in my experience in school districts you have to stay on top of your bankrupt um and you have to be you know keeping be mindful essentially what the Fed rate is um so in this instance for us um coming from Dober I had negotiated up the 4.75 there so when I came here you know knowing it's a different County I actually sent out a survey um to my colleagues in the county um to figure out what rates everyone else uh was getting uh the highest I found was 4.5% I happen to have worked with that bank before um so I reached out to our current bank and said listen I know I can get it I can get this can you match it because that Prov is having to change everything over right um but I guess I'm going a little long answer but essentially um really the VA should keep an eye on it and should be kind of holding them accountable at least from my experience what I've been doing yeah and I mean I would agree you want to keep an eye on it but to me I would say you know and I'm not saying I could do your job I'm just saying that I would s them you know I'm G to go to another bank that's going to keep an eye on it for me and suggest changes rather than me having to constantly do this because they are getting a big they're not doing us a favor they're using the district money that we're putting in there you know for their own use and they're giving out loans they're getting interest on everything so um and yeah I would love to see this I hate to say it but I'd love to see this budget voted down we make some admin Cuts we come back with another budget and that makes a little more sense and I'm not saying you can solve every problem every problem that's here with admin Cuts but I would like to see some and we kind of split the difference or something like that it' be a lot easier for me to to handle than basically it just being passed on to me you know straight through so Mr Castle I think uh we share a lot of the concerns that the households share now with increasing inflation etc etc and and increasing costs and also with a cut in amount of state aid we're getting from the state um so we we had made cuts and this is why it got down to some ISS some items that we didn't necessarily want to cut we had made significant cuts across the board everywhere I think if maybe I'll come back with some data on administrators for students or how much we pay on an Administration relative to other other schools but for those cuts up there we're we're administrators and if I would I would love to compare preco to right now where we are administratively as well um I want to let you know that like we we feel the pain here we've gotten the cuts and we're trying to do everything we can to possibly provide the same quality of Education that a lot of people have come up to their microphone today and said that their children have had at burned and it's a difficult thing to do when you're giving less money from the state and we have looked at a lot of these areas maybe I can provide you some data on some of the custom Administration yeah I mean it it really would be great to just see all the administrative costs and you know what's going on there because I think that needs to be red an analysis of a user friendly budgets but it gets a little tricky because they're uh they're a year ago and what's happening right now if you're reading the a lot of the other schools are starting to lose their Esra funds uh now and you're seeing a lot of cuts at some of the other schools as well so I can I can go back to the last user friendly budget and give you some data on that but I I could assure you we what one of my when we when we made these Cuts we were going to say we're looking for savings everywhere before we can go into late buses and what the reason we did late buses a second question was because maybe somebody just wanted the lay buses and they didn't want this part or vice versa so we tried to separate that question all out separately so they don't have to vote for the whole the whole second question they could vote for yeah I'll just add on that and it just seemed to me when I first saw that that my perception of it was we were putting late buses on a second question so that we could phrase questions like if you didn't vote for the you know if you don't want to vote for this $2 million tax increase you must not like the students because you don't want the late bus where it's such a small small piece of the late buus is a separate question yeah do that intentionally so that we tried to break it up so that way you wouldn't have to oppose no that's that's so we have some of the same challenges in in different ways run to the school district and like I said I I hear great stories about students that graduated for Vernon who trying to provide those same opportunities I could talk about CTE programs and cosmetology and how many licenses everyone is getting out of Vern schools versus a lot of other programs are are are uh has changed several times or construction facilities the maintenance or technology programs we've tried to bring some of those programs back but I'll tell you what without that extra million dollars in stabilization it would be really ugly state aid sorry state aid without that extra million dollars it'd be really ugly about what we're talking about cutting cutting for our students this year yeah just the last thing yeah no I I get it I mean I I I do budgeting so I know it's not it's not easy at all but it's just you know you normally wanna you want to have a Target that you're trying to hit and and I don't get the luxury of being able to move my goalpost because I add everything up and this is how much I have to in you know increase taxes normally you have a Target you've got to hit that with your budget and yeah there there's painful painful cuts that have to be done and I understand that you've done some Cuts but it seems like we need to do more Cuts I mean honestly and you get to a point where um I I really think it's almost all I I it's GNA it's going to affect the quality of education at this point but that's my my point is administratively wise has the least impa but that's I mean $4.2 million is a lot of money for a district we added other things in that lineup as far as it yeah I get that there's it in there that's why I would love to see it you know all listed out what is what are the actual admin costs yeah so okay than Mr um I just wanted to add just en comment so we're also always looking for ways to save I did allude to kind of some of those things in terms of shared services speak to sorry uh so we're always looking for ways to save right um I talked a little bit about shared services with the town so that's one of the Avenues that we're pursuing um we're also looking at the EIP because there are a lot of facility related issues so it would be great to be able to get some of those Energy savings the cost associated with that and be able to put that towards some of our um our building facilities issues right um yeah I am always looking for additional Revenue uh we are looking to try to um get to the place where we can start accepting students from out of District as tuition I think I talked about it probably it's probably quite a bit ago now but one of the goals one of the things we completed was looking at all of our expense accounts looking where the PCR which is a position control roster was set up and making sure that everyone was getting paid out of the correct expense account because that directly ties into the tuition uh that we're able to essentially charge which if the tuition's too low it doesn't make sense for us to pursue you know those tuition suits from District those those are the programs we've been talking about in the past about our our AR program and our a or ABA program and bringing kids in from added district and bringing kids back and I think we're in we're into our lowest amount of added District students in uh quite some time and we're actively pursuing uh we we've made some we've had students move in District that were normally an added District school and we tour the schools to and we we've convinced several people moving into District to be a part of those ER and ab program ABA programs I just want to thank the teachers who are running those programs which they're not the easiest uh programs to support um but I'm very proud of what we're able to do for th our students and as we're able to do for our students and account for it properly I think we can bring other students from other school districts in that help set those costs as well and we're starting to do that that this year because our numbers are starting to get right for those uh those uh programs okay let's move on thank you is there anybody else in the audience who would like to say something can I just say something really quickness yeah you have to I'm sorry but there's people online they would love to hear you thank you I like to be heard um I just want to say uh thank you to the uh town mayor and the municipal um folks to try to work with the schools district to lessen some cost in some area but then I'd also like to say please don't waste that opportunity if you did get some cost cutting uh things going on try to keep it at a cost cutting situation and not spend it somewhere else if possible so thank you thank you yes uh the mayor has been very proactive and she's been wonderful yes I appreciate that good night everybody I gotta go good night is there anybody else in the audience in the present audience and we have at least one online right we have uh oh more hands are being raised but uh our first one is Bar M Mrs mow hello good evening good evening um I am a uh second grade teacher in Rowling Hills and I am also the secretary of the vtea um I would like to remind the audience once again that the vtea does not simply um it's not simply comprised of teachers our Union our association has secretaries custodians has AIDS um a number of other people that comprise it it is not simply teachers um and and to do so is being very disrespectful to all of the members of the association who are all working for the benefit of our students um I also o wanted to address a couple of things that came up with the second question um a a misstatement was made earlier we do not get reimbursed for any credits unless they come from uh a master's program they have to be approved by the Board of Education there are no more of the continuing education credits that was all uh gotten rid of several contracts ago so the only time that we are being reimbursed um are for credits that are taken at um approved College or universities it we have to go through a process in order for those to be reimbursed and the reason that we take classes is to improve the education that we are providing for our students um I also wanted to mention that while you are voting on something to um increase the number of teachers for next year and in the future that although it may um come out statistically that there are 11 students per teacher it is not an accurate Cate portrayal of what is happening in our classrooms my second grade classroom has 25 students it is probably the smallest second grade classroom and yes there is a co- teer in the room but the co- teer is there because there are students who require that co- teer that is the same in a number of classrooms in both second third grade as well as K through 12 so while you could mathematically and I love math um you could say that the ratio is 11 12.5 to1 that would not be an accurate portrayal of the class um the class is comprised of 25 students there are 25 children in the classroom so even if there are multiple people serving those children you are still talking about a classroom in second grade of 25 26 28 students the same holds true um in the lower grades um there are classes as Mr Rogers has pointed out that have 30 students in fourth grade 32 students in a classroom it wouldn't matter if there were five adults in that room there are still 32 Little Learners who need individual attention they need small group work they need to learn how to be self-directed independent Learners and um when you are looking at a question that's asking to give another adult in there you're asking that you can now have more individual group more more small group instruction and if those class sizes remain large and there is there are some that only have one teacher in the classroom that is a lot and we really do have a huge challenge in front of us to support and teach our children and give them everything that they need which is why we come to school you are not going to ask a teacher why they went to school and have them say because I don't want to help children teachers teach Aid support classrooms administrators manage buildings because their goal is to help form the future because these children are our future we don't want children who don't have social and emotional skills who can't regulate themselves we don't want children who can't work technology that can't handle adversity and perseverance and if you were to take a look at my classroom from the first week in September till now the amount of growth that has taken place in that room is incredible and it is because we have dedicated professionals we have supportive parents we have an Administration that believes in us and so I would love to see everyone have a class of 11 but I have never known it to be true it wasn't true when I went to public school and except for maybe that one room Schoolhouse uh even then I don't think the class was going to comprise of 11 students and if it did it comprised of 11 students at 11 different grade levels I have children on multiple reading levels multiple math levels all I want to do is teach them all my colleagues and my co-workers and my support staff and my Administration want to do is to teach children and as was stated last week the Vernon Town education associate has raised almost $50,000 in Grants for programs for Vernon Township Schools we raise money and provide scholarships to graduating seniors we support children we don't drive fancy cars we pour I have probably poured and I hope my husband isn't listening thousands of dollars into my classroom this year so asking us to take a not take a raise which is not 3.9% by the way because it gets scattered across a whole guide It's insulting and it's disrespectful to the people that you are trusting to educate your children thank you thank you Mrs M we have Jessie palad okay Mrs paladini evening um the comments that were made tonight were excellent and I'm not going to address those I'm going to address some different things but I do want to thank um is it Miss M munchow munchow I'm sorry I didn't catch the name mun what was her name munchow I can't hear you can you hear me Barbara shower can you hear me hello she must not have her sound on everything's I'm sorry I'm sorry did you not hear anything I said no I heard everything you said her name is Barbara munshower muner okay that was very heartfelt from her and I did really appreciate her comments um I'm an educator I'm not against Educators um you know we're talking about budgets we're not bashing teachers I would never bash a teacher but I have a couple of comments that I do want to make um I'm not inclined to support the second question and I'm going to tell you why at another time and under different circumstances I most likely would and I'm not blaming those of you who are sitting there tonight although some of you were there when some of the huge problems occurred um I'm sorry I'm getting distracted because I see Miss pellet sitting there with a grin on her face and and that's rude to me so I was distracted and really she's got that same grin on her face at every meeting when certain people talk so what I'm trying to say is that um I'm not blaming all of you that are sitting up there but you can't have mismanaged the school budget spent money on outrageous things did outrageous things such as the sabatical um sending a child out of District to an unlawful school at a cost of5 $600,000 and then say to us okay you know what that was then and this is now and we need an extra seven several million from you you you just can't do that okay um I personally find it very hard to believe that there weren't other ways to cut and I'm not talking about we know you can't cut teacher salaries but I am tired of hearing you say things like we've had a huge reduction in state aid from 25 million in 2016 to $18 million now that to me is so misleading and there are people out there in the public that don't know the facts and the fact is that you were getting $10 million a year more than you were supposed to get because the state was not aware that we had such a reduction in student enrollment so you kept getting $10 million more than you should have knowing you were getting more money than you should have God knows what you did with that money and now you say oh wait a minute but we've had a seven or N9 million reduction in Aid no you haven't the amount of Aid you're getting today is proportionate to the number of enroll it has just corrected it has stabilized and this year you've even gotten more than a million dollar more I remember one at one time and I'm not going to name the superintendent but I remember at one time a superintendent when I was a news reporter told me that the district had a reduction in state aid and when I looked at the numbers I said wait a minute what are you talking about you got an increase in state aid and the answer to my shock was well yes we did but it was much less of an increase than we thought it would be that's misleading okay so I wish you would stop saying that you've had a 7 million 9 million reduction in state aid because really you have not that is not an accurate statement based on the circumstances um I was going to ask about the 3.97% I'm sorry 3.9% salary increase but somebody just said something about that's not across the board um so I'm not going to get into that because I don't know the formula I don't know the specifics but if teachers got a 3.9% salary increase that's a huge increase I think I got a I think I got a 2% salary increase and the past five years and I'm a professional I'm an educator I have a professional career I make decent money but I have not had a raise every year I got a 2% increase in The Last 5 Years um what are the shared services with the township of Vernon a lot of people are asking that question but the answer is not very clear can you tell me what kinds of shared services you want to address what we're exploring uh so we're still exploring these uh and we're working with the town to see what will what could actually occur right so we're um I just want to say one other thing first so it's uh 3% is the increase the 0.9 uh because there's also horizontal movement that occurs depending on when someone finishes a degree uh so there's other factors that make that 3.9 it's not a 3.9 just increase across the board right so I just wanted to say that real quick um so in terms of uh shared services um when I started uh back in October uh I don't know if it was in October or November uh we spoke uh and then I reached out to the town um to start exploring some shared services they've been very supportive we've been working together there are a number of things that we're discussing but none of it's finalized yet um but for example it goes from things that are you know smaller uh as uh things like sweeping the for example sweeping the um parking lots right so normally we would say have a vendor do that uh but the town has sweepers right so we're trying to come to agreement that's just an example um other things uh that we're looking at um include things um potentially snow ping but there's some logistical issues with that we have to we have to figure that out the gas uh we already have a shared service agreement for gasoline um but other things would include uh maintenance of District vehicles uh for anything that we don't already maintain in house there's some more complicated things that we can't do in house that in those instances you'd have to go to a vendor but uh we're talking to the town to see if maybe they could assist with that um we have um different hch Basin uh around the district that are in disrepair um so instead of going out say to a vendor to get that fixed we're seeing if perhaps the town can assist with repairing those catch basins um so really they're kind of generalized maintenance items that have to occur in the district that if we're unable to do in house we would normally have to go to a vendor uh but the idea would be working with the town uh there should be a cost savings there uh since you know there wouldn't be profit and things like that and markup you know in the prices as there would be with a vendor okay sounds like all good things I do support that and I do know that mayor Rossy is doing an excellent job in trying to further that but we do need to have a resolution of approval specifying exactly what those shared services are and the costs and that sort of thing we do need to have that fleshed out um there was a comment in the budget that I'm only going to address this way it said hiring more teachers will boost state test T scores okay if you say so I'm going to be looking for that next year it was in your presentation if you vote Yes and we could get more teachers maybe that can happen Mrs palad I hope so I hope so that's what I'm saying if that's what you think I hope so that's what um look I know the difficulty the teachers have especially the elementary teachers I have a number of friends who are elementary teachers in Vernon and I know that tough job that they have and that's why I don't blame teachers I support teachers um I don't I don't buy into that um the students test scores are low because the teachers aren't good I don't buy into that um speaking of negotiating with teachers unions as you mentioned before um you sound as though you know it's it's shocking that class sizes are higher if in fact class sizes are higher I I do believe they probably are I don't know that I believe that there are 30 students uh or more in every class but part of the problem is because as a board of ed as administrators it's your jobs to negotiate with the teachers and whoever decided and negotiated that they no longer had to teach six classes a day but could Now teach five classes a day and I hardly know a school district that does that yes of course you're going to have larger class sizes because you have teachers teaching less so in my opinion that was another bad decision that the prior Board of Education made um oh I I don't understand the comment and maybe I misunderstood it and I apologize if I did but I don't understand the comment that um as far as operations the administration is in charge of operations and the board is in charge of policy and um the comment was made that understanding the budget reading the budget approving the budget doesn't happen on the board level that's a shocking statement to me of course it does well let me just finish of course it does as board members sitting there every single one of you has the obligation to read the budget understand the budget and approve every single line item I read every single line item of the V Board of Ed budget I didn't this time I read every single line item in the town budget so I don't know why you would say that that's not the board's responsibility go ahead if you want to comment Mr um so I don't know if you caught my comment a little later I think it may have been umly yes you maybe after Mr King comment uh I I forget who it was but someone else commented at a similar um similar item uh essentially so I misinterpreted and I took it as in like the actual creation and deep analysis of the each individual line what made up each individual line and not as in just reviewing and seeing the changes historically from one year to the next which is information that has been provided to the board okay I understand um thank you for that explanation and before I get to my last comment I do want to say that I think you did an excellent job Mr Slam in doing the presentation in answering questions and so far you've been doing an excellent job and everything since you've been here and I really appreciate that I for one want you to know that I appreciate that um lastly um this and this just came to me tonight because I forgot about it for a couple of years there was talk about selling the property that you're sitting on that the Board of Ed is not using and it's being used as a dog park and a community garden and in today's prices for homes and properties I have no idea why you are sitting on that property and I'm going to call upon Steve Dunlop the champion of encouraging the Board of Ed to sell properties why are you not selling that property you could be sitting on a million dollars right there and land why are you allowing it to be used to grow vegetables uh you know let the dog park people raise their own money for land and build another dog park that money should go back to taxpayers that's a big chunk of money that you could be putting in the school budget if you sell that property so is there any talk of that happening or is that just kind of been swept under the rug and forgotten about well there was talk about it two years ago right about two years ago we tried to transfer the ownership to the town so the town could decide what to do with that property but we had we had a three we had a threeyear lease with the town and then we then we renewed it for one year at a time right with the anticipation that we would try to get rid of it we first offered it to the town that's right for some sort of price I don't remember what the price was and the town was negligible amount because the idea was to transfer it to the town which would be to benefit the taxpayers and the town could then decide whether to use it in some way to benefit the taxpayers or to dispose of it by selling it and you know and right now we are using part of it as uh for our solar panels and we'd have to subdivide it so it hasn't been looked at in about two years but it's a good idea we should take a look at it again that's right yeah you you could you could subdivide it and you could still we' have to C it would cost us to subdivide one of the reasons we were going to transfer to the town was because the town could subdivide it obviously without any cost so then they would be able to dispose of it more efficiently or be able to do it more efficiently I guess that was part but it's it's it's a good idea Mrs paladini thank you giving you're welcome giving that property to the town would be the worst possible thing do with it sell it get the money give it back to the board of it I remember when you gave the special services building to the town remember that and I think you all remember what the town did with that special services building I think you ought to sell that property and you should put that money in the Board of Ed budget don't sit on what could possibly be uh a gold mine of 700,000 to a million dollars in property with uh prices these days for homes and property giving it to the town would be a terrible idea that would not save taxpayers anything if you gave it to the town it would remain a dog park and it would remain a garden all right Mrs pal thank you that's a good idea I'm I'm GNA say this in justest I have a community garden plot so am I conflicted I don't know I don't know I'm kiding I know I'll let you decide that all right thank you and good night thank you Mrs paladini all right anybody else nope that's all okay I'm going to close anybody else we just give one more opportunity budget uh I like to ask Mr slam uh I think you're using the system 3000 accounting program that um one of the things that applyed with the board secretary's report over the years it's changed and your budget incorporates uh looks like it's hard to deern where transfers or renter out of the accounts and that and to certify that the line expenditures haven't been overexpanded uh I do know that in system 3000 there's a monthly doe budget report that would mirror all that information on the report I would ask that that become part of the monthly certification and approval so we could see all that information which would augment also the board secretary's report so it just be a matter of running it and scanning it and putting in the document yeah that's that's something we could take a look at well we also are making a change uh related to the monthly transfer report yeah and the way that that's run uh so that's going to include that's even hard to follow as the where it's going to and from that transfer report or Al well kind of connected to that we're making also a change in the way the transfers are being done too so it should I'm not saying I'm I'm not GNA look at what you're saying as well right but I'm just saying that you are making a change make it easier to read there as well and then also um provides some additional information so it's a little bit more understandable see thank you thank you okay that's it closing the meeting to the public and moving on to item J adoption of uh recommended the adoption of the 2024 2025 final budget as approved by the executive coun superintendent um that includes uh so there's two parts to this uh part one be resolved by the Vernon Township Board of Education to approve the 2425 District budget as follows do you want me to read okay does anybody want no heard enough for me tonight I get it me too um so that is uh that is resolution one uh so we are doing these separately uh so start out with that all right so um item one one may I have a motion please so move move by Mr cantino second second by Miss KET discussion are we discussed out no what's that page six all right uh being that there's no discussion roll call please Mr smacka yes Mr Mr kinaa yes Mr Krauss yes Miss pellet yes Dr Ross yes Mr Sweeney yes Mr Zimmerman yes motion carries uh recomend sorry uh recommendation number two uh be resolved by the Vernon Township Board of Education that there should be two additional spending proposals to be submitted for voter approval at the annual school election scheduled for November 5th 20 24 um as follows it uh just for anyone that is not to the agenda right now it lists the the two separate questions and it says be uh resolve yeah yeah so be it farther uh resolved that the superintendent of schools business administrator slbo secretary and the board attorney are hereby authorized and directed to take all steps necessary to effectuate the terms of this resolution I have this in the form of a motion so moved moved by Mr Cino second second by Miss pellet discussion right I have a couple questions um so if we um first moving forward if this gets passed are we G would there be time allotted during our regular meetings whether it's in the superintendent's report or or the Ba's report um for more discussion keep us keep the public up to date or maybe any questions that were brought up previously to um help help educate what the point of of it is we've been waiting for this vote to probably put more get it more out to the public than we have already but it's very clear what it is and uh yes we welcome any discussion because the vote doesn't occur until until November yeah um also three more questions four more questions um are the funds allowed to be used um for other items so we you have a list of items here and let's say gets past January we decide I don't know we want a swimming pool can you take those funds and put it into a swimming pool or is it going to be is it is is it because what was voted on it has to be used for that money sorry just the not fun not so if this passes tonight essentially The Next Step that I would need to complete would be entering it in the state budget software not as part of the actual budget but as a separate tab called separate proposals which would basically be informing the county that we intend to move forward with putting this question uh in front of the public in the member and as part of that I need to list out um essentially what accounts if it did pass the money would be going into right so the money would be going into the accounts related to that expense um to I don't know if that answers full your question but essentially I I have to that those are the counts of money would go into essentially so I couldn't take it out of there and put it into Fun 12 for an interesting choice of a capital project right and then what about moving forward so we get approved this obviously would be next year's budg the school buses wouldn't be wouldn't take effect in January it would be taking effect the following school year on September right January oh we take so if we got the pass they would get the school buses the back buses back then following years it might be tricky because it might be in between Seasons so that might be it might be for the spring we have to see fair enough but we'll have some some we'll have some but but following years would that money still be a lotted you know what I'm saying is like perpetuity it's always going to be used for buses is that what you're asking yeah because I mean what if we get it back and then J after June we decide we don't want to spend the money on buses again obviously I can't foresee we none of us can foresee what's going to be in the future where there may be something that we need to spend the money on but I think most people will be satisfied you know want to know like that money is not going to disappear if it is voted on it'll the buses will be there it's not like stabilization a this is voted on this part of the budget but guarantee it though it's but it can't change something right you can't take the money and use it for something else it always has to be for buses right that's I think what what Charles is asking for each year if this is going to be a recurring expense for the town it always has to be used for buses am I right no so I don't think so obviously the intent would be to keep it for buses because that was what the the vote was for um but mean because you're asking the voters to vote for something for school buses and then maybe two years down the road well we don't want the school buses I don't think we can do that I think they got to keep using it for school bus check with the county I just I'm not sure I'm not sure exactly so that would be a commitment but not necessarily a requirement right that's what I'm thinking but I'll I'll clarify just to be sure because I don't let me find out more information and related to that you know bus costs go up every year so you know we're yeah so I mentioned earlier the CPI this year is 5.81% but that I think the only bigger issue will be if something down the road for example another state cut or another big Financial impact and then you get in a situation where you're looking at however many staff versus yeah I don't think they hear you can't hear me oh sorry just going further the first part of that question we're always going to use this for for teacher salaries and staff salaries right we're not going to change that right yeah we well we've be voting for teachers yeah teacher salaries but related to the busing I want to reach out to the county to make sure I don't know that the requirement is that you have to keep it for a busing but I think that obviously if that's at the public Bo that's what we would want to keep it as right uh but I don't want to say that 100% just because if we had like a large state aid cut again um somewhere down the road which obviously we don't want to happen uh it prob you could get in a situation where you're like this many staff versus a bus you know our intention is that it be used for as long as we can can't be tied here'll be other board members say no we don't want to use it that's our intention but if four fire systems and three roofs go well I transparent conversation I get that but you're asking the the voters to vote to put school buses yeah right and then if you decide you gonna take it away two years from now I don't want the school bus my commitment is toward that yes anduse else the intention is to reduce class size and higher teachers to do this and then that money is go the actuality is it will go into the regular budget Our intention is to keep those teachers for as long as we can that's our intention the other thing you might want to find out is that that money subject being audited separately that it was used in the the question was this I I I'll look into that but my understanding is it be part of the regular um annual audit I'm not sure and I can talk to the County VA this see if there's any additional requirements I haven't gone through a separate proposal before so this will be new for me um but I I can look into that child I'm sorry you have the floor you it's good conversation so um actually the last two I kind of I think it kind of summed it up a little bit before like one thing I look at is uh I saw you said there was a deduction in Social Security uh 100,000 113,000 I think to me that's that's a that's it's a fixed rate right because Social Security is always the same price and So that obviously means we lost teachers this year or or not teachers we lost staff I should say and we're going to replace staff and I don't think you have the the answer to my question right now but some I think Russ bringing it up when somebody else ask um maybe we could see that over the years what what what our reduction or gain reduction of the teachers and versus Administration over the you know several years if we go back um just to just so people have a good idea of you know because we had a sabatical we lost teachers then we hire teachers right but so 35 teachers 50 teachers whatever the number was and and you take but you also lost teachers so just because they were extra teachers there we still lost a a 20 teachers or so so we're almost replacing them but we only replac them with 12 so it seems like we're still behind with a number of Staff um but it would be nice to see actually a little progression of over the years so if you uh so I guess it's not really a question because I don't think you can answer right now I think you asked about some of that data before and yeah I'll try to look into future it might be a little extensive so I might have a f discussion on maybe we're talking about operating to budgets over the last couple years it gets really complicated um through the last five years because of how many change how much Chang we have but if you have specific questions I could definitely give you information so that we can compare those types of numbers are you talking about a progression of the staff size is that what you're yeah you know especially versus Administration I mean a lot of questions that we're hearing is is Administration versus St teacher size right so I don't know how you break it up because I know there's other groups in there right because uh the support staff right they're not really Administration but they're not really teachers you know to the to the idea that we uh that there was an expansion of staff and then a reduction and so the reduction didn't really count I think somebody kind of brought that up before um and this kind of predates me on the board but the previous administration have been downsizing with the retire not replace strategy and so that that um hire was to replenish staff that had been had been diminished by that retire not replace strategy over the years it wasn't just like out of the blue that we that the district hired 35 people or 40 people or whatever it was for with the covid money um it was that they were building back up staff that had been um you know downsized over a course of time right and then the idea I I think of this retirement plan was that those people would be able to be kept if enough teachers retired with that incentive program which I didn't support but anyway that was the idea so it was supposed to kind of level up it wasn't supposed to need to be expanded and then reduced it was supposed to kind of build back up and then be able to be maintained with that savings so I just want to mention that because if you go back to look at the depending on where you start it will look like oh you know the district beefed up staff and then cut staff you you you'll miss the beginning part where it was gradually being and then yeah it was as state aid was cut Yes we made we made pretty well I thought they were deep cuts at the time yeah we made Cuts seven eight years ago of $2 million in Staffing and in two years in a row and then and then other funds those cuts didn't continue because other funds were there so I think it it was it was a reduction in staff but it wasn't as noticeable because the teachers retired they weren't you know let go so people didn't really see it or feel it we did start those reductions I believe it was uh eight eight years ago and we made them two years in a row and then and then uh unfortunately yeah Co and other things happen and it's thing that like I said like the social social security benefit if you're reducing that obviously you had to reduce your I mean it's got eight to 10 staff members or you reduce salaries quite a bit so another thing about that is there was a different budgeter the current budgeter we gotta keep for a few years so that we can have some consistency budgeting we've had seven since 2020 so yeah so I mean the guys are making progress and it does show but sometimes it's a little hard to see that whe whether because things fluctuate so much right yeah especially during C years that's all that's all I had for uh this this uh um question question yes I do have a question my question is more for public clarification should these two ballot measures not pass you do have confidence that we will maintain a thorough and efficient education with the budget we just passed right to the to the level we have this year yeah yes that's what I mean okay to the level just want to make sure because it's the town's decision whether or not these ballot measures pass a thorough and efficient education will be maintained regardless right different levels of Education ex yeah possible with the resources that we currently have yes yeah and then um it'll greatly depend if they're obviously we're always striving to do our best for the students the taxpayers the staff but our biggest challenge is go back to doing Lo fund balance which we're used to offset some of those C cuts um doing reserves yeah to get back up and then it's going to really depend on what Happ state aid um moving forward because I kind of mentioned before anyone that might have missed it they are supposed to be looking again at the S2 State funding formula uh which essentially the S2 funding formula just changed the way that they funded state aid for schools so each year they would get the enrollment numbers but they changed the way that they calculated state aid based off of that which resulted in our cuts um so they're going to look at that again and we'll see what happens but if I do see something I will provide information for people to reach out obviously I think I'll I would suggest us letting it writing letter too you anybody else I I think this is a good idea to allow the people of Vernon to decide what they want to do for the education of their children I heard a lot of people say that when my children were in schooled my kids got a good education and I I'm in that same boat I had six kids go through the system and they're all contributing members of society and I think it's incumbent on the board and the people in this town to continue to do that but for the kids that are currently in school so this is letting the town decide what we should do and if we add this money to our budget we hope to provide a better result than we are have been we have been providing a thorough and efficient education we want to do it better so people ask about whether we be able to measure afterwards the idea is it gives the opportunity for the kids to get the better education with the smaller class size you know a teacher with 30 kids can do what they can do a teacher with 20 kids will certainly do better because they're only dealing with 20 kids instead of 30 okay so just numbers class measuring tests and all that are into individual kids in groups there's no measure Mark that you just check off education doesn't work like that we change a curriculum people hate it in a minute it takes a couple years to work its way through it's just the way it works you know you're not just going to hand out curriculum teachers students everybody get it in one class and move on so this gives the kids the best chance of being successful with the teachers leading the way I will also talk a lot of stuff about the UN Union and negotiations but it's more than just one un group as was spoken there's seven or eight different groups we negotiated they didn't get everything they wanted we didn't get everything we wanted but it was give and take and we got a fair deal at least in my mind but both sides got a fair deal to move on with this idea that the district is going to go in and say everybody take a 10% pay cut it's just insane it's not the way the world Works certainly Education Works both sides work to come to a fair agreement so this whole idea that the district can just bully them into something is just ridiculous I wouldn't even do it if we could do it because at one point it's just the right thing to do we you know they work hard they got a lot of challenges especially coming out of covid everybody has challenges the board has challenges parents have challenges teachers the kids themselves have challenges and I know it was a couple years ago but those results of all that time that the world was shut down are still following itself through so you know I'm for questions I live in town I don't like to pay taxes at all I understand people say they don't mind paying them nobody wants to pay taxes but you have to to get certain things you have to because honestly I'll say this about the town if you have inflation like this and the taxes aren't going up you're dying you're going backwards because you can't maintain where you are with inflation the way it is today and not ready raise taxes that's just a fact you can play games with the money but eventually it will all catch up to you okay just like all the free money they gave out during covid the reason we have the problems with the economy now is because we're paying for that that was just not free money because they get printed so you can argue whether you want this or not because the other thing I will say because I know I'm rambling on here but when I look at the crowd week after week even today there's always one group missing the people with the kids in the district today so maybe they don't have the same view about all this poor education that the people whose kids went before like mine do think is going on today because I can look In This Crowd now I believe there's one maybe two people who have a kid in the district right now so those people aren't coming here complaining about the people who complain about what happened years ago my kids got a great educ who's saying they're not getting great education now just cuz some test scores coming out of Co are crappy the whole group has been changed you know new principles either brand new or moved new administrator one of seven Bas so the board the district have mistakes been made absolutely I've been involved in some of them I own them I can't say I wasn't here I was here not for all of them some of them so you know the district needs to move forward and these questions will keep us moving in the right direction thank you thank you I believe I went over the time you did any further comments or questions roll call vote Mr slam think we need did we get a motion yeah we did we did Mr Canino yes Mr Krauss yes Miss p yes Dr Ross yes Mr Sweeny yes Mr Zimmerman yes Mr seaca yes motion carries okay thank you very much Mr slam item K student representative report I don't have anything been waiting a long time how many kids are in your classes maybe 22 to 30 22 to 30 22 to 30 thank you have some good news superintendent report uh I had the pleasure of uh attending the superintendent Roundtable award annual luncheon with Michael evanick from town on April 19th uh congratulations on this welld deserved honor I look forward to seeing uh where you'll be going going next here he's he's truly uh a student who's giving of himself and uh participates in many events uh to to to help the uh to help to school Michael your your class act the Glen Meadow and high hey guys the Glen Meadow High School string Symposium will be held at the high school tomorrow night at April guys meetings up here listen attending these musical events have been some of the highlights of the Year this year for me the Glen Meadow and high school string Symposium will be held at the high school tomorrow night at April 26 congratulations to Vernon 2023-24 pass it long scholar athlete Zach Mountain we are congratulations to Carly leid for winning first place in the Middle School Division at the wo Valley art show exhibition congratulations to Cole hex on his first place submission in his Center for preventions poster contest achieving my dreams alcohol Freight incoming lsbury Hollow students were able to participate in the instrument tests interested in learning how to play them for the upcoming school year that wasn't as pleasant to listen to with some of the uh uh other events but they're getting a taste to see what instrument that that they love um The lsbury Hollow Spring Dance will take place tomorrow April 26 roling Hills held his annual spring concert on April 24th which is well attended I think we have a board member who attended in person with a with a very happy student as well Cedar Mountain students enjoyed field trips to space farms and down on the farm an educational program held at the susus County Fairgrounds and teacher conferences were held at walner Ridge the week of April 15 there's many other things in my superintendent report if the board members would like to read at their own Leisure but I just wanted to highlight some of these matters that focus on some positive tonight also informational matters and reports I think we have a we have a uh picture uh we're pleased to not that the Cedar Mountain Primary School students as District's artist of the month for April their artwork is being displayed at the Board of Education there it is you walk in the door listen it's it's really great to see as people visit especially if they're relatives they're taking pictures of a lot of uh uh uh neighborhood kids uh and family members of of their artwork on display we're also pleased to announce that Glen M students will have their artwork on display at the municipal building during April I'll have that photo later uh recommendations I'd like to make a change I'd like to know that line 38 the date should be 4824 so line 38 on page age 10 the starting date should be 4824 there's quite a long list there letter B is recommended that the board approved its attached Personnel agenda for the 2024 2025 school year locations are tenative and subject to transfer attachment a letter c it is recommended that the board approve the professional development travel that complies with the provisions of the NJ SAA 18a 11-12 from Vern School District employees note that they their title two Grant funded in those charts letter D it is recommended that the board approv the harassment intimidation and bullying school safety and random drug testing reports um I want to note that I made changes to these that I talked about with the board um was recommended that the board approved the following policies for first reading they're all there but if you look at 5570 sportsmanship we took out a policy guide is recommended for a district that wants to address the issue of sportsmanship for its athletic and intermal program activities and a board approv policy a board May revise policy 5570 to meet local needs we're revising it so that's taken out and we're adding sportsmanship will be handled in accordance with the School Code of Conduct Andor the njsa sportsmanship policy also we talked about last time P 6520 with payroll deductions we've added at the end as long as there is no additional cost to the district so payroll deductions was not part of alert 232 moving this section allows employees to have more financial vehicles and choosing providers as long as there are no additional cost in the district we talked about those at length and we wanted to make sure that those changes were noted and uh for the first reading letter f it is recommended that the board approve the following policies regulations for a second reading and and and a final approval I think we've talked about those over the last two months letter G it is recommended that approve the board approv the early dismissal days for the schools as follows and those are the five days we talked about earlier the last five days of school it is Rec letter H it is recommended that the board approved Tuesday June 18th 2024 as a Glen Meadow Middle School advancement and Wednesday June 19th 2024 as a vths graduation letter I uh upon recommendation of the super attendant and following the disciplinary hearing the board hereby approves the suspension of student number until June 30th 2024 may I have this in the form these in the form of a motion please so moved move by Mr Cino second second M pet discussion please anybody I I had a question about the half days when that was brought up earlier yes um the five half days at the end of the school year and we were talking about uh the finals at the high school and I just was wondering if one school has to have half days does it is does it follow that all the schools kind of have to have half days because of the busing schedule or or sometimes do we dismiss early dismissal one place and not everywhere there's there's multiple ways that it can be be done found that the fairest and most Equitable way for for teachers have different needs at different buildings right so so we have discussed that at length but uh this is the this is the way most like I said I'm not for all the half days throughout the school year but at the end of the year to wrap things up to make things make sure grades are completed uh fines are collected students are able to makeup work that they have and etc etc the half days have been very beneficial based on ation with uh staff members in the district yeah okay I had never really thought about it before until it came up tonight and I started considering that and I do value the PD time for the teachers I think that was probably important and as a parent I'm like how many half days do we have this year so I can absolutely see both sides of it I was I was the same way early in the year and and I had discussions prior to it was brought up into the board meeting and when was brought up it was addressed and if you compare the two calendars to each other gotcha thank you I think Char I just had one one question there was a I lost where where where it was um number eight appointment number eight um for your recommendations letter a appointment number eight yes is that one of those those uh positions that we've been searching for for quite a while that you've been talking about uh yes and you'll also find another person retiring there'll be another situation as well um what we're trying to avoid is uh the situation we have with foreign language right now and when we have a high quality uh teacher that we know will will benefit the district to F A need that sometimes we've posted for a year or two years and have not been able to get a hire we will take advantage of that to provide that education for our students and I have those discussions with uh board members in the committee meetings as well okay I just want the board to note that uh graduation is June 19th and that is uh what was not celebrated as juneth this year we celebrate on a Friday Friday so it's not a holiday school okay we recognize that it's you know the date is significant but it's not the holiday right but the district is celebrating on that Friday yeah I get it and I have to abstain from one thing okay anybody else roll call please Mr slam voting on Mr cantino yes Mr Cross yes Miss pellet yes Dr Ross yes Mr Sweeney yes abstain from item B6 thank you Mr Zer yes Mr Z sorry Mr smaga yes should have brought two bottles of water for tonight yeah motion carries definitely should one for each kid item M uh so we have some uh informational items uh we have use of buildings and grounds as noted in the below chart tell me about item number 220 that being pulled um so that one we uh are looking into um we can pull that if uh that's how would like yeah I just had some questions for the board to note that I had some questions that uh there's no fee to be collected it just doesn't seem like it's a separate group it should be should be a fee involved uh yeah so um so just uh so it is informational so um essentially I haven't signed the approval yet um okay all right all right I understand thank you but we can yeah obviously look into that thank you move forward with anything uh we have field trips as noted below uh we have let item C uh riew list of Professional Services reappointments for the 2024 2025 school year um so that's going to be on for uh a May approval so this is just informational uh at this point um obviously we have made some uh changes recently um so we can you know if anyone has questions on that please let me know you're G include that in the work session next in the may work session too right yeah I could provide an informational report if we we want to just list it we can discuss it we'll discuss it at the work session uh we have uh recommendations uh we have letter a uh is recommended that the board approve the following Financial reports that includes a list of checks for April a list of hand checks for March transfers for March 2024 and then purchase orders for March 2024 uh as noted uh under item a uh we have uh Item B uh which is approval of the board secretaries and treasures treasury reports that's attachment F5 and F6 um for anyone that would like to review those uh then we have letter uh item C is recommended the board approve Transportation as listed below uh under two charts we have quoted routes and quoted trips as noted in the agenda uh there's also a contract addendum uh as well uh we have it D is recommended the board approve the disquisition of the following items as there either obsolete or industry repair uh that's a laminator from uh Rolling Hills we have item e as recommended the board approve 2024 2025 payroll schedule that's attachment F7 we have item f it is recommended the board approve the agreement in a matter of superior court docket number SSX hyphen lyen 0495 hyen 23 and authorize the board secretary to certify the agreement and file it with the SP Court of New Jersey item G is recomended the board approved Center for children's Behavioral Health to conduct home instruction services for run and Township School District affected March 12 2024 through June 30th 2024 amount of $95 per hour item H is recognized board approved ver girl softball league to build and maintain three sheds to store equipment at the back stops at lsbury Hollow School fields and Walnut Ridge School field vgsl will acquire all necessary materials and will use their members um members that are Builders to build them and properly and safely bjsa will also maintain repair replace these as a deterior over the years and include the board as an additional ured for liability coverage item I it is recommended the board approv change order number two for the buron Township High School fire pump room upgrade project rebidding es 950 6.01 with EI Associates in amount of $679 item J is recommended the board approve the acceptance of additional funding for the Perkins V CTE Grant in amount of 8,47 dollars and the amendment of The Perkin CTE Grant to allocate the funds item K Wasing to the board approv the data use and security agreement between buron Township School District and the higher education Student Assistance Authority that's attachment f8 get there item L is record at the board of approve change order number co1 for the water filtration upgrades at w Ridge School an amount of $788 this amount will not result in increase to the total contract value as it will be covered by project contingency funds letter M it is recommended that the board approve to accept the restricted total donation of $711 85 from the lsbury hollow SCA this donation will be utilized provide field trip transportation and field the insurance for all L three Hollow students and then there's a breakdown of those class below and I just take a moment to to say thank you uh to the lsbury hollow SCA uh for their generous donation very generous yeah that's a pretty significant generous the Seas and the BTA Pride have been phenomenal in their donations to the Sea thank you that's a that's a large amount of money Mak sure everyone's on the field field trip for free yeah that's awesome um uh may I have a motion for the 13 or so M second Mr M pet made the motion Ray seconded comments or questions yeah I have a couple um so the Perkins CTE Grant that's like additional funding or is that is that all we got that's not uh it's additional funding okay what what is that for I mean why did we get that uh you have off the top your head someone in the crowd probably yes we have our special gu yeah they gave us additional funding at the beginning of January uh they had over so they SP up so using it towards each of the program div up okay okay you me to repeat it so I don't know if everyone could hear it so essentially there was additional funds available at the state that was left over uh actually so that's federal federal government that were left over and those were split among uh the schools that participate in the program which resulted in the additional amount uh noted in the resolution question about number K it's recommended board approve the data use and security agreement between Vernon Township and Hessa why do we have a why do we have that I mean that's FAFSA isn't it it's a coordinate it's to coordinate if you've done Fafa it's to coordinate uh FASA and and Hessa so to secure uh secure uh information so it's a requirement I believe at the high school next year and for us to we have to approve this agreement in order to set things up so that uh as as students I believe it's as students um are the students going to be going in there school now has to do going to make it easier for your F and then the Hasa or or the loans no but they are going to do it in school because the state isn't the state requiring right but we need this agreement in order for for fasta to work with Hessa with it which are the student loans ET okay and that's how I pay a lot of my stuff yeah well me too and with that there were no social security no no right personal information corre right and it doesn't cost us anything right correct correct all right and I I got a couple questions to R um first um the quoted a the April Transportation quotes there's a there's one for 19,000 for a bus route um and it says destination Cedar Mountain so is that we add a new route during the year or that's I mean it's it's a high amount so it seems like Continuum bus uh I have to double check on this one I can't remember if it's related to a homeless student or if we need an additional shuttle um it's it's one of those two though it's for a student okay yeah it's it's either for either a homeless student or for an additional shuttle because there would have been overcrowding on the bus okay I know two of those things happen I just can't remember if that was directly Cedar Mountain as opposed to one of the other schools okay um I had a question also about the uh h the the the Vernon girl softball which is I think nice because I spent a lot of time back in the day going through those three Fields there with my girls but um are we going to be put on as additional insured before it starts yes yep and that's part of one of the things you want to look at is maybe um some you know collaboration with the fields and and baseball and softball and everything okay they asked about this a while ago we we've been crossing our teas and Dot and our eyes to make sure we can get it done because we know what they're GNA and how it's going to improve the fields as well nice they've always taken care yes um then I had some questions about checks um we had uh there's a one for uh I just like my battery's dying so everything's moving a little slow here mine is too computer there was uh the one for technology I can't get the comp company was in the I think it had it started with a C um looks like printers copiers 20 grandish is that monthly I think we kind of talked about this last last time some in the audience has a question about it is this this a monthly or is that um yearly cost I have to see so you don't know which vendor it was uh yeah let me try to bring it up one of the beginning ones uh Atlantic tomorrow yeah um so uh that would be so there are two things there are releases for copiers and printers but there's also the uh service charge related to utilizing them so like there's a different cost for you know you know black and white paper versus color paper but that's what those charges would be uh and we we would pay them monthly I believe because I mean that that looks like I mean be two months combined though I I have to double check the actual specific check because that that that's a lot of money I mean I I think we're in a different age now we could it' be nice to see if we can reduce that cost at cop I know we have to maybe have a copier each building but yeah so at least one give me a good segue right so one of the things uh that I've been working with it on is actually looking at the number of devices in District okay um seeing uh couple things one uh utilization to see if maybe there are ones that aren't being utilized as much uh two seeing if there are more expensive machines that we have that we could maybe replace it with something that cheaper and then three also looking at print Management Services and how that might be able to help with some of those costs with the number of of prints looking at you know machines that are you know printing a lot right and seeing if there's something we can do to help with those costs um and then there's something else related to that too so semi- related uh a little bit of a tangent we're also looking at uh the way that we do faxes in districts um and the ability to perhaps reduce some of our copper lines in District to save some money there uh and then also uh we're looking essentially C lines there's a couple different things with cop lines include taxes and um some other areas where we're trying to save money okay and I then I also saw Optimum on there I I don't know we don't do we get into that service from Optimum it's a small charge $100 but if that's a monthly fee and what do we because we switch our internet this year didn't we uh our internet is so $17 I think is the one you're looking at yeah yeah so our Internet's um a lot more expensive so that's not that's not internet um that's what because they were Service Electric or right no whatever they were called the uh service electric cable TV you're right Y and an optimal bom over so is this some are they charging us for a modem that never got picked up uh I don't think so I'm gonna pull it up right now so I can answer your question though okay cable it's cable TV for news oh news okay and then the last one I just had we're looking at that too by the way to make sure that the number of boxes they're charging is for the actual number of boxes that a are being used and B actually work these are what stuff the teachers will use maybe in the classroom so they can show curent events or something or it probably be in um like say uh a principal's office like news for if there's an event or um at the high school maybe in the weight room things like that where when the students are lifting there may be you know something on TV okay and then there was one for the auto Port store um do we do maintenance on our vehicles here I curious uh yes so we try to do as much maintenance in house um as we can to save money uh there are some limits to that which is part of what we're talking to the town about like I think recently um think lost manifold had to be replaced so that was a little bit outside of what we do in house um normally we would have to go to a shop for that but one of the things uh we'd like to do in the shared services agreement that we're working on with the town um is even if it's only every once in a while something happens it's still a savings and still adds up so we're hoping that maybe they may help us out with some things like that okay what we try to try to do our oil changes and that's what it looked like the prices definitely a lot cheaper to do it in house if we can yep anybody else Ray did you find out about that payment yeah so that is the last payment um do you want me to add a little detail on that sure you did good um so we had an not to exceed on the forensic audit of $105,000 uh they uh initially charged us a little over $116,000 uh but I obviously I questioned that and they did give us a new invoice that uh I can't remember the exact number I think it was $104 999 52 cents that's correct so they ran it right up that 105 that's the exact number I remember thank you okay roll call please Mr cantino I was out of the room in the bathroom so I'm going to abstain because I didn't hear a lot of the comment uh Mr Krauss yes uh Miss pellet yes Dr Ross yes Mr Sweeny yes Mr Zimmerman yes Mr samaga yes motion carries thank you Mr slang the meeting is open to the public anybody have any comments or questions I am gonna keep an eye on the time you do it because I wrote it I wrote mine down so that I can stay on task here so my phone's been blowing up I am highly offended Ed but I'm going to speak for the people on my phone okay 75% of the residents that work at a or let me take this back how many people voted for you Mr Zimmerman you told us that at one of the meetings I don't know I mean U Mr Sweeney I'm sorry how many people about 4600 something like that so of course I got to go do stats I got to use numbers because I don't like to throw bogus stuff at out there but about 64.5% of the population of this town of 20 and this is per census so understand my numbers are not exact 22358 people that are over 18 not seniors not children 14,420 people are eligible to vote in this town you got 4,600 votes a lot of people don't vote okay on on top of that your comment regarding where are the people well when the issues of teachers getting cut hockey buses classroom size the beginning of this year parents came out and droves why am I here I've said it a hundred times if you knew me and you knew my kid and my husband works in parcion he leaves at 6:00 in the morning he works 12h hour days a lot of people work at a County 75% by the way work out of County so there's commuting and then they come home and they have family responsibilities which I'm sure you've all done so not discrediting your volunteering because a lot of parents volunteer but don't insult the fact that people aren't here they're here when they feel they need to be here they're watching look at the stats on look at the analytics analytics on YouTube they may be watching the day after they may be watching the day after that people are paying attention they may not know what to say but I'm going to tell you my phone is blowing up so highly offended the other question I have AIDS please help me AIDS are essentially for IEP students and students with specific needs special needs they're not for the general um education to help with the teachers with the general education students they're there for specific need is that correct correct okay when I was growing up AIDS actually worked in the classroom to help the teacher so they would not necessarily teach but they'd be there for tasks so in an effort to because you don't pay benefits to part-time AIDS you don't even pay benefits to full-time AIDS and I have a few who are reaching out to me why not up your AIDS to offset some of these oversiz and also some of these parents have had children in our school system that are reaching out to me I've got like a quite a few and their kids have graduate some some have kids still in school some have kids that are in school have had some in college who say yes there are there are quite a few classrooms that are large and then there are classrooms that are about the same size as when their kids were in school so it sounds like the problems always exist of course the ones that it's hurting the most of course we want to take care of them that but isn't there another way to look at this like maybe you should just consider bringing in more AIDS since you don't paying benefits put it into the general population maybe that'll help with some costs because I don't think 16 teachers is going to be enough to fix the necessities and listen I know the parents have a discipl the parents are just as much a problem there's a big discipline problem in our school system and it rolls downhill from home I know the teachers and the administration can only do so much but I don't believe 16 teachers are going to be enough I think this problem is going to exist and in reference to the FED because that's my area with my business fed never said he was going to cut rates he said if it got closer to CPA we CPI down to two we might see rates come down we're at 3.5 for March and people are still spending so the likelihood of interest rates coming down in 2024 I don't have a crystal ball I'm not col pal but the reality is if CPI does not come down these interest rates will continue and most likely you may see something in 2025 thank you thank you Scott from Glennwood just very quickly um regarding uh Mr Zimmerman's little speech there I think it's it's crazy to infer that the district scores don't really mean anything um I don't know how you could even really make a statement of like that because they're made specifically to check the Proficiency in certain key areas that help kids succeed in life so that I I don't know where that came from um not saying they don't mean anything at all it's just one measure of success of students it's a it's the key measure it's not debatable I mean it's the key measure but anyway um I would agree that you know it'd be great if some uh parents with schoolage children were here but I know I barely had time to you know go to bed when I had my kids my age and people do commute so I think would be great if they were here I don't think they're going to vote as much which I think is a key thing you know we say we're going to put it out to vote and let the town decide on it you're going to get such a small percentage it's whoever puts the most signs out that's you know going to win we're hoping for more because it's a presidential election as well we're hoping for a bigger turnout yeah I know it would be great but anyway that was it thanks thank you Mr Dunlap hello sir Steve dun can you explain what item F was at the end the board approv the agreement with the superior court is that a legal matter that can't be discussed yes it is a legal matter and and not discuss it in public nothing can be said what it cost legal Personnel matter that's all I can tell you okay six figures no okay uh my name was invoked earlier about the uh dog park um oh somebody online right and your garden my community garden um like I'll give you some Tomatoes at the end of the year I kind of led the charge on the sale of the two properties because as I said I came to every meeting I was here for years when they said that any building that didn't house students were going to be sold and that was the root FL 15 building and the roof 94 building just before this came to conclusion uh um the board went into executive session came back out and said they were going to add two items to the agenda which I never liked because people look at agendas they don't see anything important so they don't come so I was quite upset the night it was at it and that was Mr wire and Mr Spartan and it was um to sell the route 515 building and then to look into giving the rude 94 building to the Historical Society I stayed up for three days without sleep and went through every minute for a three-year period and highlighted everywhere that any board member talked about selling the two buildings and so at the end the building was sold I gave a copy of this package to every board meeting except two that refused to take it um they should have recused themselves they shouldn't have even been part of the boat one was a lifetime member of the Historical Society one was the previous recording secretary for the society and they were two of the yes folks to give the building to the Historical Society after it was over I kind of got bashed and said why didn't you go up to the dog park and I said well I didn't know that the school owned the dog park had I known I would have probably gone after to that as well I know there was discussion about selling it to the town for $1 I spoke at the time saying I thought it was completely inappropriate for the school board to be giving prop property that belonged to the school board to the town for a dollar I don't think we talked about a dollar I was here that was the amount that was mentioned I think the dollar thing came Char to rent so they fin said we didn't have an amount for those they finally said we are not interested in buying it because we have a vision of having a dog park and a municipal Garden as part of our town center project and that's when you went from the year-to-year lease yes that property was there in case there was a need for another school I was on the board when we purchased the property I think we know at this point that it's going to be a long time before we need another school I had a problem with getting rid of um Walnut Ridge because if in fact the population started to grow again it'd be very difficult to take that school out of mothballs and reactivate it or would' be much more expensive to build another school so I was hesitant about moving it I was glad that they moved the administration over there [Music] um there was talk about selling it but they said they had to remain to have an access to get to the solar panels and the board at the time I think Kelly was there in charge they were looking at uh subdividing it and um they said that they would have to get an architect to come in and lay it out the way that it would be and then assess the value and offer it for sale I think you should uh I think it's a town responsibility if they want to have a dog park if they want to have a community garden I don't think it's the school board's responsibility to be providing that and with the Dire Straits that we're in I think we could use the money that could be collected from that I think it's a valuable piece of property uh I'm not a real estate agent but there's some in the crowd that come and they could probably give you a good idea what that's worth so I think it is worth another look things get talked about and then you got of fall to the way side I keep hearing the the teachers union Representatives always talk about it's not just the teachers union it's also the janitors and the AIDS and the school resource officers I sit right here in this room where the AIDS were brought on and they were it was spe specifically stated that they wouldn't be part of the bargaining unit they wouldn't be in the union turns out Steve kept just ignored that put them in Union the SRO they have a they have a pension they're former policeman they will not be part of the Union they will not be part of the negotiating contract come in six months later find out they are I said to Mr kepus I said to David zwire you need to call them in set them down tell them a mistake was made paid them the money that they put into it and tell them they are not part of the Union they are not part of the negotiating I don't think anybody that's here now was here then but I watched all this happen and things are said and they say they're going to do something and then something completely different gets done um Russ Russ inherited this mess he didn't create this mess the previous superintendent who nobody ever wants to name but Karen the and Chuck McKay have got blood on their hands they created the mess that you guys are now trying to dig yourself out of but when I hear people talk about oh we lost all this state aid we lost all this state aid you also lost 40% of your customer base you went from over 5,000 students to under 3,000 students it only stands the reason you're going to get lesson state aid and they probably should have been cutting it sooner than they did so I don't think that we used our resources the way we should have I don't think that we reduce staff like we were like we were reducing students I came in here one night and said if my board if I gave my board presentation and said I lost 40% of my customers and they said well what did you cut I said well I didn't cut anything I still have the same staff I still have the same number of buildings I would have been walking out of the room with my stuff in a box before the day was over and I just don't see that that happened we we I say we the board did not take action at when this was happening when these Cuts were being made but you can't you can't just blame it on the state taking State eight away from the from from the school district when you lost 40% of your students we had 5,000 students in a $67 million budget couple years later we had 3,000 students in a $66 million budget nothing was cut and at that time our teachers our Administration and teachers represented about 73% of the budget I sat across the hall one night for three and a half hours when they had a budget presentation and I said guys we just sit here for three and a half hours and you never addressed teachers or administrators you only address 25% of the budget until you do something about the what now close to 80% right oh that's a I believe it's closer to 70 closer to 70 that's just people from a public talking right it's um I have the exact believe so around 70% follow of our cost our fixed cost with Administration and teachers but nobody wants to talk about it I think the last contract that was was negotiated gave them 3.9% a year for three years that's definitely not true that's not true you know notice 8753 3.25 yeah the average of three average of three which was the county of that was a previous now you're in the middle of negotiating one right now right or you just did one we're on the three next year is going to be the three of the the middle of the contract you're on the second year of a threeyear contract right now we're on the second year of a three-year contract because I remember when I looked at it I thought it was the same amount every year 3.9% a year no 2.75 27 3.25 correct next year's three I can't remember I can't remember there being a year in the last 20 years I could be wrong but I can't remember a year when there was not a salary increase well that's incorrect too there was a freeze for a couple of years I wasn't on the board at the time but there was a few years where all the teachers were frozen on a step really yeah I didn't know that it was prior to my being on the board prior to being on the board this last time or the previous time this last time the last a few TI were I think that the I think that the UN I think that the negotiating committee has been very generous over the years I know that David zwi was the one that went from the five periods and 8 period day to the five periods and nine period day and I know one of those periods is launched but you still have a nine period day and teachers are only required to be in the classroom five of those so it only stands the reason that you're going to need twice as many teachers if they're only obligated to be in there in five I think they've always had five High School it was always five but it was five of an eight period day no you have a nine period day well the one is La but it's a nine period day and so the teachers are only in the classroom five of the nine it was five of eight now it's five of nine when it was eight it included a lunch the percentage was 75% we just found it then they came up with the they came up with the uh scheme to give them a stien and I remember walking out one night and I said to Dill Higgins he was on the board I said what is this stapen they're always talking about he said well it's the amount of money they get to teach a sixth period at that time it was 20% so if you had a teacher who was making $100,000 a year they were paying them an additional $20,000 to teach one 140 minute class for 180 days I understand that number is now down to about 10 or 12% I think it's 11 so there has been a significant reduction in that yes 11 okay I said 11 or 12 11 but it wasn't that long ago when it was 20% I think when Karen deino showed up here it was 20% I find that very very generous so I think there are cuts that can be made I don't think there's been the amount of cuts that that necessarily should have been made I know Russell is facing a real problem with things that need to get done that doesn't have money to get done but I started adding up the number of Administrators the previous superintendent before came up with the plan that if you weren't in the classroom he didn't need you and I got rid of a lot of Administrators and then Karen came in and put him back in youve got a head of this department head of Department getting late I'm sorry it is very late we got one more PE person who online people online yeah one more wants to say that it's getting late again I I know you guys have got a have got a very a very difficult job but I think you've got to look every day at ways that you can cut you've got to find ways to cut more thank you thank you promise I'll be so quick I just want to address that I agree wholeheartedly with the the testing and how that just is a microcosm of a little bit not a mic it's late so I'm rambling it's not the whole student I teach English if you looked at my English scores in high school you go with this woman doing in the classroom I have kids that are horrible at testing that are creative they are artists they are singers They're actors they're sport a child is more than a test score and we're testing that's not out of these kids think back when I was in school I remember one test California achievement test we took it no big deal it was done we didn't think about it that's not the measure of a student Educators know our students we know if they're progressing we know if they're falling back everybody wants to check off that oh they did this they did this if everybody got a hundred on this test that means every child is perfect well no I'm sorry children issues children have needs we teach the whole child that's the one aspect so um I just had to put that in there thank you very much much SP um anybody else here Ang uh we have Jesse paladini Mrs paladini you have the floor thank you talk about a phone blowing up within 2 minutes of that horribly insulting comment that was made I got six text messages two of them from people sitting right in that room so we are old and we are stupid and we don't have children in the district and we're complaining but the parents who do have children in the district are not complaining first of all I have two children two grandchildren in the district and I care about education and I care about our schools and You're darn right I'm going to be monitoring what's going on in our schools Reay you know I respect you and you know I like you but that was such a a horrible horrible insulting comment to make and I think you owe people an apology because I am so offended by that comment and I'm going to tell you another reason why parents don't complain because they fear retribution and retribution is very real and I could give you examples of it I won't tell you the idea identities but I could give you examples and those parents with children in the district that you say are not complaining guess what I get private messages from them every single week I have dozens of them you really really need to apologize for that comment with regard to Steve Dunlop yes I did invoke his name but it was not in an offensive way I said it in a loving way Steve if you're still there and I said it because I knew that you would support selling the community garden and the dog park that's why I said that and he is correct it was $1 I heard it it was suggested to me by a board member and it was to give it to the town for $1 um and I also just want to add that as far as the member who was on the board of ed Steve is a little bit mistaken about that and I'll discuss it with him tomorrow the member who was on the board of ed that advocated giving the Historical Society the building was not a member was not a life member and had not been a member in a number of years when she sat on the board as far as a recording secretary I've known no idea who that was I I've been the president for almost two decades I have no idea who that recording secretary was but I want to end with saying Ry a lot of people looked at you and said you have a lot of integrity and you handled that forensic audit meeting perfectly you really need to apologize for that horrifying insult thank you and good night good night right we're going to close the meeting to the public open public member Forum item oh just one thing Charles I want you to go first thank you but uh I just wanted to say um we lost a a member of our community too last week or week a former student so I just wanted to put out my condolences to Tim's family family he went to school with my son and um and then what what also on that I um Russ you mentioned student achievement do we do something to honor these students I know you you bring it up in the board but we have plaques on the wall for sports and everything else do we have a spot for all these uh like you bring uh Evan Nick down to the superintendent Round Table we have a spot for that in our schools so kids can look forward to that and and for achievement we discussions about different types of achievement walls maybe we could bring that up with high school as well um there is a luncheon for what the top academic celebration luncheon yes academic Excellence L yeah would be great yeah so future children students can look forward to I listen and was what I'm really eager at has been I've been going been asking guidance as to the acceptances and where the kids are going to school because I love every year getting a the kids of um who's going who's who's going into a trade who's going who's going to a technical school going colleges and Military and what their Majors what their majors are so I look forward to that every year we're getting really close to put that together for everyone as well to celebrate the uh the end of their uh their public education in Vernon for 13 years is that really is to get them to those goals because like we talked about before the plumbers electricians craft Crafts People a military uh students it's it's nice one of my favorite things is talking about students and what are they what are they doing what are they looking to do next year and it's not always about college it's about what what are you looking to do in life what kind of goals are you setting for yourself Beyond school so they looking into it anybody else I have homework for board members we're going to about goals the next work session need to do some work on that please and I will do some too anybody else ready to go Motion to adjourn second motion by m Cano seconded second Dr Ross all in favor hi I very