e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e okay and we're ready all right P the meeting of April 11th Grand toship Bo education work s to order uh may I have a motion to go into full session for purposes of discussing legal and Personnel matters a it just says call to order doesn't say no rooll you must have been on vacation okay roll call please Mr Rock Mr saglia here Mr Cina Mr Krauss Miss pellet here Dr Ross here Mr Sweeney here Mr ziman here we have a hor barely all is it recommended that the board enter into Clos session for the purposes of discussing legal and Personnel matters may I have a motion please second Mrs Magle Mr Zimmerman second all in favor I the post we are in closed session we retire to the other room e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e e the okay we recommended that the board return to public session I have that in the form of a motion please so Mo move by Mr Zer second by Mr pel all in favor hi hi it's what time is it seven 72 okay we are now in Open Session may have a roll call Mr slam Miss Brock Mr sagad here Mr Cantina Mr Krauss Miss pellet here Dr Ross here Mr Sweeney here Mr Zim here we have a quorum please join me and rise for pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America to the rep for IT stand Nation God indivisible with liy and justice for all I have a couple comments before the meeting before the reading of the me meeting notices it with sadness that I let the public know of the passing of board member Elaine Kiani Elaine passed away on Sunday April 7th I spoke with her husband briefly yesterday and said her heart was really in the Board of Education and its activities it was evident that elae truly wanted to do the right thing for the children of Vernon Township Schools also the Vernon School Community lost a very special former teacher Miss Lori Nelson Lori passed away on Saturday April 6th she was a kind and loving person who made an impact on all the people that she came across Lori was active in the Teachers Association and taught in Walnut Ridge Ceda mountain and Rolling Hills I also recently attended the celebration of life for a beloved former teacher assistant principal and principal of lsbury hollow John pasy Mr pasy worked in Vernon for 31 years from 1964 till his retirement in 1995 Mr pasy was one of the pillars of this school Community his kindness fairness and leadership ability truly made lsbury Hollow a special place John passed away in February of this year we will miss Elaine Lori and John on and our thoughts are with their families at this time recently uh these three members of the Vernon educ education Community passed away and they were all part of my educational Jour Journey here at Vernon in in different ways um Board of Education member elain Kiani was proud of her faith and family and gave back to her community serving on the board of education Lori Nelson was a master teacher who warmed everyone with her smile positive attitude and love her children uh John pasy was a role model and he was my principal here at lsbury Hollow he was a teacher a teacher an assistant principal and principal lsbury Hollow who was respected and led by example I would like to please have a moment of silence for Elaine Lori and John thank you Mr slam the New Jersey open public meetings law was enacted to ensure the right of the public to have advanced notice of and to attend the meetings of public bodies at which any business affecting their interest is discussed or acted upon in accordance with provisions of the ACT Vernon Town ship board of education has caused notice of this meeting to be published an adequate notice has been provided and notice of this meeting has been properly posted in accordance with the New Jersey open public meeting law uh just a couple of notes uh there is a special board meeting that will be held Tuesday April 16th for board training purposes and then the next public board meeting will be held Thursday April 25th 2024 that will also be um the uh approve the budget hearing for the final budget thank you Mr Rogers you want to take this uh next we have a presentation a lot of people have been talking about our new math program in the in the lower grade so we have our uh experts who's been helping us uh with with the program and in the uh in the in it first year after um after piloting it last year so we have a presentation from Anova mat the new K through math program by Albert vola and re Vata R and mark thank you both I appreciate you thank you for coming and sharing your your expertise with us about the we need to move are you GNA use this yep they are I'm get it all set up wonderful may I try for a second if I can oh yeah that's perfect oh good afternoon um and again thank you for having us um my name is Mark Mark saaba I'm one of the founders at noet H my background is in aerospace engineering I'm from Barcelona Spain and today I'm joined by Albert if you want to introduce yourself yeah hey you lit but I will um help you with some questions at the end probably um my name is Albert and I am a professor back in Barcelona math education is my speciality I'm originally 10 years ago I was a high school teacher but then I became more and more interested in elementary education my PhD is in elementary education and I've been teaching at the University for a few years now and helping districts in the US to improve and to um Embrace uh this math education program that we are trying to implement thank you thank youber um yeah I'll be leading today but afterwards when we get to the questions and anything that you want to may may want to ask we'll both be answering so um just for the sake of introducing ourselves so um today we wanted to speak essentially about this five six points um essentially telling you sharing with you um where does innovat come from and what's our purpose and how does it work and also of course answering questions and any kind of inquiries that you may have that's um what we are here for and we would like to start with like a very simple statement of what we do and what's our purpose as a company and as a organization and it's as long as this but I want to kind of short it a a little bit and tell you about um how everything started so inovat was founded in 2017 by a lot of people who truly believed in what math education truly is which is these three points for us so what inovat tries to do is to truly make students understand math rather than just going through process like a lot of us were taught when we were in school and I include myself and I believe a lot of us went through that kind of education when we were at school that's Point number one um we call it generating deep conceptual understanding of mathematics that's Point number one point number two is going beyond the contents that's also something that we were very used to when we were um young and we were learning math sticking to the contents learning how to add how to subtract how to divide how to multiply which is of course the essence of math but it's not only that math is way more than just knowing contents or just knowing memorizing things it's also about problem solving it's also about reasoning it's also about being able to prove conjectures about being able to communicate those ideas in a structured way that's the second main goal at inov and the third goal is breaking that myth that we believe happened many many years ago which was that math is just for a small Elite of people people that I'm sure that you remember that kind of sentence that I heard a lot when I was a kid um you're a math guy a math person you're a numbers person or you're not we do not believe in that we believe that math should be a science where everyone can enter with obvious difference differentiation between persons that's for sure but everyone should have access to that those three pillars have been yeah the base and the foundations of innovat ever since we started in 17 and the road has been well it has been an incredible journey and I also wanted to tell you a little bit about that and to show you how is in novat right now um so yeah through these seven years we've done a lot of things we've interacted with a lot of districts with a lot of schools and I wanted to tell you a little bit about how Innova mat is today so Innova mat right now is a global math education organization I'm led by 350 people more or less um we all come from some kind of math background we we just focus in math we're not a traditional textbook publisher and we do not do other subjects such as Ela such as science such as Etc we just focus solely in math the 350 people who form in noat are specialized in what Albert was saying before which is math education we are operating with more than 2,000 school around the world in nine different countries of course Spain where we originally come from but also Italy Mexico of countries in LA in Latin America such as Ecuador Colombia Brazil um and Chile and ever since a year and a half ago two years sorry and we've been also working with American districts where right now in five different States including New Jersey Pennsylvania New York Illinois and West Virginia um we're helping districts transform the way in which math is taught in the classroom with obviously following the three pillars that I was telling you before right this is just a little glimpse of who we are of course I'm glad to share this presentation you will have this presentation to check it all together there's a lot of numbers and statistics there if you want to check them um deeply or we can also get into that afterwards in in the question section so I just wanted to make that so that's where we are right now yes not only that but we are also a group of people who have been able to find support in one of the main probably the top um at Tech Venture Capital here in the US which is Rich Capital which has backed other many other um us and non- US companies that have had an immense impact in both in the US and in the rest of the world such as nearpod which I'm sure or maybe not but um you might be familiar with that as such as class do Jo well a great um other company started here in the in the US or new zeala Etc quite a lot more and we were able to get that support two years and a half ago and it's been just an great impulse in our impact in our mission in our journey so yeah also wanted to point that out um and this is what I wanted to get to because this is the core of what Innova m is um like I said before we are 300 almost now 350 people that's not the updated number 320 we keep growing you know every single day um but out of those 350 people that I was telling you about we have uh more than 10 team of phds in math education because like I was saying the core value at in noat it's not just publishing textbooks it's not just printing textbooks or workbooks or work sheets it's truly understanding understanding the science of learning math and that's what math education science is about so all the peop you see there um including Albert who you can also see here have had their education in like I was saying math education and have been learning through many many years the science on how to build deep conceptor understanding mathematics that I believe is one of our main Essence and our main core values when we partner with the district and that lead me to this next part of my presentation which is all right Mark but how does this partnership look like and I wanted to State a strong point here which is again we're not like the conventional traditional textbook publisher that you may have um known for many many years and I mean other companies such as hm Savas and Pearson there's so many around the world we are not like that because one like I said before we focus in math ucation which is our solid purpose but also the way in which we partner with districts goes Way Beyond The Core Curriculum which is the traditional idea of what a textbook publisher does which would be essentially the First Column that you there so yes that's one part of our partnership with beron Township School District and we do provide all the teaching manuals for teachers all the student books for students all the manipulatives for the classrooms all the digital access that students and teachers may need but that's not the only focus that we do when we that we do when we partner with the district that's one part of it but the other three pillars that you can see are also essential to truly get that three pillars that I was talking about when I started the presentation so we're also providing the digital practice that students are going to need in order to solidify and to consolidate all those learnings that they are going through when they are in class and doing Hands-On activities with the manipulatives and and conversations and discussions with their teachers that's the second point that we do we're also providing all the assessment and intervention tools that the district may need in order to track the progress of the both the program itself but also of course the proficiency and the performance of students learning math again not only in the assessment part but also in the intervention piece which is a key aspect in early ages in order to prevent differentiation sorry in order to prevent gaps through learning differentiation that's our third uh main point of action and the fourth thing that we do and we are heavily invested in that um actually tomorrow we'll be back again here at Vernon Township for that precise matter we are heavily invested in professional learning when I said that we were trying to change the way that math was taught in the classroom with those three pillars that I started this presentation with I have to be honest that's a huge shift it is when I say that I see it with I say it with seven years of experience going through more than probably 1,000 schools all around the world I've seen a lot of teachers change the way in which they teach math in the classroom to a better way when I say A Better Way I mean it because that's what Research In Math education shows I'll get to that point in a sec the research part but I've seen that change and that change typically comes with frictions comes with we all carry back from when we were studying when we were little and we were learning math we we all have our preconceptions we all had our education things change for the better and professional learning is key to do that change right and that's the reason that Albert and I will be tomorrow here again conducting professional learning and the way that we've been doing for ever since we started in September 2023 and partnering with Veron tension so yeah so these are the four main points of actions that we do um when we partner with a district which then again it's way more than just the student books that families may see at home or the digital practice that they may have a peck into that's us all right where all where does all of this come from and this is an important P that an important point that I wanted to talk about today all of this doesn't come from the brains of a couple people back in Spain thinking about how math should be this all comes from the top notch top leaders in math education research all around the world actually one of those research centers is here in the US the nctm which maybe you're familiar with again the National Council of teachers of mathematics has been leading probably leading the um math education research around the world for the past what help me here 30 4 years probably um actually their math practices which was um published in 2001 um which also led to the next curriculums that were later the next sorry standards that were later on um set here in the US and all around the world actually um has been also one of our main references when building inovent but not only the nctm also enrich at the C at Cambridge University has been one of our main sources of of of Investigation also the utre um university with the freudental Institute has also been one of the main leaders in math education research all around the world and of course the recommendation of the oecd um which I'm sure you may know as well I'm tend to this Competency Based I'm learning have been trending to that Competency Based learning for many many years all this has all this and many more many more but these are the four uh pinpoints that I wanted to do today is the essence of what we build and you may ask that's good because you're basing the program in research but are you also conducting research regarding the impact that Innova mat is having because you could also make point right like it's important to base your ideas on research but you also have to execute them well and that's what we've been doing for the past three to four years when we started our own research centered and started partnering with third party oops I'm sorry okay and started yeah and and started partnering with third um party um research centers this here and then again I'm not going to get very deep into all of these studies um I have a zoom in of each afterwards um again you'll have this presentation you so you'll be able to check all the different studies that we've been conducting but these are some of the studies that we've um recently um conducted starting with an ficacy study in oh I'm sorry by the way I'm referencing number two because I wanted to start by number two um starting with that efficacy study that we started sorry I said two I meant three my bad um starting with the efficacy study that we conducted with the standardized tests in Spain um I believe a year and a half ago we started conducting that study which showed um amazing results in the performance of those students who had been going through in novat for several years also studies validating our intervention and our assessment and intervention tools um such as the art artist um study which shows that after our intervention um the percentage of students who leave the risk zone of math learning disabilities goes up from 51% to 81% with 53% to 81% which is also an amazing impact for an assessment intervention tool and then again so many many many other studies regarding efficacy that of course you'll be able to see here um this is the one that I was U mentioning first the one that showed um the the Improvement in results in standardized tests um but then again that's not the only one that we've been conducting um results in standardized test are important yes of course but there are many many other um things such as readdressing struggling students with the intervention tools that I was telling you about um few minutes ago um also why is it important to tackle intervention in such early ages we also conducted studies on what was the best age to conduct those inter interventions and we showed that that was in early first and second grade because there the gaps are still close enough to actually act and prevent those gaps from getting bigger as students move on to higher grades and not only well that's exact same study not only all those studies that we've been conducting ever since but also the ones that we're conducting right now um studies on math anxiety students uh sorry uh studies studies on student outcomes studies on students engagement regarding math which also has been proven to be one of the main indicators of um future success in math um all of this is Again part of our Essence we're again not just a textbook publisher that prints workbooks and teaching manuals but a research center ourself in math education okay so all of these are the essential pillars and Foundations on in no but there's a last point that I wanted to talk about today before getting into more questions and more um interaction which is our interaction with the community which we believe is also very very very important um I'm sure that you may have seen couple things here but our interaction and partnership with districts does not stop at the district or at the school level we also believe that the community I mean families pars and Etc are important in the education in regarding maema education of students that's the reason that we've developed and keep developing and that's an important point because we're still constantly developing new tools um to interact with families and from family webinars parent nights we've done a couple of those here at Vernon me myself I was one of them and I believe Albert you were the other um but not only that kind of interaction but also a synchronous interaction such that such as the minute strategies that we came up in order to help families understand this new approach um to math education and of course all the other um academic research that can be found in our blog and in our website etc etc this involvement with the community is also something that we want to stand for and that we have a strong opinion on and we want to keep interacting with the community and that's the reason that we're also doing this presentation today because we wanted to give and share um what in NOA m is with you I really hope that this clarified a couple points on what Inova m is and then again both Albert and I were glad to answer any other question that you may have and that you may want to ask so thank you again sure please so I know you only been here a short time but how are you finding the Buy in from to for the teachers obviously B but also to whatever degree parents in general in the dist in this District so farth wonderful um so I believe that we both can speak um to that but I have a lot of experience doing this um this kind of implementations for many many years my answer is going to be it's and I don't want I I don't want it to sound um bad but it's just like the implementation that I've seen any other PL one of the things that happen and let me elaborate a little bit more on that um answer one of the things that happen when teachers start using innovate is that they truly feel a change with what happens in the classroom the main change let me point two things is that one students start being the center of the lesson the classical approach that we all went through was a teacher getting into the classroom right I'm sure that you all remember this and this has a name actually I do we do you do I come into the classroom I tell you how I don't know multiplication should be done then we all do multiplication as a class to practice a couple examples and then you do it individually until you've you know mastered the idea of multiplication that's an approach that has worked for a lot of time do not get me wrong we're not saying that that approach is terribly wrong I mean it has had a lot of benefits including myself I mean I went through higher high level education in math and and I was fine but it has room for improvement and the room for improvement is actually allowing students to discover what a multiplication is and this has been proven Again by research over and over over again to have way more lasting effect than just me telling you how to multiply but this is one of the big changes that inovat stay to the CL that's Point number one point number two is that Inova mat doesn't follow the traditional approach of unit one unit two unit three I'm sure that you remember that when we went to school we probably did I don't know additions or let's say divisions for three or four weeks straight remember and we did this IU we do um you do dynamic for probably four weeks until we all as a class had mastered Division and then we moved on to the next chapter in math and we kind of understood math as a set of blocks and you know this again has been proven by research to be again it's not terrible it's not the worst thing to do ever yes of course but there's a better way interconnecting content and jumping from One content to the other so maybe one week touching upon multiplication and another touching upon Division and another touching upon addition and then going back to multiplication this is what we call a spiral scope and signal and again the benefits of this are essentially two I wanted to make it clear for for you to understand why this is important one it gives interconnection it gives Vision to students to connect mathematical Ideas Math and this I mean probably Albert here is the best one to to talk about this um because he has had even more mathematical education that I've had but I've gotten to a high level of Education in math math as a science it's not compartmentalized this is an idea that we as humans have developed right but multiplication division are essentially the same thing addition subtraction are essentially the same thing there's plenty of connections between all L of these contents giving that spiral allows students to make those connections way better than we are comp compart compartmentalizing those that's Point number that's benefit number one and benefit number two I don't know if you found yourselves in that kind of situation um I always like to put this example because it's really illustrative I don't know if you found yourselves in the situation of watching a full season of one TV show in one weekend I'm sure that some of you have done that I've done it myself what happens after a month when you have to watch season two you forgot probably about half of what you saw because you saw all the chapters all the episodes in one night or in a couple nights that's and of course do not get me wrong I'm not I'm exaggerating this but this is to some extent what we kind of do when we work by units especially with early ages when kids are little you know and through three weeks we are touching upon addition addition addition addition addition and then we jump to the next idea in math what happens when a year goes by summer goes by and all those students go back to second grade let's say and now they start doing additional again because it's the the first unit in second grade A lot of them have forgotten about the algorithm a lot of them have have forgotten about the procedure that they were supposed to follow and it makes sense because we pushed all together in a very tiny amount of time and then we assume that some of them had mastered this idea if other than doing that we're constantly jumping from One content to the other we're giving more space to settle down ideas but this has a counter effect which is we were very used as teachers and as parents to see our kids and our students go home by the end of that unit knowing how to multiply or knowing how to add now it takes a little bit more time but it's way more permanent long lasting when you think in the long term it's way more beneficial to do that spiral I'm talking about when you think in short terms it was obviously more efficient doing the other um approach but then again are we looking for the short term or are we looking for the long term so answering your question again these two things that I just told you the dynamic of the classroom and the spiral sequencing are the two main differences with any other approach that we've done before the what I see with teachers here at Veron is the same that I've seen with teachers any place around the classical initial you know friction on wow is this actually going to work is this actually going to have a benef a benefit for my kids this is really different from what I was um used to do and this again of course maybe it's too bold for me to say trust me but trust me when I say I've seen this process in so many many many other schools around the world for the past seven years it takes time we're not going to change and shift mindsets from one night to the other I don't know if that's from one day to the other it takes a little bit of time and we're exactly in that process doing things such as tomorrow meeting with our teachers and going through this professional learning with them together with all the other resources yeah that was a long answer sorry for that but it's okay thank you I got it thank you um I have one too um you mentioned Early Intervention which is the term that I've always associated with before school even starts here you know working with kids who have uh issues maybe but um but in you're talking about it in terms of a classroom with a child who's identified as maybe having a gap of some kind how do that how do you handle that in the J sure um absolutely so what we mean by I mean there's many interpretations of intervention right I mean we've seen this again around the world um our approach to intervention is focusing in first and second grade that's something that again we did our research and saw that the gaps were smaller and first first and second grade and got bigger as students went to higher grades so we decided to Target first and second grade how does intervention look like um we generated a universal screening test that actually what does is goes through the classroom right all students go through that are able to go through that test that's something by the way relatively new we started um implementing this year by the way um after the research that we did last year that showed the efficacy of that tool but let me explain um so once we've done that um Universal screening which is focusing in arithmetic fluency which is one part of mathematics quite an important part um arithmetic fluency is the ability or skill I mean longer than what I'm going to say but pardon me but it's the ability and skill to do arithmetic operations in to perform operations thank you once we've done that screening a recommendation comes up what a recommendation means is that throughout the whole classroom there may be some students that may be at a low performing zone right what can we do I mean now we have the information information but information without action what what is it going to be it's not useful right so after doing that what we propose is going through an an RTI to I'm sure that you're familiar with the term response to intervention which is like before seeing this gaps get bigger let's act so here it's where we came up with an intervention tool that lasts for around 15 weeks and it's a higher exposure to the digital practice remember out of those four columns that I was um telling you about number two which was the digital practice that students do for once 45 60 minutes per week more or less we recommend a higher exposure to that practice specifically we recommend 15 minutes per day four days per week during those 15 weeks and it's not only an overexposure to that practice it's also an over a targeted overexposure what I mean with targeted is that the activities that are going to be appearing and and those specific 15 minutes are targeting the idea of number sense the idea of number sense is exactly that making sense of what a number is how after this 15 weeks that I was telling you about we conduct the universal screening again what we expect to see after this procedure and what we've shown that happens through our research which actually you'll have it in the presentation by the way I believe and if not I'll add it um I'll add the link to the to the what to the research yeah to the yeah to the paper to the published paper in awesome in SN magazine um what we've shown and what we expect to happen is that the amount the number of students that get out of that low performing zone is way higher than what would have happened if we hadn't done anything right but not only higher but significantly higher and if we get into Data what we showed with our research last year was that um without intervention so a control group would typically be around 53% of students who left the low performing area with the intervention tool which what happened was that 81% of students left that low performing area which then again this is T this is targeting what it's targeting those gaps that happen in first and second grade when the curves are still close together when the Performing curves are still together in order not to get them bigger as they move into higher bus so even though we are attacking sorry for the word but attacking those issues in first and second grade and we're also preventing those gaps from getting higher in fifth sixth middle school high school so that's our approach um on yeah sure please and then what happens with the 19% that is not there right then those kids are candidates for a diagnosis on any maybe discal kolia maybe some learning difficulty is dyslexia and we are not doctors we are not psychologist we are not saying this kid but we are saying okay this kid did not response and that's why that's the the name of this kind of interventions is response to intervention these 19% of kids that do not respond to these 15 minutes 15 minutes a day per 15 weeks those kids need someone to check what's going on because something is going on and then the school decides what to do with that but at least we have the and we have a the opportunity to act before it gets it gets too late and your um curriculum isn't available in all grade levels yet right because you're translate I'm sorry your curriculum isn't available in at all grade levels yet right so what is the timeline for for that per question so um as an organization we've developed inovat from 3K to 10 so covering almost all K12 um education but here in the us we decided to start K4 the reason why is because and this has happened not only here in the US but everywhere that we've started um partnering with schools um so I could actually give the exact same answer if I was asked this question in Italy because they also started K4 actually so what a coincidence I hadn't thought about that but what I mean is that whenever we um adapt our curriculum to a new region and I'm talking region not only country because as you know in the US there's different standards and different idea between state right whenever we do that we go through a thorough analysis of the standards in that region and what we do is we map all of our sessions to those standards what typically happens is that there's not a perfect match which is completely natural because of course different regions bet on different standards which is completely normal and completely fine completely valid the thing that happens with innovat particularly is that we are so so so obsessed about building the proper knowledge building path for students that we do not have the ability of immediately grabbing all those units that may have you know like imagine that we saw that in fifth grade um we were mismatching in I'm going to I'm going to just invent this okay okay we are mismatching with fractions I don't know whatever we do not have the ability to grab the fractions unit from another grade and just bring it down or up like that why because what I told you about with the spiraling remember that spiraling takes time what we do and that's essentially what Albert does at the company um Albert and the other PhD team what we do is we analyze all those standards and we rethink what's the best way to build that Pace to match those standards so when we arrived in the US and we decided to start partnering with schools we wanted to be sure that the program and the curriculum that we were offering um districts matched perfectly with the standard that we're going on for those specific breads so that's the answer to why we're still not prek to 10 here in the US to the second part of the question which was what's the timeline with that um we plan to develop to adjust not develop because it's already developed but we're adjusting this thing that I was telling you to adjust a grade per year from now on so essentially um what we're planning to do is in September 2025 getting everything ready from prek to five going then to prek to six on September 2026 then prek to Etc so we're planning on doing one grade level per year we believe that that's gives us enough space to do it with a perfect quality a perfect adjustment and not having to rush uh so yeah so that's uh regarding the time so how will that work for some of the kids who've had it one year and then move in back to their traditional curriculum because you don't have it yet good question this actually only going to happen with um fourth grade actually if we think about it because third grade right and absolutely so let me be very clear um the traditional approach to math it's not a bad approach so it's it's not a bad approach it's not a terrible not a bad approach it gets the job done what I'm saying and what we've shown is that there's a better way so what we're planning to do is for those kids who jump to fifth grade next year I'm being able so if let me let me phrase even if the whole curriculum is not completely adjusted to match and to check all of the standards in that specific rate there's plenty of the standards that have been checked so when I'm when I am saying that there's not a perfect match I mean that there's around 75 80% match so that means that 75 80% of the standards are well covered by inov them they're just a couple of those that are not there so and what we plan to do is still offer and in an open way so completely um allowing teachers to access for free all the resources in that specific grade so next year will be fifth grade yeah exactly and for them to be able to track all of that and complement it with the other um curriculum that they are taking in place so what that means is that we're neither doing nothing neither getting 100% % covered right and of course it is how would I say it the most beneficial if you think about it like when I said the traditional way gets the job done but it can be improved and it can we won't be able to improve it at 100% but we will be able to improve it at a quite high percentage so that's I'm regarding that set okay thank you yeah um just touch on a couple topics we just touched on before um so when you said the assessment and intervention um was that were you talking about the whole class is going to be assessed and then you redo the curriculum for the whole class you do this intervention at 30 extra minutes or whatever with the or just the students that are not running it and how does a teacher if that's the case then I guess because I see you nodding so how does the teacher teach one thing and then now these other kids have extra and how do they how does that work okay good question so then again I also want to be very clear with what I'm going to say now um what inovat does every single time is putting resources on the table right but we do not want to replace the teacher and this is a very important um thing that I want to put on the table today we do not intend to replace the teacher teachers have higher than 80% of the impact in the class and I just invented this number okay 80% what I'm trying to say is that they're the highest impact for the students they know the students they know more than math because remember we're focusing on that specific part of eviction but there's way more about that there's all the social emotional components there's all the all the ideos syncis that happen for every student in the class so that comes first which means that all the resources that we're going to offer such as the assessment like you were asking are going to be tools for teachers to then decide what they want to do with those students what I'm trying to say is that one amazing Tool uh which is which has been proven with a lot of efficacy is that intervention tool of course teachers could actually opt to not use that intervention of course we will recommend them to use it because it makes so much sense and it has been proven to have results but then again the reason that I'm you know saying all of this is because for specific cases things may vary and for specific students things may not be the same so our idea and if you want to hear about our recommendation our recommendation is for all the class to keep going through the regular instruction regular curriculum that we've developed because we believe that's the best approach to building all the contents and for those students who may may be at that you know risk Zone that I was telling you about we've developed one amazing tool that can lead to very good results so we strongly recommend to use it but we are also very aware that there there are other great tools for those specific needs that can still be used we hope with time that we are able to keep developing those kind of tools but of course we're really open to teachers to use others so what I'm trying to say here I'm sorry for the vague answer but is that there's always everything is always under the criteria of the teacher what we want to do is to provide the best math education tools for them to then use in in the classroom but nothing is ever going to replace the teacher judgment on each of their students because no one knows them as well as they do so yeah you have our recommendation but of course it will always be open to the teachers cre I also think that please no no um if I understand understood well um the question was also about the the because we put in the same box intervention and assessment and to diagnose which kids are in Risk you need an assessment that assessment goes beyond just diagnosing kids with difficulties assessment is grading assessment is standardized test assessment is providing feedback to the kids in an everyday basis and I don't know if we have time but we could could dive into all as markk was saying all the resources that K teachers have in their hands when it comes to assess they have um from worksheets or workbooks that can they can correct at the end of the session as any teacher would correct any homework they have the possibility of create their own tests they have a weekly report on the app that provides also data in a weekly basis for every kid no matter if they are in an intervention group or not any general education kid will be in that report so it's about Gathering Gathering data from many as many options as as possible and then assembling all this into the results at the end of the of the term or of the year what we don't do and I think you mark were going that way um what we don't do is telling the teachers what is the grade of that student that is yeah only the teacher can decide that only the district and the school policies can decide that what we do provide is evidences and as many evidences as possible of the learning of the kit the platform the workbooks blog books any conversation in class can be transformed into rating but we are not saying to the teachers if a kid says this it is a 10 if a kid says that this is a five no we don't dare to do that we only provide the environment and all the support that we can to interpret all these um evidences for the benefit of the of the kids and let me say this and I'm now my my my code as a as a professor assessment is not only grading I know that we are all very that data oriented we too and we want our kids to perform better in the standardized test 100% that's for sure in our in our goal but assessment is not only giving a number actually in elementary we have plenty of research that says that giving a number to a kid means nothing if I tell you this is a five out of seven yeah but out of 10 yeah but what do I do with that number when I'm six years old five out of 10 yeah but how can I get from 5 to 10 where is the where is the ladder from to to go up and that comes with feedback that comes with onetoone conversation that so what I'm trying to say is that assessment is grading is a little thing within the world of assessment which is navigating the kids Through Math education our idea of a teacher is a GPS the teacher is the one navigating the kids um and the kids need to walk the kids need to discover a teacher is not a car kids are not getting in and the teacher is driving no the teacher is just providing the directions but kids are the ones walking if that makes sense so so um that data you just you were saying so that they'll see on on the app or whatever does that so does it one teacher can they see the entire grade level because I'm just thinking like if if maybe one one teacher is learning doing better at fractions right and they can see that the other classes are doing way better than them they can teachers themselves can work together and start saying where where where are you doing better at it right so absolutely yeah that that's yeah yeah that's a depends the teachers share this information and this is this conversation and and from what I know in Veron this is happening yes of course and as teachers sometimes you do a great class sometimes you don't have a great day and the class was was a little worse and that week you were not the in the best of your of your moods as any other human being and you might see okay that class did better that week um okay let's have this conversation and learn all together and since we are coaching and meeting with the teachers in a in a um I I don't know the frequency but at the beginning it was in a in a weekly basis now we're spacing it a little more and we're having more long-term PD but in those coaching sessions I've been meeting with teachers from September like in a weekly basis with every single teacher that is using in noat and it's a very wonderful conversation with them this is working great my kids are not getting this what can I do and it's a I mean there's no magical solution teaching is a challenge teaching is hard H it's about partnering it's about listening to them and working together and if I may add just one specific thought about about this because it is true I mean this kind of frequency that we have with teachers um we intend to keep it of course um when Albert says that we space it is because we know that at some point you do not need like our help every single week but I also wanted to point out that the way in which we act um I mean Albert and even me um when we the way in which we act when we have this meetings it's always from remember the math education perspective so even though we are very and sorry to say this it's not me braging at all but even if we are very knowable about math education because that's our specialty and that's what we're good at um we always have 20% of the picture because we know about what are the best methods to teach math but we are not inside the classroom we do not know the children we do not know the community ideas in Cris of every single place so we are always giving our advice from the math Educators perspective which again I believe it's very valuable um from a district point of view and that's what I've seen for these past seven years as a school to have a set of experts in math educations helping me understand how I should be teaching math but then again remember that it's just specifically in that area of knowledge yeah I think it's great that the teachers kind of like nav because that's you know I think it gives them more control and puts them back in what they probably thought they were going to be in the profession to do you know and bringing those kids so that's that's great um and and I know you're talking about my son's the Aerospace too and he bring home a testbook for question that was like 20 pages long and he was so proud of it so I know how you guys get a little bit about that so uh but I also had we have um so um again what this was Jen's second question she said about the you know you're going next level next year is going to be fifth grade right so I'm already now what about those students that are always going to be in that new year because now it's not the students have been a little bit familiar but now the the teachers are always so they're almost like they're at a disadvantage because they're teaching the teachers are behind now because the students are have been going through this the pro the pro program for a couple years and this teachers is brand new to them so how do we address that okay um that's a good question so I'll tell you my point of view um you always have to make a choice right um and every single thing that you do in life you have to make decision right and to make that decision you have to balance things out right um when we did our recommendation um to Vernon School uh Veron Township School District um on on how to act um on that specific group we were very um consistent with what we've seen for the past seven years even if a student it's not going or a teacher is getting that set of students like you were saying even in that situation it's way better to have a small piece of this kind of make me think in the classroom of Make Me Reason make me try and solve problems than having none so yes it is true that the perfect situation well actually the perfect situation would be that we had PRK to 12 tomorrow morning and we were able to do that in every single classroom of course in the world but you get me and and all the teachers were um already had already gone through all the professional learning that has to be done um in order to properly feel confident and 100% you know expert in the in the subject that's not going to be true so then again um I completely agree with you um so there are going to be better situations than other but I could also make a point like Albert himself has gone through many years I don't dare to say how many but you've G through many years of your education as a professor and your experience as a teacher and of course it's going to be better that Albert dies Albert teaches a class now a math class now that seven years ago when he was just starting his teaching experience and his mation background but we have what we have we have the resources that we that we have and what we believe is that all this professional learning that we are providing um to the district to the teachers at the district has a cumulative cumula accumulative sorry accumulative effect um on time so yes somebody has to break the ey yeah yes exactly but at some point we have to start doing that and at first it's going to you know like it's gonna take like um I believe it was Mr Zim okay Zim I was reading oh yeah okay good awesome my mistake um was asking like yeah I mean there's GNA be teachers who this is the first year you know that they're going to he asked about the confidence you know about how comfortable you feel with doing that kind of approach some teachers are going to feel more confident some teachers are going to feel less confident but that's just normal the same way that anyone feels more confident or less confident with math in their life and I'm sure that this happens if I ask to the room like what's their perception of math we would have very different answers I'm sure about that and that will happen but the key here is what are we doing to change it and to make all teachers very very very comfortable understanding math and getting to that point but of course like Albert was saying we need to break the eyes at some point and and yeah there are going to be scenarios which are not going to be ideal but are going to be closer to the best possible option and I also want to say that you have a a great stuff a great teachers here are willing to and are open-minded and are also very like very critical when they see things that don't work and they are asking the right questions and of course it takes time but I I am very confident when I come I'm I'm very excited to come tomorrow for ridd because every time I come even though sometimes there are concerns and I would be even more worried if they weren't any concern because when you change you have to ask yourself questions is it better from what I was doing is it not and all these conversations that are happening I think that are an investment for these teaches that will last forever neverthe it doesn't matter if they work or not with for the whole life it's a a a change in their mindsets um and not for all of them most of the teachers that have in quartered in in in ver in Township their background and their understanding of math education is pretty much aligned with us it's a matter of okay how do we translate these ideas which sound amazing on paper to the reality of the class to the standardized test that's that's the that's the thing I mean if we say that we want kids to think I think anybody would agree with us that yeah of course we need need kids to think but then okay how do I do that yes mon Monday at 8 how do I do that until June and in an everyday basis and targeting and and and and completing this the standards for every year how is that possible and that's where inov gets into the equation and provides all these resources but I don't want you to leave uh today's session thinking okay these people is trying to change the mindset of all these teachers not at all and the proof of that is that when we started piloting one year and a half ago with these teachers they felt pretty comfortable with our ideas and of course there are some things that need to be improved of course we have gathered tons and tons and tons of feedback that are very uh very much implemented and during summer we will meet the teachers again tomorrow in the session I will meet them and talk a lot about all the concerns that they have been seeing along the year before the standard that'ss come so of course there is plenty of room for Improvement on our side on the teacher side but I don't think that this is a inovat coming here and shaking the tree yes a little bit of course but the seats were there and the teachers are comfortable of course with some concerns which are healthy healthier for the relationship and I think it's how research works and how and and a scientific approach Works everything you do you need to ask yourself is this better is this nice is this good is this bad and and I think that I wanted you to live today thinking okay these are these guys are all going in the same direction as the teachers we can debate on how this approach goes to the everyday class but the Horizon that we have I think we are pretty much align with administrators and teachers um my concern or comment is the teach teachers and the students you mentioned a lot students are the students they're looking to learn that's good the teachers will adjust as they get more confident in the program they see results they'll be fine with it you know as time goes on more and more will'll adjust and figure it all out but the other element is the parents are involved and so there's the old way to teach B is the new man I'm going to say this is the new newer man parents have even figured out the new math compared to the old Ma so I mean without aling every math teacher in the district but maybe you need to have some sessions with the teachers we not this type of session but you actually teach the parents you know use low-level types of math not geometry an but just even how you teach it now so they can help supporter cuz you know I'm more the coach than the teacher team that I had where the parents bought in and like the coach was 10 times easier when they were looking to string me up on a tree because they kid didn't get a shift last game so you know to me somehow I me I know how it would be done that's why I don't want to alienate all the BT teachers but they would almost to teach the science or the mechanism of it to the parents to a degree that when the kids go home they don't go what is this yeah and the parents are breaking out the cardboard multiplication table study this thing you know because that's the other element to it I mean the kids are in school with the teachers I full confidence the teachers will be want can I I'm sorry I couldn't agree TR really I couldn't agree more and allow me to say that's something that now I'm now I'm going to talk from a company perspective you know like um I've been doing this again for seven years um since the very very start and as we've moved through the years we've been encountering different challenges yes I believe that probably the first challenge that we found was being able to change teachers mentality like you were saying before I do believe that we're past that not not in the sense that we've already changed the mentalities of teachers all around the world not at all but we already know how to do it and we are doing it step by step the next challenge and again I'm truly talking from a company perspective the main challenge that we're facing right now is being able to communicate properly to families because what you just said resonates so much with me right now that I couldn't agree more just to give you and this may sound like a small piece of trivia but um in catalunia which is my region the region where I come from in Spain um 50% of students in the whole state do innov are using innov that means that literally one out of two families that I come across when I walk through my town from an 8 million population know what in Noom is when I walk through my town again what out of every two persons that I people that I meet know what in noad is that's a huge amount of people and getting to properly communicate to all of them is probably one of our biggest challenges right now let me say that I believe that that's a wonderful challenge to have because it means that we are truly transforming things in the way that we intended to and the same thing that you just said like amilies or parents figuring out what you called and I agree with you what you call like the new ma or it doesn't matter the name but we we we understand each other um it's it's not an easy fit and I mean let me go back just a second we all went through a very different kind of education and again I want to be very um precise on this it's not like it was a bad education we're not saying that that was a bad education it was used ful it get it got the job done it just that it can be done better and that's the reason that we are trying to improve things but when you do that and I completely agree with you again um frictions arise because it's like I get my kids home and it's like all right I didn't learn that way so sometimes I even feel like how am I supposed to help how am I supposed to you know like to understand what's going on in your classroom I completely agree that that's one of the main challenges that we have and things like the like what you just said like having um sessions with parents um helping them understand teaching them these new ideas all of that there are so many things that we're doing as a company targeting that specific issue um such as meetings like the one you said but also within the same program building in um you know like family letters and family Pages for families to be able to understand what's going on there Family Videos we are doing a lot of things but I believe that that's like the next challenge we're working on that because it's not an easy fit and all I can say is that we're completely aligned and that we're working very hard to also communicate that to to families yeah and the concerns are there of course and for instance in Catalonia we have one out of two parents that know what inovat is and Twitter sometimes there a partent says oh I don't understand this a picture of one of our of our books and I don't understand this what is this new math right well let me say it's not new that new and and my approach to this is first when we sit with this people who are concerned when we sit oneto one face to face we invite them we go like we are here today um 100% of the times after a conversation they are like ah okay so this is not that news this is thinking okay I'm good let right the other day I was in a in a session with families of parite um and there's this engineer par and I an engineer myself so I can criticize a little bit engineers and sometimes we're a little um proud of ourselves and and this parent says I'm an engineer and I believe that the algorithm is the best way to do any operation they work always and it's the best option said great then I asked him 1,1 minus 997 and the parents goes it's four where is the algorithm no but here where is the algorithm no but in this case that's precisely my point the algorithm is useful yes sometimes but sometimes it's not sometimes it's better Mental Math sometimes we all carry a calculator in our pocket when do we use the calculator when is it nice to use it when is it not nice to use it I'm the the math guy of my crew Will Go On Restaurant when the time comes to split everyone looks at me do the division you are the math teacher am I doing a division after two glasses of wine no no no no this is doing a division right so does that mean that me and my teacher does not know how to divide no is that in that moment in that environment with my friends I am not dividing with pen and paper as it happened 50 years ago because times are changing does that mean that my kids do not need to know how to divide not at all but can we readdress all the efforts that we were making about just the algorithm the algorithm the algorithm into other ways of thinking and understanding because yes thear parent you are an engineer and you understood how to do mental math and do 1,1 minus 997 in your head but how many kids are lost in the way how many kids are not Engineers today because the algorithm was the only solution and then my point even at the University where many students still today 20 year old students that are soon becoming Math teachers and and asking me but you you are against the algorithm no I am against starting with the algorithm the algorithm needs to come when kids understood what is to add what is to subtract what is to multiply what is to divide then when you understood what's going on we do the algorithm as one more way to do it but of course that comes with a challenge because parents are used to okay the algorithm is what we have been taught and that needs some time need some time to see that okay the mental math that you're doing we're just the voting sessions to explicitly talk about this Mental Math explicitly talking about and we try to avoid the word that in noat is a methodology we are not a method we are not a closed list of steps that promise magic and every kid will understand everything know we're just trying to gather all the knowledge that is out there and let me say it's a work in progress there are publishing papers on math educations every day thousands of them we try to gather the best ones and we try to go to conferences we try to be there presenting our stuff in front of other math experts and listening to them and trying to just be on the loop and listening for instance these days AIS are on the equation what are we going to do with that I honestly don't know yet but at least we are there listening what is going to come with AIS well I don't know but we will be there listening and doing our best to keep track and be at the top uh Tire of of of math education because lucky for everyone especially for me we only have one Focus scope in math yeah and that allows us to go very specifically to very specific congresses very specific readings and and research and and yeah that that keeps us on the loop but going back to the original question yeah yes families is the next challenge we're starting to do a little little things but still a work in progress I hope that in 40 years when this probably earlier in 20 years when these kids are parents we have been we will have completed one Loop and everything will get smoother but as for now of course we have this frictions which are great again if I go to a district I Implement in noat and no parents come to see me and say hey what is this I would be concerned I mean parents that care that's what I want parents that come to these sessions par that that are watching us online and saying okay what is going on here I want to know that is what I want and then of course and and talk to us ask questions and and and work on it and be open-minded watch this videos see okay this is another way of doing it is this replacing the old algorithm no this is an alternative to the algorithm one more strategy as any other strategy that makes the number sense and the understanding of operations better and I don't want to get technical I'm much worse in in Spanish but in English I can talk forever so I'll let Mark continue that's perfect please you said about the uh professional learning yes and and so are you certifying teachers is there what what what is that process like yeah um that's a fa question um we are not certifying teachers yet um but we are plan on to that's something that has been going on our minds for many many years now and we believe we are at a point in which we can start certifying teachers in a probably I don't want to I don't want to catch my fingers here and say next year but probably in the few next year we'll start a certification program for teachers who have gone through this um professional learning um then again just to um um to yeah give a little bit more elaborate a little bit more on the answer um the same way that there are different certification organizations in other um in other subjects uh for instance I've seen a lot in English by the way in in foreign countries like in my country of origin for example in Spain there's a lot of certification around English teachers um I haven't seen that much um in math um it's something that we intend to start doing um but we wanted to start focusing on you know like first the professional learning but yes we will definitely certify features so how how is it done here is it like a train train the trainer kind of yes still well essentially I mean there are a couple um actions that we do when we do professional learning I'm just going to um specify a couple of those okay one are the coaching sessions which we conduct in a kind of alternative frequency because we started doing weekly by we week by week but then we try to space them when you know like when it's not needed like week by week so we are constantly you know fine-tuning the frequency of that coaching sessions essentially mean it's virtual oh yeah it's a virtual yeah sure session thank you Robert so virtual sessions um so the coaching sessions are virtual and what we do in those sessions is talk about like what exactly what issues are you encountering you know um as you move on with your students that's for the coaching sessions and that's one of the pillars of our professional learning then there's three more so another one is the PD sessions when we talk about PD it would be something very similar as to me or Albert getting in front of a room full of teachers and talking about one specific topic when I say one specific topic there's plenty of them I could now engage on a 4-Hour session on how the number line um works from first grade to Middle School the number line is a model of numbers that represents number in a line and it's very useful when you start using um well to start jumping forward and backwards to start adding and subtracting then it's very useful when you get into middle school because you can start introducing negative numbers just turning the um number line on the other side I could go on and on and on for four hours talking about this the same way I could do that with the composition with the number line I could do the same with the composition strategy which a different strategy to add and subtract I could go with the area model which is for multiplying there's a lot of different things a lot of different topics that we can talk about we plan all of this in advance in our um reference model but then we adjust depending on the needs of the of the teachers okay that's a second um action that we do regarding professional learning and then there's two last those we typically do in person by the way and and then there's two more um that look very similar which are class modelings and class interventions class modelings and class interventions are a Dynamics in which we help teachers see how the class Dynamic should look like for those teachers who want to feel more confident you know like with that remember when I said that there are two main things that change within novom mod one is the spiraling and the other is how the session looks like because it's very student centered and they are the ones who are doing the discussions and you're just guiding like Albert said like a navigator like a GPS getting to master that I mean mastering that way of that role as a teacher it's not an easy tip especially for those and I'm not saying that there's a lot of teachers here in Advent who come from there but there are teachers everywhere that come from a very I do we do you do um traditional model um in order to help doing that we conduct both class modelings and observations which is essentially like a modeling of a session or an observation and then giving feedback for them to you know like improve their um teaching practices these four things that I just set on the table we combine them through the whole year and the frequency like I was saying before changes as we you know we fine tun it through the through the year and yeah that's our kind of professional learning how it looks like then I got one more question I know of course's probably tired of hear me but um so you so 2017 you guys started so seven years you guys so H has anybody have you nobody's completed the whole K 12 K 12 no okay so all right other countries we have um students that have completed um first to first to fifth grade or k to fifth which would be the elementary um stage of Education um so yeah we have that but complete prek to 10 um not yet actually oh yeah one of the studies that we did so that one there the one that was focusing on standardized test in Spain you know like seeing how they had been doing was specifically with kids that had gone had gone help me here I don't remember if it was five or six years five of in noat I believe it was five years of in no so that would be from first to fifth grade all right so yeah what was your biggest gain and what was your what was the least favorite good question so other than that other than that which is like uh you know like a very objective measurement of them improving be so performing better in standard dates test um I prefer way more the subjective feeling that we get from teachers it's t it typically looks like that like right there on the bottom I don't know which of the questions there again you'll have the you'll have the presentations but those numbers there are like 85 84% and 75 77 and all of that those are um surveys that we conduct every single year with all of teachers it's a big um mass of teachers a big sample um it right now it's 18,000 teachers all around the world and we typically get like 60 70% answer rate so it's quite a lot of answers and the gains that we typically see are things such as I see my kids reasoning way more than they did before I see my kids way more engaged with math than they were before starting I see my students um talking way more more I see my students being more able to solve problems um Nuance here not problems in the classical way like um John has three paks every Peak has uh gives like four gallons of whatever um a year you get me um like in the true sense of a problem like what do you do when you do not know what to do that's the actual definition of a problem and we all encounter these kinds of situations in our day-to-day lives how many times have you found yourself not knowing what to do I don't know about you but me a lot of times in my work in my life in a lot of situations what you do when you do not know what to do that's what defines you as a good Problem Solver or or not and that's one of the main takeaways when we ask teachers what do they feel about the gains that they've seen with the student so all about reasoning communicating engaging problem solving everything that has to do with going Beyond um cont good thank you well again thank you so much for having us it was an honor really and yeah we will always be open to do this kind of meetings anytime you want so again thank you thank you'll tomorrow thank you to see you tomorrow it's a good idea thank you very much we're gonna have to pause for a minute uh everybody can get up and stretch their leg we don't have a y we're all done well at least for now thank you right oh jeez yeah that's annoying we just take a break till we get a quarum back e e e e e they do have the parent fors sentences okay we're we're back we have a quum okay so uh there's one of before we open the meeting up to the public I had a couple of uh items of old business old business at one of the meeting at one of last month's meetings there was a question about children of teachers who live outside the Vernon School District who attend the Vernon schools currently there are 12 students who fit that category and at present time there will be 12 next year okay there was another question regarding legal fees budgeted for the 23 24 school year and for the 25 2425 school year right I believe the the 23 24 school year number is 129,000 and change I got that from Russ okay 129,000 412 and next year number it's 115,000 yeah that's okay and then there's a question about an expenditure uh about t-shirts the vendor was rooster tees I think the question was how many shirts were involved and there were 195 shirts and the shirts were for the cclc program at Glen Meadow the funds from that comes from a grant which funds the entire program were there any other old business items I I think I that was everything Russ do you remember anything else that was what the public asked okay is this where we would follow up on the essay no no do that later I promise all right okay now I'm gonna open the meeting up to the public uh the meeting is open to the public anybody in the audience would like to say anything you have the floor and thank you for sitting through yes well that was very interesting actually so interesting to see a different method of teaching math but sorry Scott you have to identify yourself oh sorry yeah Scott Castle from Glenwood um first off you know I just want to say really good comments on uh Mrs Kiani we only spoke with her a couple of times but she was really nice and um I think she had a good different type of take on things which was good for the for the board um last time last meeting I had some pretty long- winded comments um regarding the budget you guys prct unplug my microphone at one point but um so I won't go over all of those again I'm hoping that some of them will be cleared up on the budget update um but that leads me into my my comment which is I think that's a great um agenda item to keep on these meetings is a budget update where we can uh you know I went to the town council meeting on the budget and a question was asked by somebody else that was really good which was you know once the budget implemented that's when the work actually starts where you have to start monitoring the budget all the way through and I think I don't know how that happens here with the monitoring of the budget but I think if we can monitor the budget give updates in these meetings on you know where do we stand how are we tracking if there's something's going over um you know what are we going to do about it so basically have a dynamic uh budget and with remediation ideas on there on what you can do so for instance you know uh Transportation went up more than we thought more than we budgeted for so our remediation steps are going to be you know we're going to cut out this conference we were all going to go to you know whatever it is but you can kind of track it all the way along and I think that helps for a couple of ways it it helps for um the public to understand what's happening as opposed to being surprised every year I think we see you know costs that come in and it also helps for next year's planning where you you know you already know ahead of time and everybody knows are kind of on the same page that you know this did cost more um so I I was hoping that that could stay on and just you know an update on there I know some of the some of the costs you don't know until you know they come in at the end of the year whatever it is but I think there are some ongoing things that can be monitored on there um my other comment was at the end of the last meeting um Mrs pellet I believe had a comment that um you did do a line item review of the budget and I was curious if well how that was done because I think different people interpret line item reviews differently um but how was it done and were there suggestions on cuts that weren't taken were taken all of that because again I think that's some of the transparency I know I personally would love to see um I do a lot of budgeting at my my work um I'm very interested in it and you know for me um a line item review is basically you have the line item you have the proposed budget number you have what you spent last year or if it's a new item you have you know a comparable project or whatever you have if it's an increase a decrease stay in static and then you have a justification column on why that previous column is either an increase a decrease or staying static and how uh you know I'll do it with some of the bigger budgets is I'll take two of my key people on the team they'll do the exact same thing but separate from me and then we kind of compare them at the end so we're not doing it as a team doing them separately you get some good ideas in there and I'm hoping that something like that can be done here with a couple of the you know a couple of the board I don't know who it is but a couple of the board members and Mr slam or whoever it is that can kind of go in there because again minor uh cuts and changes even if you know fractions of a percent or 1% or whatever on a lot of line items actually can add up to something that you know maybe is a is a cut um so I think that was were my only comments and like I said I'll I'll I'll uh hopefully some of the other questions I had will be answered in the in the update so thanks thank you Mr Castle good suggestion about the budget say we we have uh some exhibits every month that you provide to us that show how things are going but we don't discuss them at board meeting uh there's monly transfers uh with the number of account lines that are in the district uh will be very time intensive to really look at every single purchase that happens and say well this came in higher this came in lower uh we look at it more at the level that you discussed which is I look at the accounts I see when transfers get made um in terms of the budget process uh we this is my first year here obviously uh but we did go through operationally you know Administration uh we go through every single line uh didn't go up did it go down why did it go up uh okay this is why it went up well do we really project that's what we're going to need is just the cost of something went up is it inflation uh is there an alternative uh and then once we get to the point where we finally get our state aid uh numbers just one of the last pieces of information that we get uh because it's after the the governor's address which is usually at the end of February um then we finally have our final picture of Revenue because I already have the rest of the revenue figured out at that point uh we go back and we look at what else can we cut out of some of those lines um and in the presentation uh I'm not sure if I have it online if you didn't catch it the slides and also the um presentation itself is on YouTube um I talk about some of the cuts that we some of the bigger cuts that we did make based off of looking at because I do look at the historic information from the current year but also the past year uh and then just projecting out with you know some information I do have like for example Transportation uh I know that the CPI which is what they they can renew a transportation contract at was 5.81% but I also know that not every vendor is going to renew at 5.8% the only thing I don't know is how many will and how many won't right so you just kind of have to project with that information what do we think is you know a fair estimate of who will right U hopefully the beneficial way would be everyone Rue to 5.81% and then then you know where you are um I don't have the numbers in front of me right now they AR part of the presentation with that for example in transportation what that increase was um but I talked a little about a little bit about that then too so we're looking at last year the current year projecting the next year um and looking at those increases and decreases and then once we get that final Revenue those final Revenue numbers we take another pass through all the accounts uh that try to cut more uh to balance the budget and we've been very detail oriented uh because from last year to this year we cut 52.5 positions full-time positions so this last budget we created and we're doing the same we're very detail oriented because we do not want to cut any more and put any more of a strain on on the the teacher and teacher student ratio Etc so I'm very pleased and if you have questions I'll tell you what if you're asking for a budget presentation from Mr slam here um he'd be more than happy to answer questions and present on a regular basis and he has done so and I I think reached out to the board as well uh if if they have questions about uh budget and I do Post those uh we read to the business office page so there's a uh a presentation section where okay uh and we're trying to put more information up there just uh so it's easier for people to quickly access it uh the one thing I do also want to add is in addition looking at the expenses and I talk about this a little in the presentation even though we're very limited and the of revenues that uh we can gain as a district I also review our revenues right um so one of the things uh one of the first things I did when we got here was what our interest rate was on our savings our checking account it was 0.15% I knew what I was getting in over because I got them that I got him 4.85% in Dober and I got us 4.85% here and that was unbudgeted Revenue which was really important because without that Revenue our balance right now would be a lot lower and that was about a half a million dollars for the year so yeah I'm where I can I mean created where I can to not just make Cuts but also in inst where we can uh get revenues get additional revenues because what that does is offset uh the need uh for increasing taxes uh and part of that is also uh the fund balance that I've talked about a few times now where the balance you end the year with um is being used in the next budget year as a revenue that's that's basically a form of reducing the taxes uh in that year now we are in an unfortunate situation where we've received about a cut of $7.5 million in state aid I think from be 17 18 to now um that's almost 10% of the budget uh so we're in a situation we're trying to make up that Revenue in an environment where there's inflation and everything the cost of everything is going up um and that just puts you in a situation where your fun balances has been used your fund balance is now getting low your reserves are getting low uh and we're limited by the 2% with the exception uh of an enrollment adjustment which right now enrollment is flat are going down um or Healthcare cost adjustment which I include in my presentation and that's only allowed in very specific instances thank you Mr probably more answer than everyone wanted but good good there's nobody else here so we'll go online uh we have Carolyn Inc carnado is this Inc carnado good evening thank you for taking my call tonight um I first want to extend my condolences on the loss of elain kolani um she wasn't on the board very long but it's so sad that we lost her so I just wanted to say I'm sorry to all of you for losing a fellow member thank and um also on the loss of Lori Nelson she taught one of my children she was an extraordinary teacher and that is um deeply felt by by me and my family as well so I'm very sorry um for that um the second thing I wanted to mention is I appreciate very much that the questions that were asked in previous meetings you address tonight you know that is really really helpful that we know that if we ask a question and you don't have the answer at the table that we know in the future you'll get back to us so I just want to thank you for um getting back you know on some of those questions that were unanswered in the past um and past meeting so um I don't know if the gentlemen are still in the room that presented on the math program did they leave oh no I'm sorry they did leave no that's okay you might be able to answer my question or if anyone there is on the curriculum committee you may know um with respect to the new program are there other New Jersey school districts that have purchased this math program that are using it this Academic Year or in the past you know that we would have an idea of the you know of the track record of this program and the success of it and how it's improved their scores or anything do we know if anyone else in the state is using this program at the present time go to the mic Please Mr gagle asra will answer Mrs oh thank you uh I know in New Jersey uh the last I heard was there was three other districts besides ours um but that was at the beginning of this school year and you know as you heard from the gentleman they're expanding uh quite a bit so uh the other states in the country I didn't even know they were in them yet so uh it could be higher than that but from the last I heard it was three other districts I I heard in Pennsylvania last year I I don't know where and not long enough for test results right or or yeah I'm not sure about the other states I know New Jersey it's definitely three well can we ask Mrs she Dr Shep when she yeah write down the questions because the gentlemen are coming back tomorrow so I can write down all these questions and uh uh ask them and then we can report out on it okay thank you that that is super helpful because I'm just we're just wondering if we're one of the first in the country or or the first or the first in the state I'm just trying to get an idea of how we would compare the success of this program you know and how we made this this choice because you know the Veron Community is well aware that our test scores are at or below State average so I'm wondering if we also perhaps spoke to other school district in the state that had higher scores than Vernon to see what programs they're using before we made this choice is that something that we would do when we make these curriculum decisions um yeah we we explored a variety of curricula and we you know we do have contacts in other districts um we also as the teachers you know they have colleagues that teach in other districts what uh programs they've used and uh how they've been you know finding it successful uh and we did review quite a few different uh options uh in during this process okay and and is cost a factor when you make a choice is cost sure sure I mean it's always something that we look at sure uh but really oh sorry go no I was just wondering if there's a dramatic difference in costs in different math curriculums or they're all around the same price I've never looked at curriculums that's what I was just curious yeah I mean it's it is it does vary uh and then the the different aspects of each uh are priced out differently too so some curricula you may get and everything is included so theirs is you know $100 per student where others they may be only 50 or $60 per student but they don't include as many things and they charge you alak cart for the different components that were included in those previous programs so it's kind of more looking through seeing what you know we've used in the past what pieces the teachers feel would benefit the students uh what resources we need for the students uh and then pricing it out across all the different options because it does come in uh quite you know at at very varying levels depending on uh the company okay that that is really helpful because that's something of course that I would never understand as to how you would price a curriculum so that is really helpful okay I know I'm running out of time so I just have one more question for Mr slam um with respect to the budget as of last month we had about $2.2 million remaining um unspent and unencumbered on the financial statements on last month's uh at you know the public meeting agenda I believe that's pretty close um so it it looks like what we do is over budget and then carry forth the excess every year um has it occurred to the district to perhap and I know we want to fund our fund balance and carry that forth and also fund future budgets so I understand that has it occurred to the district to perhaps rather than carry forth a surplus um actually budget for any Capital expenses any improvements that they would want to do rather than carry I you know I'm just asking you know it's different in private businesses than it is in education so that's why I'm just asking if you can do it that way uh so uh we had talked about this a little bit uh I talked about a little bit in our pre in the presentations and then we had emailed back and forth a little bit um as well but it's good that you're asking now so that the public can uh also learn about this um so essentially the goal right now is to overall go and I keep talking about it is to get the district in a financially stable position um you know I talk about things like the reserves are going down the fund balance was high during the co years but now the fund balance is going down they try to offset some of basically $7.5 million in in loss state aid every year um now kind of referring directly to the fund balance if for example we were to say hey we do have you know Capital things we need to address let's spend this $2 million let's end the year at zero uh we would then have to cut $2 million out of the next budget we create um and it's not that the district's over budgeting it's that you have approximately a 68 to 70 million budget and there are certain things that a year out you don't know what's going to happen so they're going to be years where things go in your favor and years where things don't go in your favor uh specifically this year the number of out of District students have has gone down uh which is in favor financially for the district um there are other areas where for example if you're say budgeting for health benefits if I'm budgeting for health benefits and I don't know what plan someone currently has it'll be financially responsible for me to turn around and say well I'm gonna budget single and hope they choose single because that's the cheapest plan so you budget family and if they take family okay you made a great financial decision family you have money to pay for family uh if they take single that's great because now the difference between the cost of single and family now goes towards that balance balance which then goes to that balance at the end of the year if it's not spent which then the decision gets made does that go to excess Surplus which funds your creation of your next budget as Revenue uh which just as a side note and at some point people are G like stop saying those numbers right uh so for the current Year's budget uh between unreserved fund balance which is our 2% which is really kind of use this in case of emergency um which last year the current year budget they used about 1% of that um but then we refilled it at the end of the 23 year between that 1% and the excess Surplus is current Year's budget uh sorry 23 24 uh was $3.1 Million right uh for the 2425 budget um which has been submitted to the county uh and got approved by the ba we're waiting for it to get approved by the county superintendent uh uses approximately $2.7 million so the goal is to less than that number has forward um but you make a decision on that number of at that balance of the year does it go to excess surle which funds that next year budget as Revenue which is a form of tax relief because it's a revenue that otherwise you'd have to find somewhere else or you'd have to make pretty drastic Cuts uh or if you're in a better financial situation uh where you're not relyant on um that 3.1 at 2.7 as a form of Revenue you can then refill your reserves so that way when you have a maybe emergency during the middle year related to Capital to a capital project um you can withdraw that money mid year and address you know whatever that Capital issue might be so I think I answered your question um you you did answer that my question and I appreciate it I know I've asked it different ways and and I'm this is very confusing um to you know I'm sure to me who has a business but the accounting is different and um so I appreciate the time you took to answer my question so thoroughly thank you very much oh and one thing I I do want to add it it's it's a good thing when those funds go to the line because if something unexpected comes up we only have that 2% and whatever is in our current year budget um especially when you have a low cap Reserve um if we were to you know just say hey we have $2 million let's spend it let's just cut it out of our next budget and see what happens if things go the wrong way we hit a deficit and when you hit a deficit that's not good and there's a chance that there could be repercussion such as the state coming in so um we definitely don't want to hit a deficit uh whenever your budgeting for something you know whether be you know personal private or School District you want to make sure you're financially stable you want to make sure that if something does go wrong you have an an option right you don't want to you don't want to hit a deficit and and go down that path because I I thankfully haven't experienced it but I've seen school districts have that happen uh and it's it's very painful very painful process and you you you don't want to be there I appreciate that the town had the township the Vernon Township will have a 0% tax increase and so the schools will have 2.74 it looks like so um I just didn't know if if if it was finalized so it looks like it is okay thank you very much tonight thank you we have Colleen ranan Mrs ranan hi can you hear me yes hi good evening um I'm Colleen ranzan and I am the Vernon Township's uh Education Association president and I am here tonight to respond to a question that was asked at the last Boe meeting about my members going uh giving up their raises for the district the the question is a completely absurd in my opinion and here's why this current school year alone the VTE has provided the district $ 43,372 76 worth of material for 27 programs and scholarships including math night literacy night stem night art standing preschool graduation just to name a few plus countless volunteer hours and to create and Implement all of the activities uh that being many sorry many being named by VTA manned by VTA members and occur outside our contract hours also as you walk through the schools and into classrooms within our district a large percentage of what you see has been purchased by teachers at their expense personally I have hund spent hundreds of dollars at my own money to buy items to enhance my students educational exp experiences we all do this as we have increasing class sizes a decreasing budget and high inflation so to answer the question no we have not offered up uh our raises to the district because it would not be enough we instead we spend already so much more for the students of vernet so I just wanted to respond to that um that we are not going to give up our raises but as teachers we spend a lot on our students thank you very much Mrs ranzan that was not that request did not come from any of the board members or no Community yes I'm sorry yes a Community member uh asked that of Mr Rogers yes thank you thank you here we have Jesse paladini Mrs paladini yes good evening um thank you for that recognition for Elaine colani as some of you know Elaine was a 42y year very close personal friend of mine and I will just miss her so tremendously and I want to thank you Mr Rogers for responding so quickly last week when I contacted you about um doing something for Elaine I did not know Miss Nelson I'm sorry for her loss but I was very surprised to hear about John pasy I did not know that John pasy had left us and John pasy was a wonderful wonderful human being and probably one of the best principles our district has ever seen um having said that is there a textbook that you are using for this math program do the kids have a textbook whether it's a a basil or a consumable and how can I get a copy of it I'm gonna that question over to Mr gly asro uh yeah there are books that they use that are consumable uh there's lab books and then there's books that they go through that have the actual uh tasks in them uh that the teachers are using uh to get one I would have to look see if we have uh some samples laying around uh but uh I know that there are a lot of sample uh materials on their website to that for perusal but I will definitely look into that uh are there any specific grades that you're interested in or um what are they they're um K to three or no right now they're K to four K to four um I'd like to take a look at a well I would like to take a look at actually a k and a four and I'll return them I just want to take a look and the consumables are fine okay yeah yeah I will look into that and uh I will get back to you yeah I will return them but before you go sure can can you just answer two questions I had heard that we were the first district in the US to use it is that true or no I couldn't speak to that off hand I I don't believe so um okay I know that at the time we adopted it there were the the three other uh districts in New Jersey that were definitely doing it but uh like Mr Sweeney said I believe they were in uh Pennsylvania already uh so I I couldn't speak to that uh knowledgeably okay and my last question is those three districts can you tell me which three districts in New Jersey they are I would actually have to get back to you on that as well I know Millstone is one uh and sorry which one is one Millstone milstone okay and then I would have to uh get the other ones for you not a problem I'll wait till you uh get that and that's it thank you very much you're very welcome Mrs paladini I extend my sympathies to you as family I know you were very good friends and I am sorry yes thank you thank you very much anybody else that is all okay I'm going to close the meeting to the public and move on uh board report summary Finance building and grounds Mr Zimmerman okay we did not meet this past month so something for the next meeting with the budget when is your next meeting Monday 22nd 22nd okay you no wait till oh I'll wait till next one just something just a couple smart put all together thank curriculum Mrs pet M pet yeah we were supposed to meet yesterday but we needed to cancel um so I sent out some dates to people and get back to you nobody got back to me so hopefully we will meet in the next two weeks and uh have more to say but we did hear a lot about curriculum tonight so that was good good save on their part um Miss Brock is Ni here so have to pass on that negotiations Mr Zimmerman yes looking to finalize some dates with the vtaa they have sent me dates and after tonight I'll be responding to them to tonight or tomorrow morning to start the process moving forward very good our next partnership meeting is April 30th um special services U Mrs bani was the chair but we met about two weeks ago Mrs P miss pet was about two weeks ago it's about two weeks ago yeah we had a presentation by the consultant uh we hired to do an analysis of our special ed special services department and some of the services we deliver and that report should be at the end of the month or right after that and it was very interesting some of the comments that then you'll share with the board and look forward to some of those comments they were they were in today with the director of special services and supervisor of special services going throughout the building as well yeah and Mr Fay gave a presentation too but I don't have my notes from it I don't have the notes either yes maybe we can cover that um the next meeting yes and then Student Life Mr continue is not here um and with regards to our board uh uh committees we're going to have to do some changing because I haven't put Dr Ross on any yet as well we haven't put Dr Ross on so we have to get moving on with that and we'll have to talk about filling a new vacancy of Mrs colani maybe we'll discuss that the next meeting okay anything else to review the public agenda item G anybody have any questions about the public agenda no no I do there is one of the use of buildings I know it's Paris Sports Group initiative says no fees are collect 220 to something there I don't know who they are I they don't seem to be part of our schools um they might be I don't know uh so with me being out there is about a pile of things about that high for me to review and that is actually one of the on we didn't we didn't send them to you I don't give you guys you smart move um so that was actually one of the items I put aside to ask them for other questions okay thank you so I I did not sign that one yet I follow well that's just say what was just a random item says basketball next one yeah okay back to the agenda um Mr Roger letter H um I've been following up uh I'm going to probably include uh if it if it does if Mr Sweeney Mr Sweeny has been very attentive to the old news um usually what'll happen from now on is tomorrow I'll start a file of old news and I'll share that with the entire uh Board of Education so that we can make sure that we answer questions that might not have been answered to the board BO old business old business sorry old business sorry I'm old news ra old news yes so I'll have your ra whole business um also uh H1 the harassment intimidation and bullying random drug testing school safety reports and attachment ws1 H2 is our enrollment report I believe I talked with uh some of us some of people as well to make sure that that's accurate um three are policies regulations and preview as uh Mr smagula asked at the last board meeting several questions we also went back and uh gave it overview of all the board regulations and the questions that he had and shared that with the Board of Ed uh approximately I believe that was that same Friday when I went over to the old business um so that they can explain the reasoning why for some of the questions that they have and at any time if any board members have questions please reach out and we we try to provide that before any first or second readings so Charles I don't remember those questions did you remember what yeah answer did you get them answer um yeah one of them was actually the about the Guardians and um legal Guardians um and and this is probably another question maybe we uh where do we get the the introduction part of the uh I guess that's online too with with the with the RS or not the RS the U policies yeah because it says they're part of introduction sections to our policy book I guess and this is from Char fry and they said that uh parent now include that definition of a parent includes legal guardian right so that was provided um by by by Russ r you see this here yes these where are they I believe our policy begins with the 1000 section our policy book okay so I don't know where the introduction is I'll ask next okay Char and then um the other thing I mean are we talking about the policies tonight or you want to yeah I'm it's a work session we yeah we should okay I mean if we want to start what everyone start from the beginning and then just but everyone you have questions yeah you tell us the number okay those introductions are available online too at our website okay you got yes thank great great so the the only uh let me just go to the policies list here so we have the policy for uh sportsmanship U last week I mentioned or whatever two couple weeks ago right um I mentioned um there there we took out the there's a section um it doesn't Define what our what penalties can be put in place and I I just thought it would be maybe it says that you the board can put in uh penalties I should actually bring it up so I can read exactly how it says um but leaving it open-ended I I just think if we putot in some kind of penalties like hey you can be suspended or you can be expelled whatever it leaves it up to the superintendent at the time of the incident to make a decision rather than come back to the board later on and we have to agree upon something a penalty so if it's a drastic penalty obviously I don't think if they you know if they just kicked out of the game for that night it's it's not a big deal right we take care of that it's acceptable punishment if somebody's let's say expel expelled or I guess in this case it also could be a teacher writer or a parent um what kind of penalties it should be up to I think up to the superintendent at the time to make that decision and not have in the way it looked to me in the policy it looks like it's saying that the board can agree on something which means that would come to wait to our next meeting and we have to agree upon what a penalty would be so if we put some give guidelines what penalties can be and leave it up to the superintendent because I think that's more of his job um you know and if there's something drastic I guess we can always address it at a meeting but um that's is my suggestion I think we just putting something in there instead of leaving it blank so if if we're at a game and Ray and I are opposing teams and we get into an argument fight and outside that would be a legal matter right yeah I'm I'm more a student stud more a student or faculty yeah um you know obviously we can get police involved with Outsiders right right well it's up to the board to change policy if they wish uh as a superintendent I believe that a lot of these situations AR a case-by casee basis and although you may say a fight there may be degrees of a fight there may be different circumstances and um I just I just wouldn't want to be um hamstrung by specific penalties I I don't mean it's if he says this then we do this and more of this it can it can include up until suspension it can include up until it um I guess would be what's the point of that then because if it's open to if if it depends it depends like why do we because it says let me find it on the it's the way it's written and to me it sounds like it it can be the board can make a decision so that would mean if the board I'm sorry ready to get today it's on page three it says uh failure to exhibit good sportsmanship May subject the individual to disciplinary action as deemed appropriate by the board that's part I see okay right so that would mean then we would have to agree on it which could be two or three weeks later right as opposed to the let the superintendent to make the decision yeah does generally the superintendent have authority to suspend kids to the next board meeting yeah usually there's njsia guidelines as well to this and what'll happen is is usually if there's an incident that presents itself I make the board aware of it and we talk about uh the discussion I've had POS probably with the athletic director and principal as to what events had taken place and what we had decided uh to do if a kid gets TQ is sports he's two games right off the bat if he gets a second one he's and him and the team are out of the states so the state that's the that's the consequence athletically but are you talking about a secondary I it said games so Charles instead of it saying as deemed appropriate by the board would an appropriate revision be something like as in accordance with the school code of conduct and the division League okay as opposed to as deemed appropriate by the board which would mean it right correct yeah in accordance with the School Code of Conduct anything else you want to add in there and or the division just say the sport the ngj well I think it's all sports nji s like regulations that have do yeah their penalty mostly is States getting kicked out of okay and I do believe if fans get thrown out the team is affected there was an incident at a basketball game it was not a it was two parents of I think of the opposing team got into a real guttle but there were an off duty state trooper and off duty running policeman there and they they just dissipated the situation like that and it was a non event well it was so it was smooth very smooth let make them come to all our they were fans and that was a win at a State basketball game by the way home the home one yes all right next and then the only other one I had was u i mean and again the biggest thing was was the parent thing so I just want to make sure everybody heard that uh we were provided the definition um the the other one is a little bit more too I mean it's again this is my interpretation is I I understand the reason for the policy 65 6520 the PO the uh payroll deduction and we have a little explanation what it here there's no additional cost to the district totally understand it it's fine with the way um I just that the thing is that was put in place because there was at one time there was a cost to to the district and and we don't know we didn't know I guess at the time nobody knew that was GNA be we can get it for free for for for the thing so now we're trying to allow our our um staff to be able to to go outside of what we we're offering right so I just don't want it ever to come back around where we have to pay again and then it's we then we have to make a new policy to say no we're not doing this again so as long as maybe we put just a word in there as long as there's no additional no additional cost the district a good idea just to provide a little background so right now we have a third party provider uh that provides services for our 403bs um and our other uh investment options that are available uh and what happens is the actual providers um pay the the third Ser the third part provided for us uh so we essentially receive that service for free what that does is instead of us say cutting individual checks to all these different providers uh we send the information to them and they disperse it for us and they also take on liability when people um take loans out of some of these investment vehicles as opposed to me having the sign on the liability so which is nice so Charles you like to add as long as there's no additional cost to employees or the district yeah okay I mean well I guess employees want to pay it they can play it but yeah as long as there's no question to the district okay the district you got it I had a quick question about oh you I just wanted uh I'm sorry secret societies I just I just also wanted so the audience hears is that students are not allowed to participate right for for the R so even though we have a policy that has to be approved there is there students not legally allowed to in the state um I just had a question on 2260 it references long-term medical leave what is considered long-term medical leave for a student like no I don't think it's said leave actually longterm medical absence I don't know but what like how many days would would that because we have to provide instruction I guess if a student is absent due to Medical um health concerns I was just wondering what that uh what qualifies that like what's the threshold do you know I have to look on the case by case basis well there's no actual like there Pro there probably is so I'll get back to you on that with the length of the long-term medical heas for students okay thank you you got that remember that new writing it down old business yes all right Mr slam item I so I just wanted to provide a brief update on the budget um essentially uh it has been submitted to the county uh we do have the county ba approval uh theyd have a couple of comments uh which uh I had a phone call with him and provide him some additional information uh so he's approved our budget at this point uh and we're waiting for the county superintendent uh to go in review and then uh if they have any questions obviously I I'll respond to those um and then uh do do their their second step approval which at that point will allow me to advertise uh the budget and the paper um there was reference I think to some questions I know I spoke a lot or not a lot but a decent amount earlier on on the budget I I wasn't here at the last meeting so I don't know if those are all the questions that we had received or if anyone recalls any other ones uh that that they'd like me to address I think that we addressed all the ones that were specific um there were people interested in you know reviewing how we review the budget so just a little background I I take about about three or four months for the whole budget process but uh just read what I said before I do go through line by line and and not just me because a lot of so I'm looking at the numbers I'm looking at Trends but don't necessarily know say what a teacher needs in the classroom right so it's really a team effort where I'm looking at the numbers but I'm getting a lot of information on the needs uh from you know principes other administrators uh and we really look at everything together but we do look at those Trends we look are the numbers going up are they going down why are they going up why are they going down are we do we need to change a program is this program still being used if not how many people if it's so use how many people are using it um we do look at a lot to try to make those cuts um and it is very detailed and it is a very long process okay but I didn't I didn't know if anyone had go St their head we did go over it in finance the finance committee does go over the you guys get to listen to me extra yeah extra helping Angel yes presentation next right yeah yes we're gonna put a couple slides up uh so just probably a little background information on this um this is just to discuss a second question uh we will be putting on a resolution which if board approved at the 25th board meeting uh would then allow me to enter into the budget software what is considered a separate proposal so when I say enter into budget software it's not added to the budget it just notify the county that we're going to pursue a second question which then the public would vote on right um now because of the timing of how this works the voting would be in November um if it were to pass in November because of the timing of that election uh that means that the funds wouldn't be available to the district until January um so that's that's part of uh that process uh again this is just talk about the second question there'll be a resolution as part of the budget resolution um which if approved would authorize us to move forward with the next steps that will be required for us to put that question in front of the voters um and then ultimately it'll be up to the voters about uh you know if they wanted to approve any of the questions uh both the questions or or however the voters decide and these this has been discussion after last year after cutting those 52.5 positions um we've had some concerns about uh class SI and as they talked about in Inova mat as well um having people available for interventions um but if you look at this this second question it's mainly about Staffing um I think there's about 20 staff members total uh somewhere around there approximately um out of the 52.5 that we cut from last year um if you look at our tax rate I've done some research as well Vernon's tax rate for school tax was 1. 1462 which is the second lowest in in in uh sucus County and surrounding districts um the percent a lot of people have said that we've used 70 or 80% of the taxes are from f are used from the school district Vernon out of your taxes 56.2% is from uh education and when you break down the per pupil cost after what happened last year our P per pupil cost is $1,561 per student which is the lowest in the county and uh other schools uh uh they're most of them are 20,000 or above per per people so what we're proposing here in the second question is when we've discussed this uh in finance committee meetings as well is adding 16 teachers to reduce class size and support students in grades prek through 12 uh increase security and and restore addition counseling staff to restore uh support uh student support and mental health um we've when I talk break it down by category uh we've lost uh four administrative positions 35 teaching positions two counseling positions six support staff positions and 5.5 maintenance and custodian positions so we're trying to um provide the same level or as much close to the level of service before with less but there there is a need and uh people have come to our meetings and uh expressed uh concern about class sizes and uh multi-tier systems of support or the RTI you heard about today as well I also divided it into a second question as well a lot of people have been talking about the late buses so the there there's going to be two of the second questions the second question will be uh additional busing for the late buses and a skilled maintenance worker uh like I said we've lost quite a bit of Maintenance and custodial staff as well well and a skilled maintenance worker could help us out tremendously and possibly uh save money in uh skilled uh projects in the future as well as we talk about uh having e money for projects uh when we talk about buildings and grounds all the time uh you our buildings uh the the roofing is coming close to end of life and the parking lot facilities as well so we have a lot of concerns um the second question is going to be um is going to be on only uh these these items which is uh busing and Staffing um we also looked at we started where we thought we needed and we we actually reduced some of these numbers down as well if you go to the next slide it's and this is what Ry will talk about what is it if if you vote Yes for this question what do the effect on your taxes so I think it's in simple terms for every $100,000 of assessed home value your taxes would go about $60 and that's easiest way to do the mental math that uh they talked about in the math program earlier as well yeah and essentially what this kind of points back to is something that I've been discussing a lot whenever I've talked about the budget which is when you lose uh like I said about approximately $7.5 million uh of your of state aid uh which is almost 10% of your Revenue uh there are very limited ways for you to get that Revenue back um in addition to losing that Revenue at the same time all your costs are going up um you have just you know costs going up for inflationary reasons um you have you know additional supports um that need to be provided to students which we should be providing students but obviously additional costs right um and with the limited ways you can raise revenue which is 2% tax levy which we know inflation isn't 2% we know the cost of everything isn't going up 2% be nice if it was but um and the limits and other forms of Revenue you can bring in there really aren't a lot of solutions that would be able to bring back that number of Staff uh really other than this um the only real two solutions would be the state decides to relook at the state aid which I don't think that's very likely uh because we saw how dramatic of a of a shift that was um away from District like Vernon uh and money going towards other districts um and the only other option is really a second question which is essentially just going to the taxpayers and saying these are some of the things we think we need uh and presenting the case this is you know why financially and also in terms of in the classroom uh and saying you know what do you think uh please you know please vote and and let us know um that's kind of where we are right now um but just to be clear it is that right um where say over one tax year um and that has to do um so generally I'll go a little bit I want to get too far because get a little wonky we run on a different fiscal year um than the town does right so half of our year goes into one of their tax years and other half of our year goes into their other tax year so in a normal budget I think earlier someone mentioned 2.7% that will be if we're hitting that would be not counting for rebles not hitting the taxers split right because you're really La half of last year half of this year um so it's actually a lower uh increase in that with the regular budget uh but with that being said since this is being voted on in November we're hitting one tax year because it's going to be would start to be collected in 2025 uh so that's why you see the one number which is roughly half it's rounded there and then you see the second number which is basically that times two so that's why that right column would be the ual impact uh just another note this is going off of the ridols that we have uh for this year uh because rables obviously have a large effect on what the impact would be um I will say that for the last four or five years uh ratables have been going up um so obviously if ratables go up the tax impact would be less uh because it be split more uh you know houses or businesses um I know there is some potential building happening in town but I don't know what the timeline of that is so just another note this is based off of the current Year's ratables uh the Hope being that next year the ratables would continue to go up which would uh farther reduce the impact to the taxpayer and I I don't know if anyone on the board has any questions on the financial side or uh on you know the more curricular base side with you know Staffing and and you know inside the classroom this is the first time we're talking about the second question in public right did we clarify like what a second question is to people know I mean I know because we talked about it but uh I talked about a a little bit at the beginning but so basically um so the process uh would be we're talking about it now there would be a resolution on with the budget resolution which uh if that were approved would allow me to enter this into the budget software not adding the money to our budget but only adding essentially a notification to the county saying we would like to go forward and ask this question of the public uh these are the accounts that if it were approved the money would go into it's very informational um and then we would have to uh essentially notify the Board of Elections uh it would be on for a vote in November and then if it was voted yet um then uh those funds would be added to our budget uh starting in January um and if obviously was voted no then they would not be um and if it's voted no does that then limit Us in any way from doing the things that are specified on the question like if we were able able to find the money somehow um because that wased in the the limiting factor uh unfortunately is money right but if we somehow ended up having more money than we thought I don't know I had at one point we had been told by someone that if we put like the lay buses on there and the public voted no then we can never have a lay bus again or for three years or what was the um if anybody remember this is discussion before I started yes the town up votes not to have the bus buses that are not to pay for them with the second question then we can't I I would have I would have to double a check on that I know with referendums there's specific rules but referendums are more Capital based than different process yeah you could check on that yeah I can make a note and I I'll email myself so I remember because I that's one question I question too um so two of the two of the big items on here were uh class size and in the buses which very seem to be very popular U with most of the town right it affects us all uh affects all the children and students um I just want to know is this sustainable right we we've gone through this before um we were told that um we can use funding to put in teachers and then we laid off teachers right if we put these buses in if we put these class these I forgot what number I think you had 18 teachers if you put 18 teachers in are we able to with this and granted nothing goes catastrophic right we don't have some huge thing and and this isn't like stabilization Aid once this is part of the budget it's part of the budget and and we'll be able to sustain those and not have to take away the buses again yeah I mean uh you would hope not uh but if for example state aid got cut significantly again then we'd have to look at everything again so I can't promise you that you know it would be there forever uh because things change um State Aid's a pretty large percentage of our Revenue um but what I will say is uh these types of items Staffing reoccurring costs uh would be essentially approving uh our authority to increase our tax base right so in future years that means that what that tax base is could be increased by the 2% right so that would mean that in terms of sustainability unlike stabilization a which was a one-time Revenue um this would be included year after year um and then you know in later years you would make decisions each budget cycle what what percentage increase we would need in order to keep up with you know any changes to state aid um and then obviously changes to expenses and then the other thing is I I kind of know because I I I get to be in the committee and um but I I don't know if the public will always knows this what we've looked into other Solutions right uh um and I and I'm going to bring in two things here if you have any more you want to give an example we looked at gas to reduce our cost of heating the buildings right we looked at putting the cell tower in those OP those options those other Solutions will not could not fund this right what we need and when we're looking over uh line items and options Mr slam has been very Progressive and looking we're going to have a cell tower we're going to rent it out we're going to we're going to we're looking to possibly change over to gas that for savings as well we also have roofs on six of the buildings that are nearing end of life that may cost five out of six that may cost over a million dollars a roof so we are we are making savings and we're looking at every line but we're also looking um long term for what if an emergency happens as well so having that little bit of 3% which is that $2 million and a roof goes is gone so like so we're we're in a spot now where we're very with the the amount of money we have in case of something happening there aren't many options right yeah so just to kind of add to that so I keep mentioning the 2% and how the 2% is important and how it's not sustainable for us to continue to use part of our 2% unreserved fund balance as a revenue so just to re for everyone so there's excess Surplus which is balance uh at the end of the year in your that current year budget which you can then make decisions on and say is it going to continue to stay excess Surplus and be used as a revenue on the next budget or do you have enough where you can maybe put some money in the capital reserve or maintenance Reserve capital reserve my projection is if projects go as planned we'll probably have only about $750,000 or so in that uh next year um and then maintenance Reserve uh money was withdrawn last year during during the budget a year um there's only $2,000 there right so that's essentially as good as zero right um so with that being said um that 2% which is separate and you're allowed to carry is only one about approximately $1,300,000 it's not a lot of money so if something goes wrong like a roof and we're in a bad situation right so the plan is and I keep saying trying to stabilize the current year budget and take small steps and work towards reducing the Reliance on the excess Surplus the Reliance First on the unreserved fund balance which we are refilling each year but when you refill that number it reduces your excess Surplus number which then means you really can't put anything in the capital reserve and if it gets reduced too far then you have to make cuts to compensate for that um and we are looking to some Alternatives you did mention um the cell tower we're working on that but again that's that's not a big Revenue I reached out to other districts that have that and don't get me wrong every little bit helps I'll take any money I can find right um but maybe 40 to $50,000 a year uh there is a bidding process that will be involved with that so it depends on when that bidding process what what what bids we'd receive essentially right and then it would depend on do other carriers get interested because that could increase Revenue but again small number comparatively to the budget um in terms of natural gas we are working with them to see if they'd be willing to run the line down here you know preliminary preliminarily it looks how we've gotten positive feedback but at this point I believe they the residential portion of the of um the Sussex I believe right Sussex natural gas elizab town sorry elizab toown natural gas um they're I think they're trying to find out what kind of residential interest there is before they give us the final answer because they're looking at the whole equation for them in terms of cost versus future Revenue we're trying to say hey there's a number of schools down here and we'll we'll connect them all up and hopefully that's enough to uh get them to put that you know um investment in uh that kind of connects to something else we're doing which is also kind of an alternate which is an alternative which is we're we're going to look at EIP um there's going to be a timeline involved with that because we're required to go through an energy audit and in order to do that uh without a cost there's a there's a line so we have to wait in line for them to do that audit uh and then we can kind of go through that path and maybe that could help with some of our some of our roofs essentially but we won't know that till we get through that audit and see what kind of costs because what they do is they look at the cost you save in energy and instead of budgeting that towards energy you budget that towards the esip payment and then they bundle in as much as they can some additional projects uh for example like a roof if there's enough savings what happened to the uh we were going to explore advertising on the football field Stadium therea I think that might have been before I started yeah we could pick that up again I think it there was some concern about being standardized a I think we left it that people were going to discuss how to make it not look ugly and then just that was many many different board members yeah yeah I mean maybe we should pick that back up didn't you say Charles was just at an event and you saw we we had discussed that previously so we do have some some B on that uh so so point being there are you know some things we're looking at to try to help but none of those things are going to solve the problem I'm not suggesting it as instead of I'm just saying no I'm not say while we're talking about this I want the public to understand is what steps we need to be looking to take to ensure the financial stability of the district right right because I don't think anyone wants to be here saying uh we have a major roof problem it needs to be replaced immediately uh let's go see if we can get maybe a short-term loan you know we we don't want to be there right so we need to take steps to make sure that we're making uh putting the district in the best position possible to get that that point of financial stability so the is what you described before and then how are we going to communicate it Beyond you know at the board meeting to the public because we're essentially putting this in their hands right like that it's yeah it's a decision for the this is the first time it's out there right so I'm imagine there'll be questions to follow we have until the November elections to answer questions and and explain uh why and what we plan to do and and we tried to make it as simple as possible that it is about Staffing um and like I said we've had people come to a lot of the board meetings as well who Express concerns about some of the things that we put on that question as well I guess I'm wondering though how I personally think that you would probably need to actually get it out there to more than the people who are come to our board meetings because it's going to be a big voting year it's a major election so we needed approv that the next board me if you need well that you need from us I'm saying I guess I think we should be thinking about how to communicate to the public I don't want to say sell it but like to at least tell explain to people the reasoning behind the opportunity and that you know we're putting it in their hands and we hope they understand the need and I don't know I just because otherwise it's just going to show up on the boutot like some Ty got to the ballot last time and we like wait what's this thing with the fire department you remember that so so we want to if people are going to be voting we want them to understand why why we need my talking points are about 20 staff members the late buses for every $100,000 value of your house you have the yes the sales person getting them out to the yeah because I always think here we talk we talk here and there are some people here and I'm grateful for them for paying attention but there are a lot of people voting that aren't here and and I talk to people sometimes about things going on in the board and they have no idea so this is those people are going to be voting so I also five positions suggesting Board of Education that's too yes so we just need to get you know are talking points in front of more people than usual I think with this because otherwise they're go and C to the ballot like why would I vote for this so so I'm just suggesting that but okay thank you I don't know how but yeah suggestion and then if we put it on the agenda next week two weeks in two weeks it's just to say that you are allowed to put submit the second question it doesn't affect any doesn't bring any Revenue it doesn't make any anything finalized mean it'll be on the ballot allows to vote yeah that that essentially just allows us to move forward with the next steps we would need to take to put it on the ballot so the public could vote on we we don't have the authority to approve any increase there it's it's completely up to the public okay yeah well it should be up to the public it's their money yep yeah the only thing we want to do is uh provide the opportunity for people to ask questions uh and then provide information as to why we're putting that question out there exactly and then then everyone when they go to V has a decision to make if we do approve it next week or in the next meeting maybe we can set some time what maybe other every other meeting until November where we can come just just specifically talk about that in the meeting but the public can sit back digest a little bit and ask their questions the next time I'm just going to say we need to bring it to them if we just sit here and wait for them to come to us yeah I think so I mean yes we got to go to them it's too bad we don't have a newspaper people in this town we got to get to them so next year we'll have board members go into back to school nights to you know promote things like that yeah I mean I think you know the social media we have to put on social media so people kind of know what's going on because then that'll get more people asking questions um important component of it is Word of Mouth between the members of the public so they know other they let people know uh kind of what's going on maybe some kind of FAQ document you know facts so uh yeah fq would work send that to the advertising news maybe they'll do something with it um oh bad idea okay know buying opportunities for the public to come and ask questions about it whether that be at a regular board meeting or whether there's a separate Forum meeting for it yeah yeah okay um when I so in the past i' I've done a referendum before and fic USS were used social media was used the website was used um I think in that case we sent little little mail or to let everyone like hey this is yeah this is coming up uh this is you know this is information on it you're going to have the opportunity to vote you know yes or no you know um and then we also did a public forum we did multiple that's because there's multiple towns of up right there was one item that I forgot to put on the old business agenda and that was uh the uh sat team summer sat that a specific board member requested yeah that would be me um you know the last time we talked about it we talked about gauging the interest of the public and or uh yeah gauging the interests and I was concerned that we should really try to get as much interest as possible in order to minimize the cost to the district because obviously we charge for it right um I understood from Mr Rogers that emails went out to parents of Juniors at first that sounded like that's all that was done but now it sounds like maybe more was done um I just felt that since it's only April 11th we could maybe make one more push before we move forward with just getting rid of it I know it's a cost but it's a very very very very tiny part of our budget and people do pay for it and I just really felt like these the kids um deserve the opportunity to to have that uh access to that preparation it's valuable to our students it's something that's um helps them potentially get scholarships get into colleges things like that um so just felt that we should pull out all the stops and really try to get 25 kids to sign up before we go and cancel it maybe other people feel differently but that was my thinking yeah it wasn't part of the budget we submitted and we would be talking about everything else that's not part of the budget and uh I I understand I've had to same timed them my my pitch right after the hard part so yeah good timing yeah I know I know I know I understand and and and to be honest with you that that's this is a program that I ini and tried to Champion as well and and when I initi initially Champion him I'm like listen if we don't get I go we we have the SATs now they're in August we're going to try to run them over the summer for kids that are are part of sports and um the conversation with uh the advisers and the principal when we talked about the 52.5 cuts and the stiens because we we had stiping Cuts last year as well um they were concerned the even the advisers were like we don't have that much of participation they even mentioned to me when I had follow-up conversations with them the concerns were about sports and jobs and everything as well um I had them do this as they normally would do and send it out to the the parents send in a blast send in a digital backpack and send it to emails I do like your idea I think next year I'm going to send it for those those other sat courses to see if we can build because I I do want more kids to be in in the SAT prep um and the numbers have been diminishing a little bit so we're gonna we're gonna do that as well but for me to add something to a budget that we just submitted at this time with only I believe they have uh eight students expressed an interest and at $200 a piece um I think we still it's going to be a cost of the District of $5,900 right but if you got up to 25 kids it's only Crossing District what like 2,000 well that's well that's what I T advisor I know but like I said it's only April 10th uh wait no now it's the 11th um yes so we still have some time and I just felt that given the communications that went out and I'm I guess it's a running theme with me I just I feel like our Communications of these things are not um robust enough to to really get I mean like you said we've got we can't get 25 do you know when my kids were it was my our time to do this I rushed to sign up I was terrified they would fill up before I could get my kids in and then they were like yeah no Jen we're having trouble filling all the seats like why is that it's such a great deal I mean it's $200 pay $200 a session some of these most most of these programs are a thousand, yeah so I just I mean I just feel like the problem isn't that we can't get it it has to be that people don't really aren't getting I I I just I wonder if people are really seeing these emails you know and um can we send tax out we've talked about that I don't know why we can't hit them on multiple fronts and you know and maybe have teachers talk to to kids more and and just we should and in all of them too I don't even know if we filled up the the fall and the spring one right did we I mean they should they should be overflowing there should be a waiting list that's how it should be we've got 240 kids graduating half of them go to foure schools that's you know a hit list of 120 kids in two grades so that's 240 kids we can't get 25 of them I don't know it just feels like maybe we need to do more to to pull them into this before we cancel it I do understand what you're saying about it not being on the table for this year and that this would be adding it but we we brought it up and we said if we could get kids to sign up we would offer it so it just felt to me like we should make every effort to get the 25 kids so there you go that's mine we were actually and I'm want to maybe Circle back and make bring some stuff together here but um we we talking about this the other day um and maybe we just look at it a different approach too because we have AP classes right or they take the AP class test in April I think in May it's coming right up right yeah it's coming up soon what are those kids what are those kids doing and I'm not saying I'm not trying to say they're not doing nothing but could we incorporate that maybe as a as the a AP classes if they're finished in may maybe can that extra time instead of trying to find other work for them it could be you can go to this other class now and and we can maybe have poost a during school school day or um maybe we can can stop move move the dates instead of having a fall spring summer that's not working maybe something in the middle could also work the other thing is and that's why I want to bring it back around you I was at Pope John the other day uh yesterday we're watching the game and they have all the advertisements theyy right they put advertisements around the whole field I'm sure one day they'll sell rights to the stadium but um if we did some maybe we could do something with Deca can make these signage and we can use that money as a revenue source to pay for this for for kids or or cut our cost down at least you know yeah I would love I would love to get the signage moving and get approved to to generate Revenue I I will reach out to the we worked with athletic director before new business administrator I think we can make some progress on the signage for uh I think there was a little bit of a hangup on uh may standardizing it at the time there was a concern that it would look messy if everybody did their every company did their own thing and it was jarring and so we would need to set some color schemes or some sort of I think if the board has some ideas with that and wants to help guide us so I look forward to that as well I mean we have a Graphic Design we have we have some like I don't remember how they now but I know they were like phenomenal right those those kids and we can make signs I'm just worried about what the what are the like if we set constraints and had to standardize them I think we could we could we could uh move I was part of that at that time so if people want it to happen it's very simple to happen when people don't want it to happen they come up with all crazy ideas on why it can't happen so if we want it to happen we could do it we want to talk about all sorts of nonsense we won't do it it's always easy easy to talk yourself out of something than to do it Comm to do it figure out then we're going to do it and we're going to tell them they have to do that's how it'll work all right that's how it works and then you get signs up for whatever amount of money I don't know somebody was researching what we could charge and I don't know what it fell apart they're still working on that commit so I'm up in November hopefully we'll get it done by we go with that philosophy the other thing I'm sorry one more thing uh back to school night maybe the high school can start talking back to school talk about this sat because that's soon as all those kids come in there and parents we have a good well this portion parents coming this exercise helped stimulate discussion amongst the advisors as well as the ideas and one of the ideas was trying to send it out as a text message we wanted we've met some resistance with that when we sent out masses to the parents so we got to we but I I I want to do that with sat to see how it works next year um they talked about talking about a back to school night and uh and other events as well so uh I think it stimulating some discussion with the advisers on how to build uh uh student student U signups for the uh what is it for the winter and spring classes as well can I just bring up another point to be a little bit on the other side we're having trouble filling these classes all year could possibly be because a tremendous amount of colleges stopped requiring they're they're coming back they're coming back but they're not back now all the kids applying now couple of the ivys they're back for the group that's taking the test that will be taking the test next year though it's but I know my kids did get every school required yeah no it's it's going to it's trending back so we we shouldn't be telling our kids you know and even and even if you thought that you were going to apply possibly test that schools would allow you to apply test optional you should still take it because if you do well you it can still help you so there's no reason to not ever take it and I appreciate your support with the pre PSAT that we do with the students as well because all the all the sophers and juniors take take the PSATs every year and that gives them yeah automatically they're they're signing into the College Board they're looking at uh not only college options but but uh scholar also looking at Job options options too and they should be taking the SAT class because that P if you do well in that PSAT that's where the there's there's other there's other uh programs where you can input your PSAT scores to help right to help you another thing is a self study as well but there's a lot of options out there and I I I appreciate you guys supporting uh having all the students take the PSAT and their sophomore junior years as well back to just for a second the communications Charles did you want to say anything about that whole clicking through on the oh we were talking about this I guess it' probably be more on the the communication I don't know I I think we need to re and this is something you guys should probably do it's this is effect you guys but um and if I hear it in the community too we there was one text message I got last last month that told me to go to my email then I went to my email and then it told me to click here to go to a link to go like why are we making it so listen we had those conversations about how to send things out in text messages as well because there's been a little bit of a learning curve to that and certain uh people are getting better at that than others and I've had this conversation with my other administrators in the board office as well it's and we're gonna have training on it in the last week of this month as well as I had this discussion earlier today having a link where it says what would it be it' be like if interested in taking the SAT program uh please click on this link and it's in your email and and if they click on it the form opens and if they want to go in the email find it they can uh to avoid uh I think people are trying different things to make it work when they're when they're it's the first time they're trying to put something in a in a text message and be careful with your emails because stuff is going to spam and when you now with all blockers and stuff and all the security a lot of that when you put a a link to a Google Drive it's a flag and you guys have to put a DeMark on there so it would also it would prevent less of it to be I no no no no Charles reach out to us when that happen like I said it is a learning process and I've had some pretty detailed discussions with uh administrator and audience right now about that why is everything a link why can't it just be in an email yeah like why why do why is it always I get an email and I have to click on some something and then it goes to something else there's a character text okay the big issue last year what what Charles was talking about we had a different system we had school messenger and and something else so School messenger had a character limit and when you you couldn't put a hyperlink in there it would just do the entire full link so which you know Charles we know exceptionally long it would take up all characters so that's why they were sending out things saying please check your email because they're not a character okay our new system now has that capability so now when we send it out we don't have to send it out as an alert where everyone involuntarily will get a text message if they didn't want that what you can do is send it out as a normal uh correspondence and as a parent when you register your child you can check off oh I want emails from the district I want text or I want phone calls and you can decide how you want that information and it will adhere to that even if we put send it Bea text email smoke signal whatever it be uh so that's kind of respecting everyone's wishes more too but we only have that capability starting this year so yeah versus in the past when you got a uh delayed opening you got it on there oh my gosh yeah you checked everything okay one more um the the backpack digital backpack is that does that just go to everybody everything or is it tailored like you send out a digital backpack and the high school people only get high school in the building the district district one is uh everything the district one's everything there's one per building but you don't you don't send it to just Juniors or just seniors no no that would be building that would be building okay all right thank you we did have one recommendation last yeah I know we haven't gotten to he doesn't want to miss it sorry I didn't add that to so Mr SL you a recommendation uh it is recommended that the board approve the Cisco webex's calling upgrading licensing agreement effective April 1st 2024 through April 1st 2029 the amount of $135,600 club uh number uh NASPA Value Point Cisco Master agreement AR 3227 I want to add some context here um the reason that number is so high is because it includes uh five years worth of the licensing that we're required to use each year to use the system um the phones are currently end of life uh to the point where they're no longer being supported um and I believe the way it was described to us was that they could be stopped at any point in the next year is that essentially what they said yes I and I appreciate our uh it supervisor doing his due diligence and providing uh everyone with information on on his research for this as well um it it hasn't been an easy process but I I'll tell you what you can answer any question you you want about the phones now yeah and the other thing I wanted to point out because I think it's important um is that the initial cost uh pulling it up right now for the first year which is the actual replacement of all the telephones um is it's about approximately 58,000 hours um and if you recall we had applied for stabilization Aid uh we had hoped that we would get significantly more than we received hoping for four million uh we got the letter saying hey you got stabilization Aid and then we read the letter and we're like oh um so we got about 44 approximately $44,000 um so out of that $58,000 $44,000 of that is the stabilization Aid uh and the rest uh will be in the from the the it budget the general fund and how does this compare with we have to get a a motion first then we'll talk yeah can I have a motion so Move Motion by Mr second by Mr Saga questions or comments you want to say about I was gon say right how does this compar to what we've been spending on uh nothing have we been spending nothing on so it there was support that was required for the phone system but because the support no the phones are no longer supported this year we weren't paying for that support because it didn't exist right um we should have that support we should have a telephone system that is still being supported right right yeah uh it's pretty important so with that licensing uh we will be paying for that moving forward uh my understanding is that this number started out significantly higher um and that uh Our IT director was able to negotiate this number down quite a bit so we we don't know what we've been paying for say two years ago I believe he said that this is would be a savings but I don't know exact number so follow up with that information I do know that um semi- related but we are looking at other areas to Red ways to reduce our copper lines in District um and make some changes there for additional savings it's kind of all part of the same conversation so this 135 634 the 58 or 56 that you mentioned before that comes out of this uh yeah so the 58 is part of that and that is the actual Hardware that is the telephones that is the services uh related to getting those cell phones in place and uh then the licensing uh for the first year so and then prior years of Licensing is approximately $19,000 a year so then the total for the five years will be 135 that's correct thank you are we paying that this so we're gonna over five years we be paying this except for the first year 58 yeah the first year we' be paying for the hardware and the first year of Li in and Professional Services and then the following years we'd only be paying the approximately $119,000 or so a year for the licensing um and services Support Services basically required to have the telephone system and we would looked at other vendors right yes a number of other vendors were explored uh this was a combination of a lower price um which was surprising because Cisco is generally uh a higher price option but he was able to to get us a good price as a public school district um through that Cooperative um and also uh he compared the technical aspects and the capabilities that the different phone systems he looked at would be able to provide the district uh and this was the system that he felt was the best fit um and also would basically you know increase our our our basically our capabilities because our current phone system is is pretty old and and then I I noticed because I've asked this question a couple times is there are certain requirements we need as school district that are governed right we can't just have any uh Voiceover IP phone equ of locations right we need to have that a specific type of phone that allows them for 911 to know where we are right and our our old system was quite labor intensive where they had you have to physically go to each of the phones and assign them the new system he'll able to work from remotely to reassign as well anybody else roll coot Please Mr smaga yes sorry I somehow ended up on the the wrong page Miss pallet yes Dr Ross yes Mr sweene yes Mr Zimmerman yes motion carries thank you very much slam moving on to item J public participation you have our second public participation uh section anybody in the public would like to comment Castle from blw again thank you thank you for staying sure appreciate been exciting um so first off I know budgeting is is hard I mean I know it's not an easy process but I do think some of that was lost in the slides in the presentation I think from what I got from that and it could just be me so um but just as a comment is I got that it looked like most of what the work that was done was way to kind of work the system to get around the 2% cap so we could raise taxes more I didn't see a lot of work shown that said you know these were the cuts we looked at but they didn't they didn't go through so that that was my main uh point on that um I also don't think uh that you know using justifications that inflation went up so that's why we have to raise taxes to pay for this stuff because it it uh taxpayers aren't immune to inflation either so we're already paying that inflation so we have less money like when I have less money at home because of inflation I got to cut something to to fix it but what we're being told is you already have less money from inflation the school needs more money because of inflation we're not making any Cuts you get you have to pay for that too like it's just it's like a double hit so I just think it's a bad statement to put out there um yeah I I mean that that one I just I don't I don't see it as as valid um the other one that I don't and I don't know how you get around it I had mentioned this last time and and uh Mr Rogers talked with me a little bit about it but the constant beating of the drum of you know we have this much less state aid every year I mean it's a fact we have to deal with it so if we have to make some hard Cuts we've got to make some hard Cuts I mean that's that's the way it is I don't think we can keep hitting the well uh of taxpayers over and over and over again it's just eventually it's going to it's going to end and on top of that we're not seeing scores increase so basically you know I'm a little shocked with this second question as well um you know I don't see scores improving I don't even see small incremental improvements at least so far so basically I'm being asked to pay a lot more for worst service than before we even cut the teachers our scores were going down so now we've cut the teachers you know we we've done a lot with that so just uh it's it's a little shocking I think for me the second question I think some of it'll SN in and I'll probably have more questions after that but I would hope that I know a couple of things were thrown out there and it was said that they won't cover the cost and that's why we have the second uh question but do they cover some of the cost like can we offset some of the cost with some other cuts and not have to basically raise taxes and then raise tax taxes again and I think the you know showing of the slide where uh $300,000 house is going to go up $180 or whatever is great but is there a combined rate of with the 2.7% that we're proposing and now we're asking the second question how much are my taxes actually going up on that and how much of that is all just for schooling that again is not improving at all so I understand it's a tough job but I just see that a lot of money is being asked from the taxpayers and I don't see any results at all like I don't even see a and I could be you know maybe I'm missing something but I don't even see a slight glimmer of hope that our scores are going up in the school and I don't see Cuts being being put in place I mean I had mentioned this last meeting even if cuts are discussed and not approved they just you know people don't want to do them I think they still need to be put out there so that people see that they were discussed I don't feel like they they were just from what I hear and I also like for my budgeting I'll have administrative costs and I have technical costs hardly ever want to touch the technical cost because that's what's getting my job done but the administrative costs they've got to go at times you got some hard decisions there here I always hear about you know we're trying not to let any more teachers go and that which I agree with 100% they should not they should be kind of the technical staff they shouldn't be administratively though I think we need a really hard look at what's going on with the administration costs where can we combine roles where do we need to eliminate roles what are the hard decisions we have to make on these administrative costs to get them way down and then bring that up to the board and say look we can we can avoid these costs but this is the price we have to pay we're going to you know be losing this this and this and then the board votes on it rather than I it just seems like the only solution we ever have is we've got to raise some taxes and then let's put a question on to raise taxes more but you know kind of split it off so they don't realize it so um sorry for the big rant but I just that I wasn't expecting that second question and it was hard enough thinking about the two 2.7% uh but it's not 2.7% you know we're asking for a lot more than that so lastly I will say if you are going with that second question definitely you need to figure out how to get it out to people because you're going to have people that are going to vote no immediately when they see it and you're GNA have people that are going to vote Yes immediately because they're going to be like oh it's a school I'm G to vote for it but you really need informed people because we need to get you know this is sad enough we we need informed people to to show up and and start realizing where their tax dollars are going so thanks thank you very much we have Carolyn Inc carnado Mrs Inc carnado hi there thanks for taking my call again um I want to thank Miss pellet for really um pressing the issue of the SAT class um I find it to be extremely important for students to have access to that um these three sport athletes these you know these students you know the students that sign up for things sign up for lots of things and I understand that the summer is critical I wanted to ask Mr Rogers I know there's three faculty members that teach this class there's normally um an English uh you know a vocabulary um English and then there's a writing teacher and there's a math teacher are all three available this summer if you're able to get enough students for this summer session and and because I know you're still trying uh no I already made the decision not to do it based on the right oh that is so sad I'm so sorry to hear that like I said I sent we sent emails out to all the um Rising uh Juniors Rising uh sophomore or and and parents and we had eight people and the people who are reaching out to the students for participation the advisers um they reached out to me and said here's where we're at and they they I think they wanted to make a decision based on what they were doing um as well but we did with with eight people interrested and they weren't even committed that's where we were at and it would would have cost us I believe what did I say uh close to uh seven six or seven um two um close close to uh close to $6,000 the price for this sat we used to call it sat team back in the day I don't know if they still call it that but um the price for that is extremely reasonable you've offered it to neighboring districts as well and you put it out to other districts to increase enrollment for the summer um they've done that in in the past but uh like like I said uh it's it's going to be we want to we want to fund it for our students and when they initially ran the SAT team because the discussions I had with the advisor ERS it was self-funded and then then they they were given stiens and um like I said our concern and that's what we're going to be working on next year in the uh in the winter and spring teams is trying to increase enrollment by outre further Outreach uh through uh I believe I talked about it before uh reaching out during and Charles mentioned uh during uh back to scho back to school night um Now text messages um listen I like I said I was the one who who who started the summer sat and it was with the expectations that we would have um High participation and two years ago there were six kids I understand but the eight students that were interested now lose out because we didn't offer it to area districts nearby and at such a good price it could have happened and it's unfortunate so I'm sorry to hear I'm very sad for those eight students they're going to lose this summer um um so I let me get to this ballot question which was explosive it was very explosive topic I don't think anyone expected that tonight um after exceeding the cap of 2.74% um you're looking for another $2 million from the taxpayers we've just come off a forensic audit showing mismanagement poor accounting practices and poor DEC ision and asking for all this money after exceeding this cap um it feels like we just go to the taxpayers I agree with uh Mr casselle that just spoke it's like we just go to the taxpayers when we run out of money all right we'll just get some more money from the taxpayers we're out of money again and um you know private businesses families in this town um when they don't have enough money for something they don't go out to dinner they don't do Improvement ments on their home they cut back they might take as big a vacation as they normally would we're not cutting anywhere that anyone can see what we're doing is we're just saying to the taxpayers guess what we're out of money so we're going to need some more if you want this or that we'll have to do more and no one has really seen any significant Cuts anywhere in fact again I'm going to mention we have over2 million unspent from this budget so it's a hard pill to swallow to keep going back to the well and just telling the taxpayers that they have to get more and more money and give more and more money to a district that is not doing well the test scores you know continue to be poor so what are we getting for all this extra money what what do you say to the taxpayers that say tell me what we're going to get for all this extra money you want from us a lot of people that comment at these board meetings have talked about and we've talked about it we just mentioned we lost sat class we lost the late buses and we lost 52 point positions from last year so saying that we're we're not cutting and and I have people at the meetings who are asking about bringing things back it's it's hard to cut and have people asked to bring things back at the same time so we're looking to replace out of those 52.5 people 20 positions to provide the the multi-tier system of support the RTI and to reduced class size to provide the the education that a lot of people talked about in the past the this is what Vernon was able to do with the $7.5 million less in state aid we're not able to do or or provide the same thing that that some students had had a couple years ago so I just want so oh I just I'm sorry I just wanted to just ask one thing I'm sorry Mr slam so with this ballot question for $2 million and hiring back these teachers these teachers would then be guaranteed a job for one year like the 40 some teachers that we lost or or that'll be rolled into the buget in the future and for future tax increases it'll be rolled in the the budget to provide um 2 million of the 7.5 million shortfall to provide the the services for our students uh that that they're now missing so we should then expect the tax increase every year to cover the increase in faculty that you're looking to hire with this ballot question if it happens so this is an increase to the tax base and as the reoccurring expenses of staff are reoccurring and should only be funded through reoccurring revenues uh it would be part of the tax base moving forward so one of the things that I just kind of wanted to add I understand everyone's frustration with hearing 7.5 million doar have been cut I'm very frustrated too and I've only been here since October but I think the most frustrating thing is that we had $7.5 million cut it's it's a reality you can't just make up $7.5 million on loss revenue of for example our our 2% is $900,000 approximately so you figure we've lost $7.5 million a year we're only allowed to increase approximately $900,000 our Revenue each year and that's really the only source of Revenue you can increase other than the fact that I came in and I found that there was a low hanging through that our interest rate was very low but unfortunately the feds are eventually going to cut that interest rate and we're going to lose that extra $500,000 of Revenue as it and feds cut interest rate when they be that inflation slow so I understand everyone's frustrated I'm very frustrated this is the probably the most frustrating budget I've ever created and it was because all those cuts that you kind of alluded to not seeing they already happened last year the one thing that you know I told Russ I or Mr Rogers I said I I don't know how you had those meetings with you know 52 people saying sorry you no longer have a job that must have been terrible so there been very hard Cuts made in this district and there's not a lot left to cut other than staff there isn't a lot of administration in this districts I mean we're down to the point where if you would to cut something you're deciding that you're just not going to offer there's G be no one running it there's no not a lot of people left and I know I'm a little like animated right now but it's just because I don't want to increase the tax burden right but there's only so many options we have when you lose that amount of money 10% of your budget I'm not going to make it up on a $50,000 rental fee each year on on a cell tower right and I understand everyone wants scores to go up everyone at this table everyone of this districts wants scores to go up but if you lose 52 staff and I'm not sure how many you have the number off the top your head about how many of those were teachers 37 37 37 of them were teachers there was administrators in there you can't lose that many staff especially you know we're a few years from Co now but you can't lose that many that much staff and say w you know see you're not really going to see improvements because you're not going to have as many staff teaching the kids so we understand your frustration I'm we're all very frustrated but there are limited things that we can do to to raise funds so that comes to the point well you know we want scores to go up if we lost all that staff and only you know we we need staff but we can't fund the staff because the state took the money away right they cut it and we can't raise the money to replace that because when you're talking $900,000 a year and I know you said you don't like inflation h no one likes inflation but the reality is things are more expensive the dollar is not going as far at home but also in the district so while you deal with it at home or in your private businesses the the reality is our one our dollar here isn't isn't buying as much as it would previously either so you have a compound issue of you're losing 10% of your Revenue your cost of everything's going up and on top of that you're losing all of your asset grants all the federal funds that came from covid after this year June 30th all gone that provided a lot of flexibility in the budget so for example you're referencing the balance this year that that's not what I think the balance is going to be at the end of the year I'm hoping that I can work some magic and make it a little bit better than that because if that balance is the balance at the end of the year we're gonna have major Cuts going into the next year which I want to avoid because we've already had major Cuts so I've used those eser grants all appropriately in ways that they're allowed to be used through amendments to the grants to try to help that balance and keep keep that balance there so when we get to the table next year for these conversations we're not talking about another large number of staff that we're GNA have to try to figure out who can who could be cut in a situation where we've already lost 52 people because at a certain point you're going to start eliminating programs right and I think I we already and you already have eliminated um clubs and activities and buses and and and programs look at the SAT team is already eliminated for the summer um I mean I mean bigger programs well and I agree with you so what can you say to I mean the town is at a 0% tax increase so the district is looking at 2.74% which is the majority of of the town's taxes every taxpayer the majority of their taxes is school taxes so you're looking for an increase of 2.74% which translates to how much in dollars Mr slam so we're we're incre our increased because it's half of one year half of another year for the tax levy is 2.26 7% because it's half of last year's tax levy and half of the next year's tax levy because we're on a different fiscal year than this uh than the town so the budget year increases 2.74 one% for our tax ly but it's split over two tax years right and then you have ratables so I think we had a discussion um and for anyone that's watching anyone in the audience please look at my presentations that I had because I did talk about the I think it was around three or if it was three or four million dollars in Cuts I included on one of those slides that I cut out of this budget um I didn't go through line by line because everyone will be really upset when we at the end of that meeting because we'd be here for about eight hours going over every single line all the cuts I did I went for the big ones to say hey these are the big cuts we did but also these are the big increases we have um that we really don't have a ton of control over uh and just just to kind of paint a picture of where we are um so in terms of I'm sorry could you miss kado could you uh the dollar amount of the just the dollar amount of the 2.74% plus the two million so I think the 2.4% was about a million three thereabouts uh so for the budget year the increase to our tax levy would be, 248,000 okay so a milliion 240 plus another 2 million on the ballot question so you're looking for the taxpayers to come up with 3.2 mil4 240,000 that would be if you would like the district to start replacing some of the staff that were lost to the state a cuts and that's so M Mr Rogers are you able to tell us what improvements we'll see with all that money are you able to say that the the test scores are going to go up dramatically by getting $3.2 million from the taxpayers what are you gonna see what are we gonna see for that money I I that's why I presented the uh second question everyone today you're gonna see 16 teachers to reduce class size and support students increase security uh restore two additional counseling staff to restore support for student mental health uh additional busing so the late buses will be back and a skilled maintenance worker I understand that but I'm asking you about the test scores are you seeing an improvement in curriculum and test scores and student Improvement well the uh the school performance data reports came out recently and if you look at uh um growth uh what is it um progress student progress we had met most of our standards in the student progress in the last testing cycle now we haven't met where we want to be as far as scores but we had had great uh we had met most of the goals for student growth in the last state test and we're hoping to continue that this year as well I've had conversations again I'm having curricular conversations on a regular basis this year I'm excited about where our NJ GPA scores will be at the high school this year and in May is when they take all the uh njsla tests uh that will will be should be out in in uh July or August I just have to assume that right now you don't know if $3.2 million is going to increase student achievement it's hard I know it'll it'll it'll it'll get the late buses back it'll it'll decrease class size and it'll be able to give us interventionist that we talked about in the presentation earlier to help students uh decrease the Gap in those early grades especially in uh first second and third grades I okay I'm going to close with this comment um we have a student uh that we write a check for uh the taxpayers pay every single month for the last this is our third year to the flex school we get zero reimbursement from the state of New Jersey for the student because I guess the state doesn't believe that the servic is provided are we reimbursable or I don't know if that's really the term you would use um so that exceeds $500,000 um that's significant uh taxpayers all know about that they all know what happened with that and I just want to close with that so to come to us for an additional 2. million over 2.74% tax increase takes a lot of guts on your part to do that and um I don't know how you sit there and ask us for that money with the district in the shape it's in thank you very much for all your time tonight I appreciate it uh just I just want to actually found my budget notes um kind of talking about the budget um and it's on the slides if you want to take a look at it some of those increases I was talking about previously uh were approximately 150k just for district liability insurance um about a little bit over $800,000 for health and other employee benefits uh an increase of about $650,000 Transportation by about 125k for energy and then 1.5 million uh for contractual salaries so as you can see all that was fit into the budget with only an increase in revenue of about 1.2 million just to kind of show you that there was a lot cut out in order to make some of those fixed costs get into the budget and I want to correct that data that was said before uh we cut 35 uh teaching positions from last year to this year and then that 2.74 1% number is not the tax increase for the taxpayer it's the increase in the tax levy so that we our tax levy is the amount that the school district raises out of taxes the town raises it for the school district so our tax levy not the whole District not The Whole Town's tax levy is only going up is going up 2.74 one% which is approximately $1.2 million little over $1.2 million that's not the increase that would be felt by the taxpayer that will depend on the value of your assessed home um and on the slides show I also included um if you look at it you'll see the tax rate so you could take that tax rate and multiply it by the assess value of your home and you would see uh what the schools because the school's tax rate you would see what uh your uh tax rate would be for that year and then you could compare it to the prior year based off your assessed value and see what that would be for your for your individual house that is on one of the slides I don't do want to say though I have it in decimal form I don't have it in so you would have to make sure that you you convert to to an interest to a percentage Point sorry thank you uh we have Martin peringer Mr peringer you have the floor I hope I unmuted uh can you hear me yes okay uh I'm applauding that you're going to the people and I hope the people act properly in approving the tax increase I'm behind it I think you have a lot of work of explaining it and to reaching out to the people you can start with putting it into the superintendent's blog principal's blogs sending it home with the digital backpack putting it into the editor's note or inviting a journalist from the local newspaper over to comeet make a press release that says uh we discussed this next week when you vote on it we voted on that and it the result of the vote was this and that that and then start advertising it we doing it because make detailed advertised and bullet point advertised put some flyers and some posters up at the sports events and at the r day and at the theater and all this kind of events to the budget in general I want to say we are suffering from mistakes grave mistakes made in the past over the past 20 years we had an annual inflation average inflation you can check this up with the federal data and with the state data of 3.6% 20 years ago in 2004 we had 5,000 students now we have about three we lost about 2.6% 2.5 2.6% of students each year so the inflation was 1% higher than the number of students we lost in 2004 we had a school budget of $65 million total so if you add that 1% per year we should have a school budget of about 75 to 80 million now yeah we are below that so we cut plus we lost the state aid as we know for whatever reason it's gone due to that fact we have cut a lot of people out maybe it's part of the reason why we have sunk in our uh scores there was teacher firings and yes there was mismanagement of what should I call it people handling has in my opinion not been a positive effect on morale in the school as general with all those people losing their jobs so there are some rebuilding to do here and now where did the people ask where did all the money go it went into the taxpayer's pocket it's in my pocket too now I'm not happy to Shell out more money but I do it because education is important education is the future of our kids our kids are important so now everybody needs to ask thems for an average r on house the 2 millionar that is sought comes out to a medium cup of coffee we get the daily beam are the extra teachers and the school buses worse to you a medium cup of coffee at the daily Bean per week and my answer is yes Mr Rogers on the bo of AD you can have my weekly cup of coffee thank you Mr parer appreciate that Al righty we have Jesse paladini Mrs paladini yes um couple things uh I just want to quickly address something that the prior speaker said yes education is vastly important but there is no way that putting more money to education guarantees successful results we can see that from our test scores so this nonsense of spend as much money as you want put as much money into education as you can because it's important is just nonsense um I want to go back to the SAT Summer Prep I did not think I would ever address that again but after tonight's discussion I will um I appreciate you looking at it again but I think that the entire conversation was nonsense you had no intention of offering it to our children while we're saying throw as much money into education as you can we're also saying no we don't want to pay $4,000 for SAT prep now you did not put it out to other districts as you should have originally you said the entire cost was about $6,000 so eight kids at $200 a piece comes to $600 6,000 -600 is 4,400 and once again we spend $465 a day to transport one student to an unlawful outof District school oh yes it's lawful now we got it lawful within 7 days so it's not worth $4,400 to help students with the SATs as far as my grandson's concerned I don't even care anymore because um he has sacrificed and he is in the SAT course now and then he quick rushes over to track so he misses part of track but he's um very motivated and he's making it happen I'm look I'm just so disappointed I have been a huge proponent of Vernon schools for decades I have raised tens of thousands of dollars for Vernon schools for decades on the sat on the Historical Society I was probably your biggest fan in all of Vernon and now I just find every meeting more disappointing than the one before yes you are improving you are improving from what we had over the last couple of years I do appreciate that meeting that Ry ran for the forens that audit and I do believe you're moving in the right direction I hope we never go back to what we had over the last four years but you know those ballot questions Tricky Tricky Tricky many years ago people used to talk about masero pool this is not a belittlement of Tony massino I love the man dearly he's my neighbor i t a b in his house and I happen to think he's the greatest superintendent we ever had AR de benad comes a very close second but many years ago he did a referendum where he threw everything in there absolutely everything a little of this Sports band um whatever this way everybody will look at the referendum and they'll say oh yeah I want to increase the sports program oh I absolutely want more money to go into band so you know you create this this budget question for November and you throw the after school buses in there tricky guys you're really tricky please do better please go back to doing for the children and I personally think that the refusal to spend $44 for a summer SAT prep course is shameful that's all I have to say thank you and good night good night we have George uh nicaro Mr nicov uh thank you for pronouncing it correctly I'm trying I'm trying yeah I know I know it's a tough last name to pronounce and uh forgive me I uh I'm uh under the weather I've been under the weather for the past week so if my voice is a little nasly um I apologize um I wasn't going to speak tonight uh about this however um you know I think some of the comments are compelling me to speak uh tonight uh regarding the referendum that you're proposing and I'm I I I I'll I'll say this I'm I'm not opposed to giving you my medium coffee from uh the daily Bean as one speaker said uh I think that was a good a good analogy however um I think that the Board needs to present a plan a little more detailed plan uh as to exactly where the money's going to go how it's going to improve things this the questions that you're that you're hearing tonight are of concerned parents who who care about our schools who care about what their students do I I care about my kids and in the school as well uh I think they're getting a great education uh but uh for some residents in town it's a little bit of a of a hard pill to swallow uh this type of increase and so I think while it's great that you're that you're proposing this uh and that you're moving you're trying to find a solution to get all these things back uh you're going to have a big uphill battle uh when it's going to come to vote um I for one would like to see a more detailed plan I and admit that I've only come halfway into the meeting so I didn't listen to the full uh dialogue regarding the budget uh but uh I think one of the board of AD members said that uh there needs to be a lot of Outreach on this uh I think you're GNA need more than just a lot of Outreach to convince uh the town um and I do hope to learn a lot more about it uh including uh the cause and effect uh like if we are hiring x amount of teachers uh can we expect um an increase in test scores I think that's a great analogy and if that's a connection you can establish uh even in a uh qualitative fashion then you might you might win a a few voters including myself uh so uh I hope to see that in the future uh and uh I think you're doing I think you're doing the best you can um and uh thank you very much for hearing me out have a good night thank you for your comments we appreciate them no problem uh that's everybody okay we're GNA close the meeting to the public and move on to it k does anybody want to bring up anything open board member for sorry it's so late I have I have a couple things sure first first I want to keep right here as long as possible he might be here physically but he's not here by F first actually is a little bit serious I just want to send out my condolences to U the L to our to our VTS family and to our community um we did I did know two two of the people personally um and and I think um I know they were well liked well love well loved and uh they gave a lot to uh back to the community um not saying that the other person didn't but I didn't know so I can't you didn't have Mr pasy as your I had Miss oh you did yeah yeah so uh yeah I was I was here actually when they used to have the fountain in the front so that's right so I just want to send out you know that um you know our prayers in uh our prayers are with the families um the second thing is I I I'm pretty sure I saw the girls ke Club ski team state champions state champions they're ski team yes so I just want to give them a shout out um uh I had a a question about um our uh special services assessment how's that going are we we started it are we moving along didn't you hear my special services report the one thing come on we had an interim update and the full report will be April 30th okay she was here with the special services director and supervisor today touring all the buildings and we reported out um hopefully we'll get that information to you she she's interviewed parents She interviewed teachers special ed teachers General Ed teachers all the principles she didn't really give us how it's going or anything like that but just she told us what she was doing okay I was looking I I know I'm I meant a little bit more um there some emails U sent to the board and I wanted to see you know are we addressing um some of the concerns that um yeah you're on special services aren't you we haven't had a meeting well we did we did there I'm not special services I'm sorry thought you were um that we can't talk about okay but we wanted we should have mentioned that at we had an email we'll talk about it he did yeah we just didn't really dig into it all right so then I'll move down to the next topic um the one thing I I there's two things actually I would like to talk about um that I at a next work session if we can actually go through our goals uh we had our audit our uh yeah the forensic audit I'd like to start incorporating some of the stuff we learned into our goals um so if we can all maybe think about it and come back on next work session and are we doing goals at the special meeting on the 16th training about the goals you're good yeah but what but it shouldn't be out of work session I'm getting confused of what we're supposed to do like training this type of training has to be in meaning they're going to train us on how to do the whole procedure of the goals and what it's about so we're going to come out with goals and and I mean may not come out with all the goals after that but we'll know how to get the goals right and then we can come back at the work session and that's what I'm saying at the next work session we might be all an open I got to double check but it should be an open yeah has to be an open right work sessions open right yeah yeah yeah think things more like operation I absolutely agree we're way overdue for this but at least we have a plan we still don't have a full board I mean we've had a lot of changes yeah I know but we have no plan and no direction of where we're going because we're we're doing an assessment on on Russ right and we have and then we're done with his school year right and where he's starting his next school year he has to make sure his goals are supposed to I would like to see the goals before we start the school year and and we all know the town knows what the direction that the district's going in we would have them by next school year unless we just don't do it but because I feel like every time I've seen it a lot of times we talk about it in December September and I don't I don't think we ever really finished it this year we haven't we did have one discussion and we agreed we would discuss it further and then we just never did constant turnover people keep coming and going and and I'm excited about yeah I'm excited about beginning my third year superintendency with a ba and a HR uh HR supervisor at the start of the school year and having people in place because it is the first you know even at the start of this past year it was it was uh a transition for a lot of people as well aot think we can align a lot of our goals uh you've seen my goals already and I think we can make some great progress in doing that for next year we have to have for Cusack right I I think we really need to work them you know like I don't want to i' rather not see the same goals back up there again and I think over the years it's not changed as much especially with this audit we had done we paid a lot of money for it that should be incorporated somewhere in our goals and then should be coming down to Russ and he can we can measure we have that in a Reconciliation we'll share that with you and the way that you're going to be seeing the reconciliation at the end of each month is very easy to see where where money's removed and there'll be a note with any transfers over $50,000 right so one of the things I to mention with that you'll start to see that some so in the past it's only been budget transfers that have been shown not one side Appropriations which is when be like a grant and you or extra money you increase it we're going to start giving the whole list including that so there will be instances where you'll see it's not zero at the bottom but that's because we received additional money we to a one-sided appropriation gotta and and with that too I think we also need to we have scheduled monthly meetings for our committees that are not scheduled and and we come here to our Workshop to discuss what we should have been talking about in our our committee meetings right that's why we have the Committees we come to Workshop we can discuss with the of board members and then we push out referendum whatever we have to change in our Open Session but we're going through the list today there were majority of them were there were no attendees and we didn't have meetings you didn't respond to my last two requests that's true but why I work in I've worked in many companies well you to have regular SCH a schedule meeting if it's a monthly scheduled meeting it's monthly and a schu right and we never I've never seen that here it's always everybody throws out an email here we go this is a couple dates which is okay it it's it's worked maybe a little bit but it doesn't always work and I see quite often when we're at a work session this meeting this committee didn't take place this committee didn't take place and and we're ruining the the process of of what we're we were trying to accomplish here so it's a suggestion I I don't think we you know we have to make a policy change or I think this is something we've all just decide to do is schedule that and schedule that for the year and if things have to change you change it during the year but it shouldn't that should be the exception to change it I think that's a great idea and I think I hope you've done your board evaluation for the meeting that we're going to have about how you know because that would be a great thing to talk about on the 16th um you know we say from my committee yes that we were trying to meet the Tuesday or Monday before yeah meeting and then you had the friends of got it screwed up multiple meetings when they were coming where they were come we don't have I if I ask right now and I said can I have the calendar for the board for the year I I don't think any of us can produce that and that should be something committees we could do it should be at least we have an idea where we're going yeah it's a good idea I mean we we should just and there's going to be exceptions right I I I totally agree we had few months we had the holiday right we were off last week that could be a reason why we didn't have a lot of meetings but we should have something so we have something to talk about at these at the work sessions I just wanted to make a suggestion when you're looking at this you might want to make it um not an exact date but maybe like the meeting um just because the meeting dates each month will change a little bit so it's always the same day each month um they run into an issue where you're having the meeting every month but the meeting's still not just like you put in an Outlook I want the first you know Monday every month and it just does it for you automatically because it you guys also it affects you guys even more because you you're actually have to take time away from your day or stay late that day right so if you had a calendar you can say well don't have the baby this week I'm gonna I'm gonna so that's that's another yeah would have been like 11 pound baby all right I like that idea that's it okay Mo to adjourn I think R has things he wants to get pH motion to adjourn Dr Ross seconded by Jen all in favor I I close char No way way yes