welcome everybody to this regular meeting of Vera planning board on March 28 2024 Madam Secretary can you please call the RO Mr Bernardo Mr katth here Mr Lily here Mr Heyman here Mr coody here Mr deal here mran here m ran mayor Tim Boro here Vice chair FY here chairperson Pearson here Mr M here and there's no engineer tonight no but I mean Mr T is not here tonight um all right can everybody join me for theedge United States indice the notice requirements of the open public meetings act have been satisfied with respect to this meeting of the township of Verona planning board which is being held in person in the ballroom of the Verona Community Center located loated at 880 Bloomfield Avenue Verona the time and date of this meeting were included in the annual meeting notice posted in the community center and sent to the official newspapers of the township the Verona Cedar Grove times and the Star Ledger at least 48 Hours preceding the start time of this meeting the agenda and instructions on how to comment will be provided at the appropriate time all meetings are recorded those wishing to speak during any public comment period shall only provide their name and municipality street addresses are not required please be advised that should a member of the public choose to State their street address it will not be redacted from this recording okay so at this time we will open to any member of the public that has any comment and it doesn't appear that there are any public members present so we will close public comment um we will be uh approving the meeting minutes from February 22nd at our next meeting so we're going to put that on the back burner and we have no resolutions this evening so sorry without further Ado um we are going to hear from our planner s and welcome s very happy from h2m uh thank you Madame chair uh good evening everyone um so I'm here to talk to you about the area in need of Rehabilitation uh for the Bloomfield Avenue Corridor and before I uh dig deep into that I just wanted to um outline what the procedure is as per the local Redevelopment and Housing law lrhl so basically you're in receipt of a report um from me along with a resolution from the governing body so as per the requirements for area in need of Rehabilitation the governing body has to prepare a proposed resolution with with uh the report attached and your role as the planning board is very similar to that of uh what you do um when there's an ordinance that has been sent to you um it's pretty similar but this is Guided by the local Redevelopment Housing law and not the ml um so um I will give you a brief overview of uh just the rehabilitation uh report and process and then also talk about the consistency with the master plan and um also take any recommendations or comments from you for me to forward it to the governing body uh please note that again your role is advisory and the governing body may take or may not take your uh recommendations so um with without further Ado I just want to hop into um how the statutes have specific criteria to designate an area in need of Redevelopment uh Rehabilitation I apologize um so the Bloomfield um uh Avenue Corridor the entire 1.85 mile length was studied um and uh based upon the six criteria that's identified and I have written that in the page uh uh on page three of my report you don't need to satisfy all of them satisfaction of just one is sufficient um and they are if I if you can bear with me I'll quickly go through them the first is that significant portion of structures are in a deteriorated or substandard condition number two more than half of the housing stock is at least 50 years old um there's a pattern of vacancy abandonment or underutilization um then there's a persistent arrage of property tax payments on properties environmental cont uh number five is environmental contamination that's uh discouraging improvements and investment and number six which is majority of um the water and SE infrastructure is um at least 50 years old and in need of repair and substantial maintenance and um you know the statute also further says that should the town decide um uh you know that just the overall conditions extend beyond that Corridor um a finding of need of Rehabilitation May extend to the entire area of municipality that's not what this report is suggesting I'm just talking about what the statutes require so um we uh basically you know went uh through through uh the property tax assessment records uh we also contacted the township engineer uh to give us um information about what's um what's the condition of the water and sewer infrastructure and I really want to take a moment to acknowledge Mr O salivan who's been really very helpful along the entire process whatever I request I get it promptly so I I do want to mention that um but uh when we so uh basically when you look at the assessment of the housing stock and even if you walk on Bloomville Avenue Corridor it's obvious that there is older housing and um I I think page 10 of my new report from March 14th talks about at least uh 65 uh% of 63% I'm sorry uh of the housing stock is more than 50 years old and um I've included the letters uh for the sewer and water from our engineer who says that it's more than 50 years old and um in need of uh repair and constant maintenance So based on these two criteria um this area satisfies as an area in need of Rehabilitation um once we give our recommendations the governing body May adopt a resolution designating the corridor as an area in need of uh Rehabilitation and then uh the the next step is for the governing body to decide what they would want to do with the area and in my report the last page uh conclusion recommendations um basically uh dis uh enumerate uh what they could do I discussed that with the governing body at the March 11th presentation um so that's um a brief summary of the report and I want to go uh to the role of the planning board where we uh ascertain if it is consistent with the master plan and I have few sections of the master plan that I'd like to read out if I may um so the master plan recognize that as a fully developed Community any development should come from uh uh Rehabilitation and Redevelopment would come not should and it's page 10 of the report in right UPF front in the introduction we acknowledge that um and then in the economic development one of our goals was to continue to ensure Bloomfield Avenue is a vibrant uh an attractive downtown and in that one of the objectives really specific uh would be Rehabilitation and Redevelopment of existing buildings and storefronts to have incentives for um infield infield development uh and Redevelopment along Bloomfield most specifically for the land use plan which is page on page 52 uh we recognized uh Bloomfield Avenue Corridor um should be considered which is considered the town's downtown could benefit from Rehabilitation designation and um you know we talk about incentivizing property owners and this rehab designation does that and most specifically on page 72 recommendation number 16 um we recommend that um the governing body conducts an investigation study to determine if Bloomfield Avenue Corridor satisfies the rehabilitation criteria so the governing the township manager um directed me to do this study I as I mentioned conducted this study and found that it satisfies two out of the six criteria um and is um satisfies as the criteria to be an area need of Rehabilitation and that's it from me thank you um just before general questions can you expand a little bit on what it means to be an area in need of Rehabilitation from the perspective of incentive incentives for owners thank you sure so um so area need of rehabil uh Rehabilitation allows irrespective of the fact whether you adopt a Redevelopment plan or not it allows uh the governing body of the town to Grant uh short-term 5-year tax abatements um and other funding uh for um people and Property Owners to um apply for them a well of it and and um improve their uh properties so it uh opens uh up to uh funding opportunities and who do they get the funding from uh it's it's through the tax abatement that we give it's a short-term tax abatement okay a short-term fiveyear Max correct correct questions uh I don't have any questions for you I mean I think it's pretty obvious we meet the threshold for the determining the area need have Rehabilitation my question is really more for the governing body and the town Administration you the main vehicle for incentivization is incentivizing the property owners is through tax abatements um when personally I think we should be focusing on zoning first so have has anyone engaged any of the commercial property owners to see if by doing this it would actually incentivize them to do anything and secondly what kind of fiscal impact study has been done to see what the impact of the tax base is we have a lot of capital projects that need to be done I'm not really sure that lowering the tax base at this time is a good idea do do you know how a tax batement you you understand how Tax batement Works yeah they get a temporary tax repri sorry they get a temporary tax actually actually their underlying taxation Remains the Same and if they conduct the improvements um they uh they there is an when they get into an agreement it's only that amount uh that they've agreed upon is what they need to pay so for example if I have a property and I'm just going to use like simple $100 right and today I'm paying $100 that it's assessed at $100 and I'm I'm paying it's 100% as of the assess value so I pay whatever it is right right um now tomorrow I get incentives uh to improve my property and there's a it it's 200 but if I've had an agreement that I'm only paying 50 for five years um it it what I would pay I the so I would pay 150 then 200 so what that means is um you know my your uh the revenues in the town will not reduce uh you know so so for example we're missing we're we're deferring that capture though I beg your pardon you're deferring that capture for a greater amount yes for a greater amount but you're telling me that if if property is assessed $100 after the renovation it's 200 and you have an incentive you defer that extra $100 for five years so for five years whatever is the agreement is what you pay right uh but still it's not like if if if the town was getting that $100 they it's not that they're going to reduce not get that 100 they'll get 100 and then they'll get that 50 instead of 200 for a period of whatever years immediately it's deferred that's correct right so what I'm saying is what kind of fiscal impact has been done to show what the impact very legitimate question I mean there's obviously a shortterm immediate impact right that has to be weighed against the long-term goal and and but then and then there should also be engagement with the property owners to see if they're actually going to take it because if we're going to go on this road and no one's going to do it then then why do it lose money well you don't you don't legislate I'll let me jump in here because Mr C question I think is directed toward Mr O solivan and I you don't legislate based on conversations with people and then and then do what you think Property Owners might want to do right you engage in legislation in order to meet strategic goals of the community and one that was identified was to try to change the Aging facade of the township um and doing so part of the problem with Verona is that a good portion of Bloomfield Avenue especially is owned by people who not do not live in the community uh in fact a lot of the owners are don't live in the state um and as a result don't have an incentive they're not driving by the property as long as it's being rented they're usually you know okay with it and as a result our facade is not modern so we are hoping that the providing and we haven't engaged in any ordinance change as far as what incentive would be or anything like that at this point providing that incentive will get people who otherwise would not upgrade their infrastructure to do so what that does is increases the property values for everybody in the municipality not just the people doing projects um and a short-term tax abatement on the improvements it's very sound it's being done in many other communities uh other communities are doing it on Residential Properties as well in order to upgrade communities and to have neighborhoods that are more attractive and increase everybody's property values so to answer your question it's not going to cost the township anything to do this uh I believe you raised capital projects which I think is quite out of the scope of the planning board but at the same point if you wanted to address those questions as a member of the public at a council meeting we'd of course love to hear your questions all of us uh but at the same point it doesn't cost us anything and as a result there's no impact on our our Capital planning and further we always have capital projects so if doing a A taxen in the future which once again there's no ordinance to do yet um were to increase our property tax uh base in the future it seems very wise investment to do that um mran anything to I think he captured it pretty well I think the only other thing is again this is is capturing the objectives of the master plan to help incentivize uh Rehabilitation along Bluefield Avenue which again does provide an economic benefit to the township and to the surrounding properties therefore assisting in broadening the tax base for all these capital projects current and in the future so I understand all of that and that's great and I understand that you may not want to legislate based on that but I mean it's a data deriven decision nothing stopping you from being proactive I've said this before that I don't think a lot of decisions are made in this town that are data driven there's no nothing stopping you from doing that and frankly the only thing that's going to have people invest their properties if they can raise the rent on Commercial properties and if the cost of the facade and the trade-off on the abatement isn't going to be fiscally worth it for them then they're not going to engage in that whereas doing something with the zoning which frankly is also called out in the master plan can be tackled first the zoning ordinances in progress Mr Kat okay but one really kind of doesn't have anything to do with the other I'm sorry but I am going to interrupt a little bit only because by the way that's beyond our purview the zoning will come to us for consistency but we don't draft that that's up to the council that process happens that's born with them and comes to us for review and for comment but it's not our job to do our job was the master plan we did that and and not everyone will jump on this not every uh property owner along the Avenue will seek to engage in this potential they they may be as laxidasical as was referred to they they just don't they get their rent they go on their business and they won't improve but there will be some that will or and will every single one of these be approved or is there a standard that would apply that's a a question I mean I'm sure there' be a standard it's not going to be like everybody rolling the dice that's fine and again to go back to my first statement it's clear we meet the threshold and I get that and I understand that going far down some of the comments that I raised is outside the board however in my opinion as a taxpayer it's a legitimate question to ask in this venue sure I'm not saying that it's not a legitimate question the point is is the questions that you're asking are beyond our purview and Beyond our job our job is right but I didn't ask I asked the the administration on this we can move on it's been the history of this board to be very very engaged to ask questions that people believe are relevant and Jeremy has raised some questions that are probably better suited for the mayor and Council but that doesn't mean they're not suited for this discussion I no problem with there's nobody else in the agenda like said open dialogue is great Jeremy has raised some very good questions that I think have been adequately addressed I do too and it's all good and I just yeah there's no problem I mean it's just that we're not resoning here okay I didn't say that we were going may I just interject please um so I understand your question about whether we'll be rezoning uh rehab well to be clear it goes beyond rezoning it's doing the actual analysis both on a fiscal and economical impact beyond that okay s can you provide any examples of towns that that we might know that went through this and were successful and what kind of adoption rate or or participation rate you saw from building owners um I so we do these plans uh but I've not been involved with that data unfortunately but I do have my own experience doing a rehabilitation study in at my prior job where um we had an vacant um office building and no matter what conventional zoning was not infusing any kind of um any kind of uh investment we I I was the planner for the town at that time it was a public sector job I tried to change the zoning it didn't work and um through the re uh rehabilit it didn't meet the Redevelopment criteria but the building it was a group of Office Buildings off of um a major highway it met the rehabilitation criteria what that did was uh it incentivized people to um actually buy that building and it was converted into a Lifetime Fitness so what a rehabilitation or a Redevelopment designation when done right um You can you can incentivize development you can incentivize improvements that will actually um trigger um and and really add to your tax revenues and I think that is the goal uh having done these kind of um studies for towns I don't have um the town that I worked for didn't because I was in-house and an employee I was I had an access to these things but um there are other towns where I'm actually recommending these um these kind of incentives and um I I can find out how it's worked uh but I don't have that data on me but I do know there enough towns um actually um I just remembered I did a Redevelopment plan for uh one of my towns which had an area in need of uh Rehabilitation designation and there was uh an interest in actually redeveloping a portion um and um I think it they're very it's it's been adopted and I think it's moving full steam ahead so I can talk to them and see if it's help them the um Dave one of the one of the issues that Shan had alluded to is it serves it as an incentive to get a new use a new permitted use in buildings that um make you know to to retrofit buildings for a new use so as s pointed out to the office building became a retrofitness so without perhaps the tax incentive there'd be Capital wouldn't be available to make the new use economically worthwhile so it's not just um you know we think about it in rehabilitating the facades which as the mayor had said which obviously I think we all agree we don't have the uh the newest facades going along GL but um but there's also you know based on those improvements you can do fit outs and things of that nature as well S I have a question on that Lifetime Fitness example was that just uh a rehab designation and they got the tax abatement or was that in conjunction with a plan or any sort of other no no of course a rehab designation and there was a plan and think I mention of course I metion but what I'm trying to say is that you know having a facade improvements is one aspect of a Jer and you do this yeah uh you do this far uh more than I do from the private side um so that's one incentive the second incentive is what um Greg uh mentioned too that it um gives incentive to retrofit for uh uses so what what the rehab designation does is it doesn't stop you from even applying conventional zoning yeah you know it doesn't apply you from it doesn't stop you from adopting a Redevelopment plan some people like Lifetime Fitness didn't care about uh didn't uh care about the uh exemption didn't want a pilot uh some people just want the right location for a successful business and um you know it and it creates revenues the goal is ultimately when you have a predominantly residential area and I'm repeating I know I'm preaching to the C here um so you know there is every little bit uh matters and you know you give enough um incentives for people to bite exactly and I think that's kind of like the balance that we want to try and get at what the right incentive to actually get someone to do something that they weren't already planning to do because that's where the loss comes from that I think Jeremy was talking about if the incentives that we put out there don't actually move the needle then the um Redevelopment and the rehabilitation and those facade improvements that's just a giveaway because they would have done it anyway right so that's I think that's why I think Jeremy and I think it's important as well to kind of do an analysis on what we think those incentives that'll move the needle are going to be and and holistically not like nobody hops on it yeah exactly that's so good but and if everybody does well where we going to get but but there is going to be Rehabilitation regardless of whether we do this or not right it's just is there going to be a Delta are we getting more people to do well that that really is the governing body I mean just you know and to figure out to figure out the abatements based on you know the formula for for what is decided but that's the finance people yep y yep um but yeah because but there is a there is an opportunity cost there too absolutely so um but moving on from the policy I didn't want to jump into the actual study and again it was well done I I think everybody here agrees that it meets the criteria uh my recommendations though for tightening up um I think from the engineer we need a little bit more comprehensive report for San to rely on I mean it's it's really just net opinion he just says we did the research and then recited the statutory criteria I think he just needs to identify you looked at these records They indicated this to the extent that they've done maintenance we've seen this are you referring to the water lines the water line and the they are like 100 well yeah I know well everybody knows this but it's got to be in the report he's got to build out that letter and just give the why and wherefore that's my recomendation but or I mean our role is to make recommendations to the resolution not to the the study the study well this is the study is part of the resolution they're adopting the study you know I mean I haven't seen a draft of the resolution has anybody seen a draft of the resolution but that's that's my my recommendation is have Pete just fill out that letter and attach that so because we want to make this it is so you want more you want but that's not like plans from no I want just literally like four more sentences there's within the report SE specifically was pretty light I agree with what's the I can't count you want four sentences within the report within within he just needs a new letter that says it says he he researched it to say I looked at these records They indicated this we've you know we've done service in different areas and we can tell from being out there these things are this old they're made of this material can you make that recommendation to is that something that we can make a recommendation that so no we can't and I can I may I just may I sorry Greg go ahead no you want me to go the sorry the statute is clear that the planning board's role is to make recommendations regarding the resolution I'm looking at okay it's the the we are not to critique the methodology of the study now I agree Jason that when I read it I said this isn't that opinion but that's not up to us that was the opinion that was relied upon by the governing body okay or by S and doing her and and doing her study so it's not up to us to say hey your study has flaws it's up to us to make recommendations to the resolution no we're making recommendations to the governing body and they have the ability to make modifications to what how would you modify the resolution resol how would you modify no we're making it we're making a where is the resolution it's on the website I'm pulling it up right now I'm on the council documents website Avenue in area in need of Rehabilitation 2024 d57 um I just wanted to say to what you're saying Jason I understand where you're coming from this is signed by a licensed professional engineer I write such letters for planning related um I have Rel upon such ledes on other Rehabilitation studies um and the governing bodies for one other um town that I did this work for um relied upon it as well um you know if I if I were to write say a consistency review and I put my signature on it or a rehabitation ref the stud not language until I could you know until I would justify so we can I can definitely ask of him but it's um you know not um but I don't I I don't believe it's our role as a planning court but I understand what where you're trying where you're coming from but it's my professional opinion that a letter from the township engineer is substantial if he's actually signed it his letter head but I think uh we could ask him if he has uh one or two sentence to add if he's able to do that yeah the um the resolution Jason I think you'll be happy about this for some reason um refers to the planning board the study report and the resolution that's not the way I would have drafted it but I'm sure there was a valid reason to draft it that way so I think it gives us the opportunity to to make that comment I just want to tighten things up no no I understand I mean as long as that's what I I hate to go back to the council and and go outside of what they asked us to do oh by the way this is you know your study was lousy um and I'm not suggesting it was lousy to any it I think that there was a net opinion right did what he asked and the letter says if you need any information let me know I'll give you the information okay but the referral was for the study report sure okay so as that's perfectly fine I think um I'll send out an email tomorrow and we could get we could just augmented so happy to do that any any other tightenings any I mean I don't think it's it's not I don't think it's a it's simply just like you said it just adds a little bit more definition to why we're basing this as a yes and we sending along recommendations along the lines of what we're talking about tonight or is it a yes is this a stamp of vote no the request is for recommendations so recommendations are going to be you know so far we have we have a recommendation that um we believe that the uh the U part of the basis for the determination is inadequate because it's just a net opinion rather than a uh an opinion yeah I I wouldn't even phrase it like that I would just say our recommendation is to take Pete up on his offer to provide additional information and and just just so that I wouldn't call this information inadequate at it's it it he's provided us with a map and it's his you know he's signed as a but um again to go back to what Jason you said take him up on his offer I mean it it's just we all know what the condition is right but God forbid a reviewing judge is not he's going to see what's on the record that was the one immediate thing I noticed to was just on the water Lance scene the rest of the report was so comprehensive and I got to the end and went oh which yes it's over 50 years years old so I would agree with Jason that just some additional detail would be helpful I just referred to some sort of survey that we have on on file correct that would just be simple yes because I've done two other Rehabilitation studies um and you know knock on good neither got challenged and they had been satisfied this criteria and that's what was given to us um so I felt comfortable because it's his opinion his you know should anyone challenge he'll be the one who will you know uh have to uh provide that information you know hey you want to tyen a lawyer and and if he was here he could just say this is what we did it's in the record no problem but he's he's not here so so that I think probably a very simple thing for them to add yeah any other recommendations no I have a couple of questions may or may not lead to some recommendations uh first all I just want to know what you know what does the designation the rehabilitation what levers does that give the town because that tells us what recommendations we can tell them versus a uh area in need of Redevelopment I want to know the difference between uh Rehabilitation it's interesting I actually have the memoing board um I thought I would be asked this question uh the area of need of Redevelopment and area of need of Rehabilitation are are uh all uh two different uh mechanisms as per the uh local uh re weapon and housing law um in Lay terms um the different sections of the statutes which talk about the criteria that they need to uh satisfy um Rehabilitation um you know in simple words it can be recognized as areas having like aging housing stock or a vacant storefronts or Building Maintenance old infrastructure are typically that read weapon areas um and the criteria is not as for lack of better words stringent um it's a relatively um easier mechanism um and what um the area in need of Redevelopment is is areas that exhibit um you know wider range of physical um you know like uh say for example obsolete empty shopping malls right then the areas that have environmental contamination there's a vacant land that has not been uh redeveloped whether it's public or private land for over five 10 years or over a decade I believe so there are like different criteria um so that's the difference the threshold that you need to sa satisfy for era need of Redevelopment and each of the uh six criteria is far more stringent lot of evidence there's a lot of case law so may I if you don't mind I a more interest I I understand that because I recognize the six questions were different than the seven on Redevelopment I'm more interested in what the what that does for the town for each the oh you want I'm sorry I thought you were finished no I I was just to the the differences the two biggest practical differences in an area need of Redevelopment you it can be accompanied by zone changes whether an overlay zone or you create a Redevelopment zone so that's number one an area in need of Rehabilitation unless it's part of an area in need of Redevelopment okay cannot cannot be a zone change um U or you know any overlay zone or whatever and that's because of the the um the notice requirement area need to redevelop you need Super notice everybody within the Zone has to be notified of the study it's which we have gone through etc etc the other thing the long of the area need of Redevelopment is long-term tax abatement if you remember when we did Anon the long-term tax abatement where the developer has to uh submit proofs of of what projected uh Revenue income is whatever you want to call it um so there are long-term tax abatements available with the area need Development Area need of Rehabilitation does not allow the governing body to change any zon okay so there's less I I I disagree uh the difference is area need of Rehabilitation and area need of R development both can adopt a Redevelopment plan the fundamental difference is that area need of Rehabilitation cannot give long-term tax uh but you cannot do an area in need of Rehabilitation that changes zoning unless it's part of an area in need of Redevelopment you can adopt a uh you cannot because there's no notice how can you do an area in need of re of Rehabilitation and change Zone without super development plan has has different noticing requirements uh you're talking about noticing for the area the actual investigation there are two types of noticing for area in need of there has to be investigation of all the properties in the in the proposed Redevelopment right in in the proposed Redevelopment Zone but the zoning part the zoning part is area in need of Rehabilitation also can adopt area need of Rehabilitation cannot change zoning unless there's been super notice under area let me ask you this s can we we have an area in Rehabilitation right here that we're doing tonight can the Zone be changed if they adopt a Redevelopment plan yes well if they adopt the Redevelopment plan there's got to be super noticed and it has to be part of notice it has to be part of an area in need of Redevelopment an area in need of Rehabilitation standing alone cannot cannot be an area in need of Redevelopment because it's a totally different there's totally different section in the statute it can't be you're no there you I'm positive I I I I agree with s you can't you can the big difference is the longterm and the condemnation ofin Dom condemnation is the that's why you super you're not going to like my other eight questions I havec I have done Redevelopment plans which have changed the zones in um in Two Towns so I know and it's and improper no it's not uh you know what the noticing difference is uh Greg the noticing difference is that in any re the lrhl is silent about noticing for a Redevelopment plan no yes it is no for a re Rehabilitation plan the Redevelopment plan explicitly says explicitly says the rehabilitation statute explicitly says that you need Super notice explicitly for the Redevelopment investigation yes you need to dumpster fire anyway we're getting we're boring these we'll talk about it Jason we'll talk about it I'll send you my brief that I won my take Ison if this is just sorry you know facelift and and yeah know listen you know that's what slap 4 is all about it's cleanup um you know I I have I hope our zoning changes or can be thought of and you're taking the entire Corridor so to just take it as it is and and you know put light touches on it won't change I think the character we're looking for in the master plan so I'm hoping that zoning is part of this and I'd like to recommend to the town you know that our recommendations are to look at this holistically and come up with a Redevelopment plan sorry Greg that I I totally disagree with you how so or why they don't need a singular Redevelopment plan that spans the entire one point one and a quarter acre or more well what is this then well this is all different it's I know something that is completely out one zone but it needs to be thought up it's not one zone and it's not characteristically the same along every strip part of the strip precisely so when I say holistic I don't mean to normalize it like it's one giant you know cut and paste the whole way I'm saying to think of it what do we want it to be at you know the start of Montclair and what do we want it to be we're not in charge of that okay but can we not recommend you can but that's a whole I mean as people have discussed the the the governing body is going through looking at with sand SS input looking at changing um the zoning through the entire town so so there's no nonr I'm talking to the wrong people saying thank you keep keep uh keep up with them and you know yeah make sure they do the right thing um second thing uh that's great um the only only five more don't worry it's County Road what is the county I don't see anything about the county in here like what how are we hobbled or what leverage or what you know empowerment do we have from the county to do anything it doesn't matter what the whether it's this study doesn't talk about the county road yeah there is it's that's not what the scope of the studies the scope of the study was what there's a as I mentioned there's a fixed criteria six of them which of them they satisfy it doesn't matter whether it's a local Road count Road um that have should any any improvements be recommended at a future date um the the town would have to um you know talk to the county but we're not there yet okay and then because I would say my recommendation is if we're going to do this get the they would County approval if there was any kind of improvements on County Roads or they would need to talk and I I mean I'm I'm going to Del to uh but it's but it's not it's not and part of our recomend the sewers the uh this is I it's great to upgrade them but I I frankly have concerns that when I've seen sewer work done by our municipality uh you know they're heavy-handed with the trees that are on the right away and I know also in our master plan uh you know we talk about the green infrastructure and we talk about uh you know the modern development techniques that preserve that and uh this goes along with the storm water I I would like to see you know the fact that if there's Municipal work on the sewers that they follow not only you know our tree ordinance to the letter but also uh s order management uh so that we don't end up with you know entire Corridor of sidewalks again beyond the school okay coming soon all right um yeah that's it does the revised numbers of housing does that in any way affect our affordable housing numbers or this has not really okay so this study doesn't in any way no that's toally right towns entered a settlement agreement it's totally different than what this is it just talks about what's the existing housing okay no that's good I'm I'm s thanks thank you any other questions any other comments I see your mic on um okay so if with that said um would somebody like what is the motion Greg just a motion that uh well we agreed upon the recommendations and then um that the governing body be notified of the recommendation we have think just the one recommendation we have one recommendation other than that um although it doesn't specifically ask that it's consistent with the master plan I think we can say it I believe it's consistent with the master plan or not inconsistent inconsistent I'm sorry but I took a little bit away from that last meeting um okay so it's not inconsistent and so we're making a motion to agree on the memo the onepoint memo and to not only find this not inconsistent with the master plan but to agree with the recommendation to move forward I guess with the council's adoption of some sort of designation designation okay I'm sure that was poorly said no we agree it meets the criteria really so are we passing a reso is this well we should do a resolution because we're authoriz we're we're voting on an action okay so I make does somebody want to make the motion I'll make the motion to find the study um is conforming to the master plan to make the recommendation to uh add some more details and that it is not inconsistent with the master plan and to oh and to forward on to the governing that's really the whole point have found that this is not inconsistent and that we would approve what I just said you are making the motion can I get a second second Jesse Mr Lily seconds can we get a vote please roll call Mr C yes Mr Lily yes Mr Heyman yes Mr coody yes Mr deal yes Mr O Sullivan yes mayor tamboro yes by chair fresy yes chair Pearson yes all right the motion passes um briefly I just want to update I know this isn't listed but I'll just say really quickly the subcommittee for the master plan met on Tuesday and very briefly and this is about the um Municipal storm water management plan uh the D is coming out with a new basically formula and what's the word I'm looking for language yeah it's not it's it's actually the structure of the report say it templ yeah a template for the report the current template is was constructed in 2004 before like three of the past updated storm water management rules went into effect so the engine Engineers are going to hopefully get to work on some of the hard data that has to be collected and the mapping um and that will be basically looked after by our Deputy uh manager and the subcommittee is sort of going to simmer because a lot of the other language will probably have to be changed from a 2004 template to a 2025 template so we're we agreed to sort of uh calm down our necessity to move forward on the finality of or finishing the product but we want to get on the data colle did we get confirmation that we uh we just need to submit the map to lock in the Grant I don't have the confirmation yet but I'm I'm expecting that next week okay can you just will zip us an email that's all any any other new business motion to return uh I'll second the motion all members I good night