##VIDEO ID:QKGxgx7zZJI## e e here okay uh welcome everyone uh to the park and rec committee meeting it's uh Monday November 18th uh we'll do a roll call vote starting Greg McCurry Terry cop Amanda kahill Larry Schulz Mary Larson Jacob Paul and Jenna Smith okay uh first order of business this evening is approval of the minutes from our uh last regular meeting which was on October 25th first so everybody had a chance to review those minutes and if so is there a motion to approve those motion to approve okay motion made by Mary is there a second second second that second by Greg uh any comments further discussion if not all in favor of approving the October 21st 2024 minutes signify by saying I I I oppose say no motion carried next item of business are petitions proclamations suggestions or complaints from citizens committee members or staff does anybody have anything this evening they'd like to address can you go to the podium yeah I think I think we're this is the time for it and when we have somebody come from the public uh for us uh you know we listen to what the people have to say it's not meant to be a dialogue but if we have questions we'd like to ask to clarify we certainly can Claudia will you identify yourself and your address and sure my name is claudo groet uh 2445 Heron Lane Victoria Minnesota that's in Lakebridge um been a past member of the park and wreck committee um and I'm here tonight I think advocating two subjects one advocating for the trail gap between Lake bridge and Kirk lock and park um and I'll I'll address that one a little bit um that current Trail Gap is uh uh I I measured on Google Earth about 3,50 ft um that is comprised of two sections one section that uh is owned by The Haney uh and that's a property that may be developed by uh the Amera project and that represents about 80% or 2400 ft of of Gap uh remaining 607 feet are owned by it's either three or four lots I'm not exactly sure what that is but those those have to be uh uh Acquired and this op this this uh the the aera project uh affords a great opportunity because uh part of that development they're going to be basically deing over the 80% uh of the RightWay to to the city of Victoria um so I'll I'll just keep it at that uh the other issue or question I have is that when I looked at today's meeting agenda I see a list of U Trail Gap priorities and my question um it may be to to Larry or or Mary because I think you're the only two that have Legacy um or could be to Jenna also but that list of priorities seems to be significantly different than the list of priorities that was developed by this Committee in the 2022 time frame uh and presented to uh the city council um and I'm just trying to figure out how and why that occurred and in particular I I just give a specific uh the lake bridge connection ction that I talked about uh was rated at that time we had a 2A and a 2B it was it was 2B and now it's it's down at number eight um and I just trying to get some clarity on how that occurred because I don't know that I've listen in any meetings that have actually talked about changing the priority I've Just Seen different priority lists okay well uh I'll just address it the good news is we're addressing it this evening so we're looking at all Trail gaps so I think we'll look at that so well I mean I guess I I actually had the same question um I had the 2019 priorities listed against this list so maybe you can answer is it actually in order or are these is it in priority order or are these just simply listing the trail gaps uh this was the priority order that was given to me that's listed on our website so I unfortunately don't have the history of this list so it might so it might not actually be in priority order it could have just been someone putting the trail gaps together the website has it listed as priority ranking on there can I hand out a priority list that was valid in 2022 do don't you give it to Jenna yeah you can hand it to me you can give them all to her which I will say we are going to be reordering it so if um what is currently listed is not how you want it presented then tonight's the opportunity for us to do that yeah I think there there may be some discrepancies so it's good address that's why we wanted it on agenda and then the only other tidbit of information that um that occurred at the very end of um the time frame that I was actively involved was a County Road 43 to um County Road 11 connection uh and and that was a uh a very steep uh top topographical change and a hill uh and at the when we were on the committee we basically had decided that that was going to be uh just the amount of engineering to cross the water was going to be excessive uh but there was a development that was uh proposed at the time that was going to buy a partial land from St Victoria church and if that would have gone through they would have been able to make the trail connection through that development and then through that piece of Parkland but the church so decided not to sell so that's all I want to do thank you very much for listening um the work that was done I think predominantly by Larry and and folks prior to me um you know went through a a ranking of all the trail gaps uh and had some good criteria associated with it and um I'm not here to try to influence uh just wanted to present my ideas same thingd I have that same copy so thank you very much thank you thank you you okay anybody else have uh anything else they'd like to bring up under suggestions complaints additions hearing none we will move on to there's no old business we'll move on to new business which by the way is Trail Gap prioritization so Jenna do you want to lead us through that yes all right so uh through various surveys um the importance of uh the trails and the trail system um has become very evident um to our residents and so just a little brief history um in 2018 Council established a trail gut fund um with transfers uh from the general fund the transfer for that began at 100,000 and is budgeted to increase annually um by 50,000 um in 2019 um this committee developed a criteria list and originally had ranked 13 trails and then in 2021 and 2022 uh this committee reviewed and an analyzed a trail priority list um as Victoria continues to grow um Trail gaps will be addressed during development um as we've discussed throughout this year um through different um evaluations of sketch plats and when we do have major road developments those are things that we're bringing up uh to be included um into the conversation for consideration and so in um evaluating the trail Gap prioritization um six factors were used uh to evaluate um those would be connection opportunity so what is the trail link to thingss like that public support um environmental sustainability um some of this we will see that uh part of why some of the gaps exist is due to impacts um from wetland and um areas that are really difficult to develop whether it be um Hills or uh topography things like that um another category is engineering difficulty um things that might prevent you from being able to do it whether it be retaining walls um roads that roads that are happening potential bridges that need to be created Etc uh local Neighborhood Impact um how many people is this Trail actually serving um and then of course um cost so what would be the environmental and Engineering cost for the gaps um so these are the trail gaps um that have been indicated so um throughout as I go through this uh presentation um these are the Trails um that we'll be focusing on if there are anything else that you would want to be considered you will certainly have the opportunity for that to be added in um you will see the image repeated on every slide um just to give us a framework of where we're looking at um and so as we move along I will be giving um more detail to each of the Trails um with information regarding them and so for the first one that we're talking about um and again at the at the end um if there are um different priorities that these should be listed at um then that's something that we can definitely note um I am pulling the stuff directly from the website um and so if the priority ranking um isn't correct then please make note of that um and we'll include that in when we reevaluate at the very end um so the first one that is currently listed um is the uh Bavaria Road East the one that is from Highway 5 to 82nd Street uh this one is approximately 1.2 miles and is um $1,300,000 in order to operate and please note the um estimated costs that are lists are what were projected from 2022 um so they have not been updated since then so there is a potential that they could be increased from there um so this one would um connect the state highway um to the Regional Trail um and provides a direct route um for Highway 5 Lake munanka Regional Trail to surrounding areas including the Arboretum um the trail connection is limited due to the need of RightWay access and managing um the private property ownership um and Rural sections of the road um this one uh Carver County plans um to include it in um a new Trail uh as a part of the highway 5 project next one is County Road 43 um the section which is from County Road 11 to Watermark neighborhood uh this one is just under half a mile um however due to um complications that we will talk about this one is a little bit on the steeper slope when it comes to cost um roughly 200,000 over 2 million and so this one um connects County Road 43 along several different neighborhoods um and the trail development um would require County RightWay access construction would need to in include Crossings over Wetlands boardwalks um it would also have to construct a trail along really steep slope areas um in 2023 and 2024 a portion of the trail was was connected um from Green Crest Drive to County Road 11 um and we continue to work on um this with other County Partners um and take it into consideration with future developments um County Road 11 um forgive me if I pronounce it wrong but chevel development to Red Fox Drive uh this one is uh just over a quarter of a mile um and is just under 1 million for an estimated cost um the proposed Trail is approximately um that quarter of a mile and it connects um a current trail to the chevel development um to Red Fox Drive or Shady Drive um this Trail would provide direct access to Victoria Elementary and Southern neighborhoods in this city um this Trail development would require County RightWay access um and Trail Crossing at um Red Fox Drive Bavaria Road West um 78th Street to the Apple word Circle this one is7 miles and is um $925,000 as an estimated cost um this one is located along the Eastern side of Bavaria Road um and it is a Regional Trail connecting the link batonka Regional Trail to the Minnesota River Bluffs Trail um and the Arboretum this one is uh the connection is limited due to the County's need for RightWay access the next one is the paving project for the Lake minetonka Regional Trail um this one is about a mile and is a quarter of million estimated um currently there is a small portion um that of the trail that is still gravel um obviously the pavement is preferred um as the option for multi-use um this Trail specifically has recently switched ownership from Carver County to Three Rivers and so we will continue to work with those Partners um to focus on this Paving project County Road 43 uh tell the road to waserman Park Lake reserve and Marsh Lake Road this one is just over a half a mile um and is estimated at $625 ,000 um this one provides a connection from tellers road to Marsh Lake Road with an additional connection route to waserman Lake Preserve Trail development would require County RightWay access and multiple Road Crossings Highway five um safe cross at meline Creek Park um this one um is a small portion um and is estimated at uh 550,000 um this connection is needed at metalin Creek Park um in order to um provide access to the trail um The Pedestrian underpass for this is planned as a part of the Arboretum area transportation plan Kirk locken Park to Lake bridge neighborhood uh this one is just over a half a mile um and it's estimated at 750,000 um this Trail um connects Kirk lock to the lake bridge neighborhood and is a trail extension of the lake Minon TKA Regional Trail this one provides access um from Victoria Downtown to the kelzer pond Lake bridge waterp Park and Rap City neighborhoods um this one does have um Wetland and Creek um areas between Kirk locken and Lake bridge um so it does provide um challenges um for engineering to be able to complete it um there are also on this one um as previously mentioned uh privately owned Parcels that would need to be acquired in order to um fill this project next one is Rolling Acres Road um fryb board court to Highway 7 this one is just under half a mile and is estimated at 300,000 um this one connects um Rolling Acres Road at um FR fryborg Court um this leaves several individual homeowners and neighborhoods disconnected from the trail system the trail would provide these residents access to the minaka regional tra Trail as well as the Minnesota River Bluffs and Victoria Downtown uh the Arboretum area transportation plan includes this Trail connection as a part of the phased project um just a little insight to that one the vision for um this road um includes U aspects for pedestrians as well as bicycle facilities and um an improved Crossing area next one is Highway 7 at Virginia Shore circle to the Lake minaka Regional Trail um this this one is only uh2 miles and is estimated at um 1, 650,000 uh this one connects uh the Virginia Shores Circle to the Lake minona Regional Trail um this provides safe access to the residents of Smithtown bayew and Virginia Shores neighborhoods um this one does require a bridge um which is why the cost is higher um because it does cross over a ravine additionally we would need permission from the state of Minnesota Department of Transportation um as it would be located in a right of way um this one is uh part of a study um that shwood has requested um support for um for a study of the corridor of Highway 7 um this study would identify safety access and other um transportation improvements and so again like um we had mentioned or I had mentioned earlier um if there is a uh road construction project it's something that we want to take into consideration when we have these new trails then the last one is the highway five um section from Auburn Drive to Stager Lake Lane um this one is just over half mile and is estimated at um around 800,000 um this Trail um would likely need to be located within the Minnesota Department of transportations right away and would need a bridge over a protect protected stream and a boardwalk through um a large section of what land so um that was a lot of information um I condensed it down as best I can but feel free to ask me to hop back um to any of the slides for more information I will leave it up on this screen so we can look back at this but the main um question that we have for you tonight um is are there any changes to the trail getap prioritization that you would like to be considered can I ask one quick question absolutely when it says included in the arborium area transportation plan does that mean that it will it will be funded through that and and act and be completed through those those plans it is currently included in their plans okay so um one other question I had that I think would help too not just us but cuz I saw the post online too that was done is is maybe to provide residents with with dates right because the arum area transportation plan it goes from you know its Inception in like 2021 um with with all of its information to like 2037 right so if if something I just would hate to it it's it's all about managing expectations right if someone's Road isn't going to be developed until 2037 then I think that would be really beneficial for us to provide because like when I was going through arum Transportation plan information I was like oh you know surprised to see how far out some of these Road improvements are planned for first is like a 2025 construction date mhm okay yeah I guess I had a similar question about if it's like switched ownership to Three Rivers Park explain that like does that need to be on a priority list for us then or does it just get removed because if it was switched to their ownership there it's not like we're going to influence them on when PVE it right actually I think we can influence them because when we talked before uh when that came up there was it was a the reason we were given that that wouldn't be addressed or it would be difficult to be address it's probably a better word was there were so many entities involved there was R river parks there was the uh railroad group there was car I mean there was a whole bunch of the city and they all had to agree and it was at that time um staff had indicated that while they meet regularly uh that didn't appear to be something that the others were that interested in at the time so they didn't want to put a lot of effort into uh making spending time on that with knowing that it wouldn't be likely to to okay come to fruition that they'd rather spend their time on other things that would actually result in in something as kind of the background I from way back I was before Jen's time even um I think the other thing too as we have come up with this is the city council has asked us to you know provide them with the trail Gap a prioritization so they know from at least the community's point of view what we would view as most important and we can update this which we're looking at doing on a regular basis because things change and there's a number of things that were on the list that aren't on the list anymore because they development happened and the cooch is a perfect example that was a kind of a major connection that we had no idea back at the time when we did this that um that would be developed because it was individually owned it was used as Farmland uh that was sold uh we now have a connection and that was developers basically put that in so seems like a lot of the things that that we're doing now uh and because of the extensive cost here uh we piggyback on road projects and developments and uh it's important and I brought this up at the city council and I gave our annual report um or semiannual report I guess uh was that last month um that it's very important when we do developments that we pay attention to the trail gaps then because if we don't address it this is what happens you know all a sudden now it's $1 million and or we got to acquire some land or it just becomes or the property's on the wrong side of the road it's it just makes it a lot more difficult so I think they they understand that and I think we all do too that it's easier there's a couple other things that got done part of the uh um County Road um what was the one the the one on uh east side of Bavaria Road uh we had that that was going to happen at one time we were at it all all the engineering was done and one of the land owners uh wouldn't uh couldn't they couldn't City and the land owner couldn't agree on the property it killed the thing we had a grant we had to give up of $150,000 um but we got part of it done so it was the 82nd Street um so that helped and now the rest it looks like is going to be hopefully done through the Arboretum uh plan Transportation plan so so again my question is if if we're making a priority list do we prioritize things that aren't piggybacking on another plan or a road or a you know the true gaps that are just they're there and I Lake bridge for example I biased obviously I live in Lake bridge I don't think the lake bridge connection is such an issue if there were sidewalk in the neighborhoods between Where the Trail Ends and where it begins again but there aren't and so you know if there was a sidewalk running through the neighborhood there there is a trail that comes up but then you have to get on that road I can't remember the name of the road off the top of my head but you know it's it's not the safest situation as you come down the hill and um but I don't think the city's not going in and assessing people for sidewalks either through different places which would partially solve the issue um but I just think my question is more on like do we I I'm still trying to understand like if it's included in an AR burum area transportation plan is that a high priority for us then or is our high priority things that are not included in other Transportation plans or Improvement plans or developments I that's what I'm trying to get I think good point I I my personal feeling is I think it's both I I think we just list them all um it would be my recommendation to include those that are included in the plan still in the prioritization to emphasize the need for it to ensure inclusion in plans um because when it comes to funding for anything else um if something's included in those plans it doesn't mean that we won't continue on in the list um it just means that um we'll be focusing on those if they're they end up not being included in a plan so if it is included in the plan then y we get to check off um something from our thing um and we will continue to work on utilizing that trail Gap Gap fund um any potential grants that might come along any future developments and things like that um but I would still recommend including them in the prioritization just so that even if we know we're going to get to it it still um is noted that it's a priority related question is the cost associated with those included would that still be an issue or would the arum plan cover the cost if I think the Arboretum plan covers it and uh you know as far as funding goes I mean that's beyond the purview of this group uh our our jobs to prioritize you know what we think would be the best the city council is the one that ultimately decides what to include and not to include um and how to fund it um you know we've been fortunate to you know knock a number of things off the list when when they have the developments or this Arbor redum Transportation plan's really going to help too I do have one question Jenna I I was uh reviewing the other day the uh Arboretum Transportation plan and I believe uh item five uh was a portion of that was included on there too from Highway 7 to connect in the town here yes it was included in that full disclosure I wasn't sure if that was still doing that because the arum plan was established prior to the switch was is what it the arum plan was established prior to the switch of Carver County so I personally am not aware if it's continuing to be a part of that okay it was as of uh two weeks ago when I looked at it it was it was it is still listed on the website was in there on the web page yes so if that was a case there' be out of these 11 be four knocked off that um okay so that leaves us with if we we're going to include those on the list um do we want to let's have some discussion on uh anybody's proposal to move something up or down on the list a question question on number one will that still require the purchase of that property or is this a different section I I assume it probably does I um it's part of the the group that's working on that uh I think there's a you know probably people from the city and county um working on state they're all working together on that so I I don't know uh how going to address that but it's included that it's going to be done so so I mean I guess just to address also the gentleman that came to the committee this evening um I did go back and look at uh recommendation prioritizing CH check connections from 2019 and like you said there are some that are knocked off the list um so so one a from then aligns with one up here priority um 1B was Bavaria Road West but I can see how that falls if you get one a right and then 2 a where there's the most difference here I guess just to say 2A was number eight is now number eight so that's the one that maybe stands out the most of I I don't know when that reprioritization occurred and then 2B was 2B is now number three so pretty e equal and then three um is oh 2B was County Road 43 three to Watermark so still two three then was County Road 11 chevel to Fox Drive so those all align pretty much so I I would like us to discuss I guess that change from Kirk clock into Lake bridge going from 2A to 8 I think that I think that was I don't think the committee change that I think I think it's a mistake I think I think the I yeah I think I think that I think it must have been written down wrong by whoever put it together staff wise so I would Advocate go back to the list and realign with What was decided in 2019 with any changes then right and I again it's it's immaterial at this point because we're prioritizing it now so yeah it's open for discussion but right but that but that's not where we landed the last time we had had that higher rank as yeah I I agree and obviously I would like to see that higher ranked especially if there is going to be a development there that's going to take care of the majority of it now I haven't followed closely um where that development is at currently and I know those things take a long time once to get rolling and then um but I would certainly want to see that higher and again if there were sidewalks through the neighborhood where the trail Gap is it wouldn't be that big of a deal um but I know Lake bridge is a fairly young neighborhood there are a lot of young kids in the neighborhood um my children are growing a little bit they're getting a little older now so I don't worry about them as much there are quite a few young kids in that neighborh so um I would like to see that move back to a 2A or 2B or whatever it was um I would agree okay me too anybody else I I see some consensus you have a feeling on that Jacob no no I am curious the does Three Rivers now own the trail that it's connecting to uh the county owns that I believe is what Jenna said all the way under the bridge like I don't I don't quite understand either I don't know I'm not sure yeah I don't either I just wonder if they would have a say if it's like if it's just a add-on to that trail um and and if you go down the trail be below Lake bridge the River or the the rail bed continues on to a lake and then you know so as things continue to develop that trail actually goes I think all the way to Cologne oh really the it's it's the old rail bed there but I think that's where it ends up eventually or somewhere south of lonia I think is what it is but it's all overgrown you know but it does continue on um so I I think that um when am Myra when we reviewed that development um I think we even had somebody from there come to talk to our group and I think the plan at that time was uh there was some discussion about them providing the land to make it happen and and we knew the cost would be uh at least the first part of it might be less because there was some you know have to clean out the brush and that so um but I know that that we talked about it and I think we all agreed at the committee at that time that that was should be one of the top five priorities yeah I don't remember exactly where but I guess on your F end up being 2B or whatever yeah yeah so so I don't know if you know again I don't know if so Kirk Len was 2A and then County Road 43 to County Road 11 to Watermark was 2B let let me give you a historical perspective and Mary can maybe chip in here too when we the County Road 43 um the thought at that time and this goes back I maybe you aren't even on it yet um that it goes way back to uh initial discussions on on this and at one time that was number one and the reason for that was the connection to Lions Park so it connected that whole area beyond that to Lions Park um then we found out you know the engineering issues and you know was just going to be a disaster so then I think it kind of dropped down in the list or it remained on the list with we all kind of understood this probably's not going to happen unless that paro's developed Andor that road is redone um and I don't know if there's any plans to redo that road anytime soon uh certainly not soon I don't even know if it's in long term but we want to keep it on the list because we think it's important yeah the price tag was really high so we're kind of you we prioritize for like theum list but it's a challenging one for sure I guess the other thing that we do know about Trail gaps is I don't know about the survey that was just completed but the two that were done prior to that um I think the last one had Trail Gap priorities or uh Trail Gap gaps is number two after water features and the one before that was Trail Gap so I mean people use them uh they want them and and their eyes are on it yes communities eyes is continuing to focus on and I guess our role is to prioritize what we see uh should be done and then it's up to the city council to decide where does our top where do our top priorities fit with other priorities within the city with whether it's uh you know pumping stations or sewers or streets or whatever fire stations they have to figure out where it all fits in and the priorities in the city and how to fund it so I hear the one thing I hear is moving the uh uh Lake KK lock and park to Lake bridge neighborhood up on the list where it was before not higher yeah I'd like to see that up at number two if possible that's but again I'm 100% biased because I live in Lake bridge yeah I think it makes sense en ice cream and like to ride my bike my it's also at least on these estimates the second lowest of the ones that aren't included in the ARB burum area um so hopefully and with the development happening hopefully that it's like an achievable goal the other the other thing I can say too is regardless of where something's on the list because I'm not sure some of those other ones that get done where they were on the list but uh you know they just kind of happen when the development happens to um so you know I even if we list something you know one two 3 four if all a sudden um somebody you know Highway 7 happens um you know we might end up doing 10 before we do anything before um and yeah I will also say I know there's been some chatter from the lake bridge um kind of community about the development potentially happen there with multifam and all that but I think knowing that this would help with the trail connection might temper some of that back the A Mir one that yeah the challenge is that that that development would use the same entrance to Lake bridge and as you came in you'd take a left into the multif family and there's been some folks in our neighborhood that haven't been real pleased about the idea of more traffic coming through through the entrance to the neighborhood but if you take that with the oh hey by the way this is going to help us get a direct shot right into downtown I think that'll temper some of that back and I think the council will recognize that and understand that good point I'm I'm I'd be actually fine with making it too you know just renumber all these I'd make I'd make that one too agreed y okay so any other ones we want to switch so that just push everything else down one below it I mean yeah something Amanda well I just the Lake minetonka Regional Trail P Paving project like the trail exists there right so it's not really a gap in my mind to have it higher on this priority ation but I understand why it's it's here if we have fun my I think if we have funding to do it we just want to do it I mean it's not it's not it's not City it's not necessarily City dollars it's everybody's dollars going into this so it's a way to get it done I I don't know by not doing that uh I don't think any other Trail is going to get done before that so so what you're saying is we're not taking dollars away from an Trail Gap to prioritize Paving a section of Trail that's already there right that's my yeah that's my like question yeah I I don't think it matters whether it's on the list or not it's either going to happen or it's not it's part of the plan I don't think we're going to decide that I think having it on here probably helps get it funded so in that Essence I would just leave it on there but it will come off when it's done so okay you mentioned I think it was County Road 11 to Watermark neighbor is that the one that you mentioned in connection with the elementary school Victoria Elementary I that's chel to Red that's three okay yeah I would definitely keep that as a priority just because of I think more more kids that can walk to school or ride their bike to school is a good thing and all the development is that we've is is red fox South thank you and it's just so they can't get in than either so does that include a Crossing that trail Gap could you go back to that number or that description to the chel red fox drive one I don't think it probably does based on the price uh there's Trail Crossing at Red Fox Drive but I don't I don't remember what the I was told one time um what the cost of one of those Trail Crossings are and I was flabbergasted it was incredibly expensive I say it was like 50,000 I think it was more than that I was think it's a lot of money or like 400 some thousand oh jeez but and so so Trail Crossing like Highway like uh Rolling Acres Road like the flashing lights you cut all the C literally just have the just the flashing lights button that you can press and then people stop yeah yeah like at Rolling Acres where they got maybe you're right maybe it was 100 whatever it was seem like a lot it was a lot I think the the one good thing that with the iorm transportation plan we're going to have several Crossings um you know over Highway or under Highway 5 and there's also going to be I believe an underpass under a Rolling Acres Road so I think all those things are going to make things safer um and then they'll drop off the list so three is now four do that ranking yeah if we go back to let you move the one up y yeah I mean maybe it would make sense to swap what's now three and four um considering that County 43 to 11 or 11 to Watermark that one that's number two currently is probably unlikely to happen seems like well again it's it's I I understand your point and it's good one on the other hand it is a key connection and our job is to put down what the key connections are it's up to the city to decide if they want to city council if they want to do that or they want to do some of the other ones I think I think by leaving it there if that road is developed further there's a development there that brings some attention to it on the other hand I think you are right I I I don't think that one's probably going to happen on its own it's going to have to come with development and with road reconstruction of some sort um yeah because you could do two Trail connections for the price of that one you know kind of a thing so that's the Dilemma yeah I feel similarly about number six I that's over by where I live and I think it would be great to have a trail connection there uh but I think it's unlikely to happen without that farm being developed yeah yeah that was the thought at that time there was at one point there was some discussion that that was going to be developed uh that hasn't taken place I don't know if there's any discussion going on um at this point but you know if that would take place that would be perfect time to do that one and getting to werman Lake Preserve is is high in our party too for a safe way for people to get to that Park on their bikes would be amazing too and you can get from there to Victoria Elementary yes sidewalks right right but coming from the other direction not East if you had that and then you had the U County Road 11 from chali to Red Fox Drive you have a loop you could make there um is are there any gaps that we're aware of that aren't on this list at all I thought of one that we had um some residents come to us from the neighborhood I had to look it up it was from the Waterford neighborhood I was wondering if that that's different than Virginia sh I I think it is Waterford it wouldn't be Waterford because that's off of like you take you take a you take a left from Rolling Acres and it's the First Neighborhood on the left and there's something right up Highway seven it's a small it's like one street it's like yeah it's like aeac um but we had some residents come to Mee I think Larry I was running that meeting so I don't think you were there that time but um they spoke you know about they you know they don't have a really safe way they're on Highway 7even they don't have a really safe way to get down to Rolling Acres and an pointed out at that time it's like this the county road you're talking about Highway 7even we don't really have a lot of um access to that RightWay on County Road 7 so it would be a really challenging project that number nine that's part that's part they spoke to part of number nine that that they come down roing acres and don't have that last little heart get number 10 as well was going over Wetlands I remember so is that part of is that whole Rolling Acres Road going to be have a bike trail on it or Trail on it uh the the intention for that one um where's well because this one had talked about um being included in the um the study and then this one is a part of that Arboretum Trail um that's but it's I think this is the one that that's south of seven and these guys live on seven they live on Lane might have been 10 10 yeah okay but and that one is a matter of do the state you know when a state red do the road so but Mary like to your point so is we really need a number 12 added to include that neighborhood on our Trail Gap list that's what I was thinking because it's Waterford Place to uh on to Rolling Acres or do we just add it to 10 because it's the same it's going to happen all at the same time if it well is it this is on Highway 7 this is on Highway 7 yeah okay I think it's on the other side of Rolling Acres I think it's west of yeah these guys live west of West of Rolling Acres yeah you P up to the stoplight there you would take a left and go towards St Bonnie number 10 is east of oh okay yeah that there's a new development yeah right there and then there's one farther down that's on the north side of seven so yeah may we explain kind of the complexity of doing went along a County Road okay well well let's just add let's just add one um and call it Highway seven I would I would call it Waterford Waterford Lane try to because that's the street they're on they want access to right um rolling yeah and it the question is is one rolling acre that's not that far from that water for Lane to a rolling acre so the question is is one Rolling Acres is complete the Arboretum trans portation plan is it that whole stretch or is there still going to be a gap in there so is it only go so far I don't know the answer to that do you know Jenna I would recommend including it as a separate item um due to the different operators of the streets the different what who manages the okay okay the right of way of the okay so why don't we add water for Lane to Rolling Acres Road okay good catch there's quite a few people live in that neighborhood too I mean quite a few an army people live there's quite a few homes in that and they think it's fully developed now yeah anything else that we've missed one of the things too that maybe at a future meeting we can talk about we're looking at as we look at these individual developments I think we talked about this two meetings ago um we look at each development that Jenna brings those to us and we talk about here's where the trail could be there's so many different developments that are happening and there's some gaps in the developments like there's a farm in the middle and that it would be helpful to kind of have a an ideal plan uh of where a trail would go through so as we so we don't end up looking just at the individual development and then let go oh shoot if we would have known you know um you know Trail we want a straight Trail you know we looking at a grid system we looking at a Spoke system are we just looking at access to a main artery of a trail it would be nice to kind of have a a general plan concept at least and it might change when we look at the actual development but I think it would help us from making an air and suggesting something on the one individual development and having a bunch of Farmland out here that we haven't thought about so I don't know if and yeah I agree with you and I think one other thing would be helpful is to include in your slides in the future we're talking about TRS can you either like pull up the um satellite imagery for us yeah so that we or take shot screenshots of it or something so we can it's just a little more cont create to view I was just looking on my phone on Google Maps like pitching and zooming um to kind of go okay that's where that neighborhood is and here's if we could have that that'd be awesome yeah there was yep and I've seen that yeah like this is super clear and you can you can look at this and say oh this one has been done you know like you can see where the connections have been mean because there's you know coia and then um down by hillpoint Lane and things like that yeah um other thing I wanted to mention which relates to the what was number two um even though well kind of separate from the Gap from County or 11 to Watermark because there already is a trail on the north side of 43 along Watermark M um and there is no Crossing or kind of way to get to it from Deer Run yes so having a safe Crossing there yeah would be a great Improvement even if the rest of the trail isn't connected because I mean I see kids all the time cross that road on their bikes and they're just going to the grass and on yeah I I can speak to that I shoot across there all the time myself and it it's a little tricky which one which one is that so it's from Deer Run to the trail on the north side of 43 um so if you're you're in Deer Run and you want to get to the trail along Watermark you just just have to cross the road and then kind of through the ditch um so having a Crossing there cuz I I don't know if that Gap from County Road 11 were to be developed what side of the road it would be on but you might need a Crossing anyway yeah excellent a great addition yeah why don't we just add that on the list um I think that's that's a good point because it could be forever before that trail ever gets added and that is a shortcut from for us coming from the south especially because there is no path on Victoria Drive right now we're cutting from we're cutting through Deer Run and then shooting across 43 and going through the other development up to the trail that's how we how we go either running or bking so you mind pinp pointing exactly which um section that you're talking about again it's um I guess it would be Woodstone Drive to the watermark Trail on the North side of Church Lake Boulevard I mean those are those are good points and you know the you know even if they's signage uh you know if if it's a cost prohibitive to do the actual flashing lights even if there's signs or something would be better than what it is now and also would be a way to put it in a place where it's most visible and that may have parents tell their kids go to the crossing you know instead of shoot all over the place so and like the deer crossing the deer never go where they're supposed to go right that's a good point I like that other things that we should add to the list so what I heard is that we're moving uh the lake bridge Kirk lock and park the lake bridge up to two and bumping everything else down one and adding a couple of those other ones again I I don't know if we need to get too hung up of where the things are because I think they probably are going to happen when there's development um other thoughts well I know we've already T talked but you know chel to Red Fox since that is developed there's probably not you know the um County Road 11 to Watermark that's a huge one that we know the constraints and need development for but chevel development to Red Fox like that is developed it's it's kind of just along the golf course so I know Jacob already spoke to it like possibly moving that one up above County Road 11 to Watermark just being that like it's something more that city of Victoria has to manage right then wait for the development in the county roads to be improved I I don't know yeah the other thing I mean it it this leads to the elementary school so any way that we can make that more accessible by bite for some of those kids that are coming from the north even because right now there's really not a safe way to get down to the elementary school I'm bike whether there's whether it I I could go either way whether it's listed as three or four I don't know the it's going to matter but if people we feel more comfortable moving it up above the other one I'm I'm okay with that too um you know I think I think make the case for both because again The Watermark uh one was one of all those kids are going to play t- ball or whatever at Lion's Park and they're going on 43 which isn't very safe either uh All Summer in the school they can take a bus summer you know not so much so again I don't know any of these are really going to happen unless there's development but certainly we can can put it up there if you'd like I would agree to move it up okay I don't think it HS I think it sends a message that that should be a priority for the city everybody okay with that MH okay so so we got parvar Road East then we have uh the Kirk lock and Lake bridge two uh three would be the chevali development red fox and move County Road 43 below that and then just drop the rest down one yeah yeah okay we're good I apologize I have to get a kid to hockey practice so I had hard stop at 730 do we do we need a motion on this should we make let's have a motion to recommend this as our Trail Gap priority to the city and just before you do that I'm going to reash what I have on my list just to completely verify um so first on the list is Bavaria Road East um then it is the Kirk locken Park to Lake bridge neighborhood um third priority would be County Road 11 for the chel development to Red Fox Drive fourth would be the County Road 43 Road um County Road 11 to water Mark neighborhood then the Bavaria Road West um then the paving project for the Lake minetonka Regional Trail uh then County Road 43 teller to waserman and the marsh Lake Road Highway five for the safe Cross of mland Creek um then Rolling Acres Road fryborg Court to Highway 7 and then Highway 7 to Victoria Shores at the Regional Trail then Highway five Auburn Trail to stiger Lake Lane and then the additions of Highway 7 Waterford Lane to Rolling Acres Road and then the addition of County Road 43 the safe Crossing at Woodstone Drive to wmark Trail um from the deer Rod neighborhood okay to me motion to recommend that as the priority list to the city council so moved motion by Mary is there a second second second by Terry okay uh motion's been made in second to recommend the trail Gap prioritization uh list to the uh city council all those in favor signify by saying I I I I opposed same sign motion is carried thank you sorry I got to run early all right that looks like that's it for the agenda any anything else that you have well I just wanted to add one more thing that I learned um as we talked about Trail gaps um there is a the county is going to be doing a roundabout at Victoria Drive and U Marsh Lake P your Trail next spring and one of the things they're going to be doing is adding a trail from that roundabout up to Lake town so they're taking care of that one Trail grap which already isn't even on our list um because as Lake Town's been developed out they've been building that on on down south so that trail Gap will be taken care of there'll be TR uh a trail all the way down to that roundabout and then you can get on and and then there'll be one extending onto Pioneer Trail and you can get in you know go along to the the golf course and down that way so that'll be nice to have so that's just another illustration of this Count's doing this project they agreed to throw in a trail extension um so if you if you wait long enough some of the stuff happens it's just but yeah that's why have you wait a long time can you add maybe those dates to like um so the only dates that are indicated for those is that on the website it says that the construction for all the highway five projects are to be done in 2025 through 2027 oh okay okay and that is on their website okay so it's not as far as the 2037 SE okay oh it's going to happen pretty fast okay okay all right a motion to adjourns in order so moved okay Jacob the second second motion's been made in second uh all in favor adjourning to meeting say I I I for