##VIDEO ID:lbh-sMqpLfY## welcome everyone this is the finance committee meeting it is Tuesday October 10th 2024 it is 6:30 pm I'd like to call the meeting to order with a pledge of allegiance I pledge allegiance yeah Karen it's uh October 8th October did I say the wrong date yes I did thank you thank you correction it is October 8th 2024 thank you very much um under Mass General Law chapter 3A section 20f this meeting is being recorded uh this meeting is being held remotely in accordance with the governor of Massachusetts March 12 2020 order suspending certain provisions of the open meeting law GLC 30A section 20 and on March 29th 2023 Governor haly sign sign a supplemental 2023 budget Bill allowing for remote and hybrid meeting options for public bodies through March 31st 2025 uh well thank you everyone today is October 8th thank you um I just want to announce everybody who is online because we're required to do that so we have Zack Leu from so our finance committee members are Zack Leu Hugh Morton Al Le Gary Guerrero Michelle Orlando Duncan law and myself Karen Rouse are currently in attendance right now absent is Christopher Thrasher and absent currently is Cindy Brown but she should be joining us shortly uh so welcome everyone um I wanted to start off tonight thank you we have Steve fors is our town moderator here so I would like to start off with our uh first first item on the agenda was to discuss with the town moderator regarding the Westport finance committee bylaws related to conflict of interest so Steve welcome thank you for coming um I can turn the floor over to you if you'd like or give an introduction but I think everyone's familiar with the email that you sent us all uh last month in regards to um a discussion of bylaw and conflict of interest new Steve I think we might have lost him for a minute I think we just lost him oh he's com back there he is hey Steve sorry the wrong I clicked on the wrong X well thank you for coming Steve do um did you want to to introduce our discussion on the on the finance committee bylaws well um sure I I you know I I sent you all an email I believe um just sharing with you my opinion that um that membership on the finance committee while simultaneously holding an elected office um kind of just presents a fundamental conflict of interest um and I think you could almost say especially with the school committee but really with any Office of the executive branch where person is going to do a good job for the executive office that they hold like to deal with the case in point being on the on the school committee they would advocate for the most funding they could for the school committee whereas um your role of the finance committee is to um look at the town as a whole so um it is it is my opinion that that's a conflict of interest um I would be curious to hear the opinions of others to see if they share my opinion or if they look at it differently and uh if so why sure I I I don't mind starting off I and i' I've already expressed my opinion but um I I do believe it is a conflict of interest um even though the state the state allows it unless there's a bylaw specific in the town's city or town that prevents it the state does not consider it a conflict but you know I've been in the role of finance my entire career uh which I'll tell you is more than 30 years um I've reported to finance committees and every finance committee I've ever reported to the Charter of a finance committee is to be independent both in perception and reality so by having a as Stephen mentioned as as being on any other Committee of any other executive Branch are holding an elected office there's a at least a perceived conflict of interest there and you know I'd like to hold I think it's important that the finance committee holds ourselves as independent and when and when the group or individuals make decisions we should be doing it on behalf of the town as a whole and you know I don't want our reputation to to be tarnished or to be perceived or or thought that we're not being independent for whatever that is whether it's this specific uh discussion that we're talking about that has given r r risen to the topic but um you know as it relates to this conflict of interest I I called the state myself and I inquired to say you know if me as a member of the finance committee could I also run for select board and what if I got elected and the state said said if your bylaw does not prevent that you're you would be allowed to do that and and I don't think that's right you know I don't think a finance committee should also be on the select board or I think we just need Independence so Steve I support I support what you're what you're talking about so I will open it up to um anybody else that may have their hand raised uh go ahead Duncan yeah I just uh you know I you know Steve a long time I know he's uh very fasil with all of this stuff but I thought it was really interesting that Steve you approached a number of other Town moderators through your chat group and that the correct me if I'm wrong but I thought I think the feeling was that they all agreed with you and so to me that kind of kicks it over the line thanks Duncan Hugh go ahead yeah I really have nothing very much to add Steve I think skada did as well we discussed this I think last meeting I agree 100% it is a conflict a recusal of a vote is a step in the right direction but that doesn't remove the participation in just in discussions Etc and the presence shall we say so it's legal so determined but that doesn't mean that it's appropriate great thank you Hugh um Al go ahead i i i Echo the same thing I mean it it it it there's legality and there's reality uh the legality may be that it is not illegal or or inappropriate from a legal standpoint but the reality is and you you mentioned it Karen we have an obligation as a finance committee to be as crystal clear and as sanitized as we possibly can be um we all come in with our own biases in in certain inst but it it it just doesn't pass the moral smell test for me and it's not pardon me it's not about Christopher this is this is it could be anybody for any thing for any reason um I just don't uh I I I just think that he needs to recuse himself of one obligation or the other and we need to be a advisory box if you will that just doesn't um uh you know the people in the town can look at us and say we are we are just doing our job independent of any particular um um you know entity or or or whatnot so anyway I'm rambling but uh I'm I'm agreeing with everybody so far that this really has to come to a conclusion great thank you Al Gary you've got your hand up yeah so um you know I've been on this committee for quite some time now I think I don't even know 12 years and we've had um folks on this committee that have run for a particular office have been successful but then uh prior to that even back down before uh from this committee that um knew that they were running for like the board of Select for instance uh so I think that um I agree with the with with always having to recuse yourself from a vote doesn't really lend um the pure uh as Al mentioned um you know what we what we're ched what we CH uh what we're um you know what we should be doing on this committee if if if we feel that if someone feels that they have to recuse themselves for the majority of votes then it's not really an effective uh you know position to take when you're on this committee but I know in the past we've had members on this committee that have run for public office executive they've won they backed down and and and they went on their way uh so you know I think that that's something that should be considered uh that it's pretty much past practice that we've had great thank you Gary um Hugh do you have your hand back up a second time oh you're muted too Hugh you're muted you're on mute confusing me there we go there go thank you one of my old friends used to say facts are important but sometimes perceptions are more important and if you are a member of both committees then refusal is fine but that does not remove the presence on two stools as it were and the perception that the person has an involvement even though votes are not being taken so that I I just adding that to what everybody else would say it's the perceptions maybe in terms of what it looks like quite apart from what actually the participation may turn out to be great thank you oh go go ahead Gary yeah so I I guess having not having been at the last meeting um are we looking for some kind of idance are we looking to uh take a a vote I mean what what are we looking to have this what are we looking to do I guess that's the question uh to maybe enforce this put a put a bylaw in place I mean I don't I don't know yep yep so that's um oh Steve I'll let you go ahead Steve and you might you can answer that question well yeah I'll I'll just speak to to to my interest in this um you know as I said in in the email that I sent you all um I did consult with my online discussion group of moderators just because it it seemed an obvious conflict of interest to me but I started thinking it am I missing something am I off base here you know and so I got the confirmation from them they yes they unanimously and mo several of them pretty thought it was an outrageous conflict of interest and so I wanted to hear from all of you to again see if I'm not not looking at this straight if I'm if I'm not seeing it clearly so I I appreciate hearing that um that that all of you who have spoke are in agreement so what I would propose to do is I I would like to contact the selectman you know as the appointing authority for the finance committee I would like to contact the selectman and ask them to place um an article on the warrant um and I I will give them templates that I've got for you know or or uh samples from other towns um that um that prevents um members of the finance committee holding elected office simultaneously and I hope and expect that they would be willing to put that on the warrant themselves um if they opted not to it only takes um a uh a petition of 10 voters to put it there and if they declin to do it um at my request then I would just um do it myself um and so you you you have all fulfilled you know what I wanted out of this meeting um so I would stop talking thank you and and I think um when you speak to the select board I think you know I think it's important that you shared this with the finance committee and the finance committee itself seems to be in support of our own self-regulating so um so I think that's an important step too that u sounds like the majority of the committee here uh that spoken has supported I haven't heard anyone that um doesn't support it but uh yeah and that's that's helpful for me to be able to say that to the to the selectman when I when iate with um Ally you've got your hand up I do kind of a point of information uh we're appointed Not Elected and so we serve at the will of whom no all right there let's let's hear that's my question yeah no um if I had the power to remove anyone from the finance committee I would remove anyone who was elected to an executive position and declined to resign but I do not have that power you are all appointed for whatever term you were appointed for and you remain on the committee until you resign um or your term expires fine that that that was my question that's the answer so enough said yeah thank you go ahead you I'm sorry I should not have spoken but I knew we done had this discussion with Steve before in other times I just can say what a motion now be appropriate to ask for such a decis decision by the selectman if so I'd like to offer it I think that motion would be appropriate anyone like to second the motion second thank you so I think the motion is that that the finance committee is in support so I think that would be helpful for Steve to to to help with that um does anyone have any any else they want to discuss on regarding this or have an alternative opinion go ahead Zach yeah I would just say that um I agree you know I've been on the finance committee for a couple of years I probably joined the same time that around the same time that Christopher did and I think he's been nothing but professional punctual and as he's been a member on the committee he's been an asset to the team but I also agree with the consensus of the group so I think it should just be put on the record that um for the time he's been here it we've definitely appreciated it but in the bigger picture in the long run run of things it doesn't make sense um so I just wanted to I just wanted to put that in that he's been an asset and and we appreciate his time it's nothing personal against him it just has more to do with the conflict of The Town on the whole I would I would Echo that Zach thank you for saying that is it is not personal it's procedural right exactly and we did we did talk about that in the last meeting but it is helpful to hear it again so if somebody who might be listening didn't hear the last meeting I think that is important so um and again Christopher is on the committee until his term is up or he chooses to resign this this bylaw would be in effect for anything in the future so it doesn't impact any of us currently it would be prospectively um go ahead Gary yeah I think when we we discussed this like even in this meeting here we're careful not to say who it is but it's not the person but it's the the concept so it's it's this is this is this will be forever so it's irregardless of it's Christopher if it's one of us that maybe want to run or whatever for for exe I think we have to be careful that when we don't mention names but we mention the um the process and for me and I'll go back to it it's it's basically the the the point that the person has to recuse themselves from numerous votes and that's not effective and whoever that person would be you know uh so that's the reason why I would vote in favor great thank you thank you Gary um so we have a motion in second if no other Steve did you have your yeah oh go ahead only to thank Zach for saying something that I should have said myself right at the beginning before I said anything else um so thank you Zach I agree with that completely that uh that uh that it it is nothing personal or any reflection on anyone's performance on the committee just the principle thank you that's why we have nine terrific members that speak speak up to make sure all the points get taken so thank you thank you again for that so if no other comments I'll uh do a roll call uh for a vote so Z Zack Brew hi thank you Hugh Hugh Morton i l i Gary y you're on mute Gary yes yes thank you Michelle Michelle Alando I Duncan Duncan laot I let me see if Cindy's here yet I I I'll say Karen Rouse I um Cindy is still not here so that's uh that's unanimous for the for everyone that's here so great thank you thank you Steve um let thank you all thank you all right so let me just see so Noe so Cindy has not arrived yet so that's okay okay so uh the next item on the agenda was to discuss our leason assignments and I didn't email them to everyone my apologies I I kind of totally missed that there was even a meeting this week and until uh Jeff's our recording secretary texted me urgently to remind me um but I think um I think where it is I think Duncan does not have any uh departments yet because Duncan had come on late enough in the process when we'd already um oh Cindy joined at 6:49 pm thank you uh Karen that's not true oh that's not true no I I uh volunteered for and was accepted by the in uh the um infrastructure Advisory Group and uh you know I went through all and you were copied on those emails to get my um contact information and all that so the minutes of the last meeting are correct yeah no so so the there's two different things there's committees that we all uh participate in and then there's leas on assignments for our departments that uh our town departments that are Bud responsibilities then I'm mistaken I'm sorry okay that's all right um and it the just to just to describe what that is so um each of us takes a handful of departments and where they're they're we the point person for the Department if they have a question or uh we'll look at their budget a little more closely with them um we help represent them uh if they're telling a story about their budget and we help make sure their story gets told um so that's really our Focus as a as a leason and we're the point person so if somebody has questions uh they can reach out through the leason so um it's not a super heavy lift um but that's that's our our role so this way each department knows they can contact somebody um so we don't have and I apologize again I didn't send out the list but and we can do this next month because we're not starting with the budgets but um some of us will have to give up a couple of assignments so this way you can take a couple um but we can do that next month because there's not much uh going on with the need for lassance at the moment unless unless somebody has something that they're want to switch off at the moment now we can certainly do that but Al go ahead I I don't have any anything any Department that I necessarily want to switch off on um I I do want to keep the the fire department but I will say that that uh assessors and Treasurer are are very self-contained they're very easy and it may be uh it may be a way to to to move into the liaison assignment if Duncan wants to take you know one or both um but I'm just offering it up I'm I'm I'm I'm perfectly happy where I am I I just wanted to to make that that uh possibility happy to take both where did camera go there she is I clicked on the wrong button and closed oh yeah yeah you and Steve yeah can I click on the wrong button too and and make the same excuse I was gonna go on the Google Drive and find the L on assignments and I said you know no that's okay so so to make it very very brief I'm very happy with my liaison assignments I do want to keep the fire department and I I'm I'm happy to keep the U uh assessors and treasure but if Duncan's looking for something uh very low lifting I mean you know Theo I mean they they they do a great job and it's very simple but um but I I could offer up one or both if if necessary but I'm not looking to offload okay sure um Zach go ahead yeah I just wanted to say that um you know the the current assignments that I have really help for for my current workload um I'm open to to switch or to you know to change for the for the better of the team and then I also wanted to point out that we have a new committee is that correct with the with the wind energy if that wasn't mentioned at this meeting well you know there is a new committee but the select board uh did not put a slot for the finance committee to be a Lon on that committee okay thank you Karen I'm happy to take both of Al's uh offerings there if that makes it easier sure well one other option to discuss is um which might might be beneficial too so the school department is a big budget and what we tried last year was to have more than one L on because it's such a big budget so this way uh and so myself and and another member who has now left uh was no longer a l uson and Christopher was a l uson to the school committee so I'm not sure since he's on the school committee I'm not sure he would be a natural lus on but I'm not sure he would be a leus on uh so we probably should have somebody else that would join to be on the school committee and I don't know if you'd be interested in that I would be very interested I'm a substitute teacher there up in the school two days a week um you know so I have some appreciation for what's going on there and I would love to do that terrific then that might solve um that is a big heavy lift so if you took a primary role in the school budget I think that would U more than occupy your leason needs yeah I'm pretty pretty sure it would yeah it definitely would okay so then we don't have to uh a major J jiggle okay all right terrific thank you Duncan um all right so speaking of um that so you Karen you has his hand up oh sorry thank you so much Hugh go ahead hi Cindy really know I just GNA chime with what somebody had said a minute ago forget foret be so thank you so on that topic a little bit out of order is our um our meeting schedule and our budget so it's almost budget season and we are in the same kind of time frame and I think I forwarded to you the Town Administrator had put forth the budget timeline that uh he presented to the select board which is the similar to what was last year where a mid December uh the Town Administrator would have his first rollup of the budget uh and then then certainly by February 20th by by Town bylaw the select Board needs to uh approve the budget and send it over to the finance committee so uh what we had done in the last few years was to schedule our department meetings with with the finance committee and get them all scheduled in advance and then get uh all the the Departments to sign off to sign up for some dates in advance we had done maybe one date in December and then proceeded in January to do four Tuesdays in a row to really kind of get that out of the way and then the first week the first uh Tuesday in February we reserved for the school committee so to give them the school department to give them the latest opportunity uh for the budget so just want to check in does that timing still work with everybody yeah I think it's worked in the past I don't see why we shouldn't continue I think it worked well it's always nice to be done early uh in the season just in case anything comes up you know last year's warrant uh did not have too many financially um too many articles that had a financial impact but you never know um you know this year if if there are some so sometimes that takes a little bit more of our time come um come March so uh it's good to get those budgets out of the way okay terrific go ahead Al yeah pardon me one thing that we had briefly mentioned at the last meeting and I I want to continue the not the discussion but just put it in everybody's mind that part of the finance committee's uh role if you will is is also to analyze and look at projects that may come before the taxpayer of the Town two that come to mind are the U uh the school of course and the other one is the um the the infrastructure and and do an analysis not just look at at the project the discret project in and of itself but also the impact to the taxpayer long term and I don't need to go into the details I mean I think we all know the details at this point of what a seore and water may do what the state may do uh and what what Financial impact it may have for uh infrastructure for schools etc etc so I I I want to keep that on the table I'm not saying it needs to be there you know a big discussion tonight but but you know it it I it really is an important Point as far as I'm concerned for the town's people to know that the finance committee is looking at a at a larger and a bigger picture than just simply that discreet uh little what not little but but that discreet uh whatever it might be so that's all I wanted to say thank you and that's a that's a great point and I support that and I think part of part of what I like to do with the budget is is let's get the budget through as efficiently as quickly as we can then that opens up our space that if something does come up we have the opportunity to be have those conversations rather than being right in the 11th Hour against the deadline have still having budget meetings and we have no no right no space to talk about anything I think that's that dobes tailes in perfectly now um okay so I'll go ahead and put a schedule together and I can send that out um and I can do the same thing that I did last year after I'll email the dates and then if you I'll double check them and then uh what I did last year was send out a a Google um calendar invite to ask each of the department heads to select their dates so this way they can select what date works for them the best um so I can do that in the next month thank you all right um so back a little to our um agenda the next item would be committee and lay us on updates does anyone have any uh any meetings going on anything happening we have an audit committee meeting scheduled for the end of October so our next meeting in November I'll be able to report back on that I would think at some point there'll be a long-term building committee meeting again sometime but I have not heard anything from the chairperson of that committee as to when when we'll have another meeting because I think the the last update was that there was an RFP going out right to right right and is that RFP still yeah and so I think that the RFP is in Du back maybe until uh end of October maybe first part of November because it's it's rather extensive uh and I don't think that the work was going to be completed uh until I don't think the work completion date perhaps was post town meeting right right that's what we did discuss so we right should not be seeing a an article on the town on the annual town meeting anyway not hopefully not for this year unless it's for major unless it's for money for major repairs to just keep the building upright but right right we'll see if we'll see what happens with that right terrific thank you um has there been any infrastructure committee meetings that have taken place over the summer or at all because Duncan you're now officially on it right yeah I have not heard another thing since providing my contact info okay all right so it sounds like uh no other meetings of Interest okay and I and I'm sorry Karen I would just say simly that that um I'm on the capital Improvement and I haven't heard of any current meetings yet so U um I'm ready willing and able I just haven't heard uh gotten had anybody get in touch with me yeah that that will probably start out in um I think uh I think that starts in December okay all right thanks Hugh go ahead yeah just there's nothing important I just want to mention CPC that our next meeting is in November we don't have one this month because there's nothing to deal with but the way the process works is that people come offer possibilities which the committee reviews as to whether we are going to take a position on it what or no further and it all ends up with recommendations to town meeting this is the initial part of the process and it's a a fixed schedule if you will of having material ready for town meeting when then will make its decision on our recommendations we're now in the preliminary phase days in November we will get some things that people come with and we'll see where it goes from there great thank you Hugh um if nothing else I'll move on to the next topic which would be to uh approve the minutes of September 10th 2024 I moved thank you any second second thank you any discussion on those minutes no no okay now we'll do a roll call there um Duncan Duncan law I Michelle Michelle landi l l Lei Zack Zack Leu i q h Mor I Cindy Cindy Brown I Gary obain thank you and Karen Rous I thank you um okay so agenda I have no uh topics that came up within 48 hours in advance of the meeting I have no correspondents uh does anyone have any topics for our next meeting that they' like to add to the agenda at this Ken I don't have a topic I I do have a follow-up question though from what you said before because I was gonna bring it up but I think it was Zach that stole my thunder um regarding that wind the wind offsh show win committee is there a reason why the select board didn't take anybody from the or didn't make um a spot for finance or where that's at I didn't notice it on their agenda last week it was on their agenda it was the previous meeting so they're they were um met as a group to come up with a charter or what the committee was expected to do and the way I listened to the committee they they wanted to limit it to nine members um because when committees get too big they get unwieldy and I think they really wanted some members of the general public on the committee so I think by process of trying to whittle away spots they eliminated uh finance committee uh position well I I also think yeah I also think that they didn't feel that there was any near-term Financial impact to the town that there wasn't anything that was going to necessarily require an appropriation from the town in the near term that may change uh but there wasn't anything imminent this was really more of an impact issue uh environmentally more than it is financially right no understood I just you know you want to make sure that yeah I I I will only say that they did they did leave a seat for the economic development committee on it which seems counter to um if there's no Financial impact then there isn't so to select Economic Development as a seat and not finance committee but um that is what it is right but if somebody here feels as though finance committee should be represented we can certainly um make our comments known to the select board I guess my my only thought there is and there's been a lot of chatter you know uh online and in papers and all of that written up about it so I would just want to make sure we're just on top of whatever it is that's going on you've read so much that a lot of things happen that you don't even know that are happening and you don't find out till after the fact um so you just want to make sure that uh you know every everyone is aware uh of what's happening and and all of that so um I mean good to know that there's one or two or more seats from the general public that's good to know um so and you're right I mean that that makes that more a little more of a challenge right so if a finance committee is not on the committee that's that's that responsibility to come back to go hey we're you know there's some things of interest that we should be looking at what right it would be up to us to be watching the Committees on our own um and I don't know I've got enough right maybe there's is there a Le is there an assignment there for somebody to just kind of be be responsible for watching the meetings pay attention as to what's going on not necessarily a part of the comitting but lais on or whatever it may be just want to be mindful of that I guess evolve right go ahead Al thank you Michelle well I think what you said earlier is exactly right um even though I don't know this uh specifically that there doesn't seem to be uh you know in the minds of the select board uh any any current economic issues and so on and so forth but I would I would also flip it around and say I think that's one of the reasons that the town many times gets into trouble because they're not proactive enough and they you we wait till the last minute and then say holy blank you know where did this come from so I believe that at a minimum to Michelle's point we should at at a minimum have a finance committee or a member or a couple whatever it might be monitor what's going on if if they don't want to give us a seat at the table or at a a maximum say we need a seat at the table because you know knows yeah so so anyway I just wanted to bring that point up but but I U yeah I I think this is this down the road could be a long-term uh issue and if we jump on it as a finance committee too late we could be behind the eightball right right it goes hand in hand to what you just said about staying on top of other issues that have come up in the past not you know doesn't have to be on the Forefront but being mindful of it that they're kind of still going on being aware being part of it and all that kind of thing so um is it's been on my mind since it came up so no it was a good point Michelle it really was you know it's it's I think we do need to address it in some some fashion thank you Duncan go ahead yeah the uh I I mean I just Echo what they're say what Al and Michelle said but the you know we shouldn't be backing away from this I mean they're talking about bringing a big wire ashore at Horseneck and running it up Route 88 and then running it across our town so I would be way in front of this not a little bit in front of it way in front of it yep well if if the committee uh would like I can certainly uh the finance committee could send the letter to the select board and ask them to reconsider uh adding a seat to to the committee to for a finance committee representative if that's what we'd like to do I would like to make that motion I would like to second that motion any further discussion on that I will uh I will do a roll call and then we will uh get a letter drafted uh Duncan Duncan law I thank you Michelle Al I Zack Zack Brew I Hugh Hugh Mort I Cindy Cindy Brown I Gary yes thank you and Karen yes as well um would you like me to draft the letter and send a draft to you to review before I send it out good idea I'm comfortable I'm comfortable with your draft Yeah I think you can draft the letter okay all right thank you for taking on that okay sure thing I will do that all right thank you Michelle for bringing that up that was a very very good yeah no that that was good yeah very good point uh anything else uh because I have nothing else on the agenda and does anyone have anything else they want to add no I I have nothing to add I but I do want and it has nothing really to do with finance committee but I know we're being recorded and people will listen to it I want to give a shout out to the uh the highway department I think they they and their the crew that they hired to do the paving on Main Road has done a fabulous job I mean little bit of confusion but it you know you're always going to have that confusion but the quality of the work looks great the uh you know the the cops and the direction of traffic in and out whatever it might be um I I just wanted to publicly say that I I think money well spent even though it was this the chapter 90 money or whatever it is it's still you know we're it it it was a good job it is a good job so that's all I wanted to say great thank you very much for that I don't think I've seen it but um I'm I'll I'll have to go look and I do every day I um I I I apologize for being um 15 20 minutes late is there something I should go back and listen to the recording to did I miss anything the first 15 minutes did you were did you were you here did you hear when Steve fors was on uh no so I'll go back then and listen to yeah you better listen to that yeah okay yeah terrific all right if nothing else some motion to adjourn all right I will do roll call Duncan Duncan La I Michelle Michelle Alando i al El I Zach Zack I Hugh Hugh Morton I Cindy Cindy Brown I Gary yes and Counter El I thank you very much