##VIDEO ID:oNY_lAu4omA## e e e e e e e okay since it's uh roughly 6:30 I'm going to start the zoning board of appeals off with a pledge of allegiance I Pledge of Allegiance unes in accordance with Mass General law this this me this hearing will be uh televised and recorded um first order of business is Westport Lakes Road and applicant of Pine Ridge Estates LLC and Bradford Dean for a con comprehensive permit pursu to mass Journal Law chapter 40b for development off West Lakes Drive consisting of 38 single family homes on individual Lots which contain two or three bedrooms with 10 of those homers being designated as affordable deed itive homes the subject property is located at zero Westport Lake Road and is shown on assessors map 31 Lots 30 b c and uh 3B 3C and 4G applicant has requested that this matter be continued to October 2nd 2024 at 6:30 mainly because we have U four other uh petitions in front of us and the 40b effort is is going to take us substantial amount of time probably several hearings uh do you uh Maria do you have uh the official paperwork can I for no for uh for the um the request of continuance it was just an email yes okay I'll read this into the record uh Mr manard and zoning board members we represent our client Pine Ridge Estates LLC presently we are on the agenda for September 25th to open the hearing for a chapter 40b comprehensive permit however due to the late time frame of the agenda we are see we are asking for continuance to on October 2nd meeting date please consider this email our clients's approval to extend the 30-day period to which the zbaa must open the meeting appreciate your time and consideration this matter sincerely Paul cussen uh uh delic Associates managing member uh so uh anyway we have a request for uh for a continuance uh until next week correct next Wednesday so uh do I have a I make a motion that we approve a continuance till next Wednesday I'll second that a second is there any discussion all in favor uh before I do this the voting members on this will be the regular members of Jerry Tino real ice myself Roger manard constant ski and Cynthia ktz those will be the voting members for for this uh for this hearing so and and that'll be at 8 at 6:30 at 6:30 uh and again the rationale for this is this is going to be a very lengthy process and right now they were scheduled to be last on the agenda of which we have four other hearings so by the time we got around to them it would have you know it it would have just been uh too late for us to uh to manage properly so all in favor say I I all no let the record show that's unanimous so we will start the uh Westport Lakes Road uh 40b application uh next next Wednesday at 6:30 so continuing and I'm saying continuing because 10 Hillside Road is the uh petitioner for 10 Hillside Road here we've seen you every month for the past like six months I'm GNA miss you guys I know it what are we going to do without you I'm not sure I know what to do here if I'm not what do we do every every Wednesday this is a continuation of a continuation of a continuation hearing on application of Timothy uh gpie applicant and Julia craft owner for a special permit to convert a portion of the existing garage into a detached accessory apartment containing 375 Square fet pursuant to zoning bylaw article 9 section 954 property is located at ten Hillside Road Westbard mass and is shown on assessor map 88 Lots 169 and 170 now this has been a continuation we have gone through all the particulars of the special permit with the exception of an approved SE system so the only thing that was outstanding was the uh was a letter or a notification from the Board of Health saying that your septic system has been approved for the special permit and we received an email okay I hope you did and I have it here one one of many emails there's like several there's like several of them okay um there's a one Roger yeah oh here we go right here okay um okay no I guess this isn't you you said you had it I know I had it up I just had it in my hand I think it'll be yes okay actually yep right I do have it yeah okay it's at the bottom okay uh 10 Hillside Road is tentatively approved just waiting on a couple of forms to be completed just our red tape but nothing that should hold up any approval sincerely uh Nancy pette office manager Westport Board of Health um to me I see no reason to to hold this up again we're waiting for paperwork from the health department they've indicated that there's no issue with it they're just waiting to for the red tape to to to finalize this uh is there any other any other the way I would generally the way we generally run run this uh uh this hearing is we we allow the petitioner to provide all the information and then the board then asks questions and then I open it up to the public we've already gone through that like six times so it's by the way but if there's anybody in the in the public who want to make a comment you're welcome to you know to come up and and comment on this I'm sure you're all here for other things yes well uh are there any comments or questions before before okay and make a motion to close I make a motion to close the hearing second second any comments all in favor say I I I I'll oppose no by the way the voting members will be uh Jerry the same members Jerry coutino Ray Elias myself Roger manard Kinski and Cynthia kazeko um I believe to be all to be perfectly honest I believe Jerry probably missed one you might have missed one hearing on this where we all we did was do a continuation continuation so since there was no discussion I have no problem with assigning him as as a me as a voting member since we didn't discuss anything we just continued it uh okay so I have a motion to close do I have a second we already went through that we already did that so we closed what what closing the the um the hearing me means is that uh now the board will make a decision uh we get no further input from the public uh if we have to we can ask questions but to clarify something but uh other than that it's uh uh it's really just a a board discussion so discussion Ian we've gone through all of the particulars I think we've passed this enough I think we we've gone through all the partic we went through the a through J requirements for a septic system back I don't know six months ago right uh and the only thing that was outstanding then was that with the septic now the septic has been at least tentatively approved or approved with Pap were coming right uh which is all really we ask for is that the health department acknowledged that they have you have an approved design so um you know I will make a motion to and by the way the rules now have changed on this and they will change uh the the state uh has made a change to how a accessory Apartments will be handled in the future uh there will uh so we we town is actually going to have to change the bylaws accordingly previously we always mandated a um uh a deed restriction for things like making sure that the it remain that the uh that the owner occupy either the either the the main house or the the apartment and that it remain in one bedroom and a couple you know other things that are related to seic that's no longer allowed by the state so I don't believe that that in all Consciousness that we can mandate a deed restriction when the state has mandated otherwise so I'm not even I'm not even going to propose that we do that does anybody have an issue with that no I I believe that goes in effect February 25th well part of it goes in effect now the thing that doesn't that doesn't go into effect until then is the the actual special permit doesn't go in effect until February so we keep special permits up until that point but the aspects of it some let some of the aspects of it are immediate if we filed a uh deed restriction it would be null and void it would be null and void eventually so I don't believe we should expend Town resources to do something to do something that's that's be n void in February right right so the only uh uh again the only thing that the only conditions that we we generally put on this is very straightforward that this is under condition that you follow the plans that were submitted date stamped by the uh you know uh by our by by Maria and uh that's about the only restriction now that that that uh not restriction but uh condition that we put on it is that you follow the plans that that that you provided and and the that's the subject system which is the most important I think right right so with those conditions I make a motion to uh to Grant the petition for for the let me back let me let me read it again I grant the petition of uh Timothy gpie for a special permit to convert a portion of the existing garage into the taach accessory apartment containing 375 square feet pursuant to zoning bylaw article 9 section 954 I have a motion do I have a second second second second do I have any any discussion should we add Julia craft into the into the excuse me should should Julia Craft's name be of the motion as the owner um did I not say that yes okay uh I recommend and and Julia craft right owner for a special permit I'll second the motion all in favor say I I I I'll oppose no let the record show this unanimous finally thank you there is a 20 by the way there is a 20-day period that uh that it can be appealed so so don't start banging on the nails for sure 20 days I mean you've been waiting six months yeah no worries I can wait another 20 days thank you everyone I really appreciate we expect to see you again by the way next Wednesday yeah I'll just come to watch yeah okay right thanks again have a good evening everyone thank you you okay um moving on another continuation of a continuation uh hopefully we can get through with this one as quickly uh 6 184 River Road a continuation of a hearing of an applicant of Chandler Fritz and Matthew Fritz for a special permit the applicant here hi hi okay uh to be for to construct a two garage to be located in roughly the same location wait a minute one-bedroom accessory apartment okay to construct a two-car garage should be located on roughly the same location as an existing structure wed Li and that will include a one-bedroom accessory apartment on the second floor containing 877 ft as Allowed by zoning bylaw section 954 property subject located at uh 684 River Road Westport Mass and is shown on mass accessor map 89 Lots 135 and 138 we did need the River Road one good thing I kept it this is a continuation again we've been through the same thing I think this is the number third time through yes uh once again I believe we sat uh and went through all the conditions there's a through J conditions for a special permit and the only open action item was the U septic system that's correct and we do have a note from Nancy pette which says 684 River Road is approved so there's absolutely no uh uh reason to to uh uh I wouldn't say to Grant it to you know for any further discussion on this since the the U uh the only open Action was the was the septic system uh once again if anybody in in the audience uh has any comments on this you're free to come up um if not once again I think we've been through this I think like I said I think this is the third time on this one uh and okay so uh I'm going to then uh make a motion to close the hearing I'll second that I uh and it's going to be the same members voting on this uh uh Jerry gtino Ray Elias myself Raj manard conston ski and Cynthia kazeko because these are the five regular members uh the other two members are alternates they only vote when one of the members is not present so um okay where I we voted we we we we made a motion to close was that make this one R second Ray second all in favor of close in the hearing I I I'll oppose no once again we're just going to again I'm going to say the same thing that we said before we generally would have made a deed restriction but because the state law changed just a few months ago we don't do that anymore we're not and as of next year we won't be allowed to do that anymore uh and the only then condition that I would put on this is the same condition we put on the last one is that the your your plans become part of the public record and and the condition is that you follow the plans that were that were submitted so uh discussion other than only discussion no other discussion then uh I'll make a motion to approve the applicant of Chandler Fritz and Matthew Fritz for a special permit to construct a two-car garage to be located on roughly the same location as existing structure after Demolition and that will include a one-bedroom accessory apartment on the second floor containing 8 70 squ ft as Allowed by zoning bylaw section 954 with the only condition being the uh they must adhere to the the plans as submitted uh any discussion uh on the motion I'll second you'll second okay I have a motion and a second all in favor I all opposed no the petition is granted again it's a 20-day uh grace period so you know okay don't start doing anything for 20 days right we don't get to see you next week either okay than you three down okay the next is um is a petition uh zero Sodom Road which isn't actually at the beginning of Sodom Road zero just means it doesn't have a number application of Jesse Roderick and Kelly Roder for variance from sections 7.1 and 7.6 because of property lacks Frontage on a street way and is a non-conforming l sub property is located at zero Sodom Road and is shown in assessor map 60 lot 11 and the uh again the uh voting members will be uh Jerry coutino Ray Elias myself Roger manard kin ski and Cynthia kazt and the way the way uh way that this hearing will continue is that I'll have the petitioner come up provide whatever information the petitioner feels is uh is pertinent the uh the board will then ask questions of the petitioner after the board has finished asking questions then I'll open it up to the public before we close the hearing so petition is representative is that Mr leech is that you yes good evening uh Sean leash Northeast Engineers Representing Kelly and Jesse Rodricks in this matter this is an application and as we recognize and as discussed in the description of the project we recognize that this is a parcel of land that was uh basically created by the state line moving back in 1862 and it has no Frontage on a public way but it does has enough uh Upland area and any meet any kind of offsets obviously there's no building on there because there no building permit issued uh I submitted four exhibits and I'll go through those exhibits uh one at a time this is exhibit a this is the land that the Rodricks own on Michael's Lane in Idan it shows basically the their existing house they have over 700 feet of Frontage on Michael's Lane that well and More in excess of any owning requirement either for the Westport Andor uh Tian the uniqueness of this property basically was Creed because of the state line that chopped off the back halfth of this [Music] piece this is what it looks like currently today aerial wise there's 6 Acres cleared of the 20 acres that exists of this particular lot that is in the Westport side again this is lot line goes around is one single family house on this right now where is Sodom Road in relation to Sodom Road is 2000 ft that way yes right way to the east of it yes yes this is directly behind wio Farms yeah it's kind yeah so and I have I'll get to that exhibit in a second okay so those are the two exhibits that mean something this particular this is Exhibit C and this is one that probably of Interest Sodom Road being here mhm crle Road being here State Line cutting down the middle this is the which is 20 plus acres this is their existing house parcel which is all these Parcels were chopped off and a lot of these particular Parcels because of uh errors and deeds and everything end up being taken by tax title by the town of Westport or sold at tax title for instance uh Mr Messier picked up this one coup Land Trust Parcels in here that were chopped off that basically when they deed it out theyve got to mention the land in Massachusetts Andor the man land in Rhode Island so what happened just a quick little history of how this how this came to be 1862 Supreme Court made an unbiased decision uh to change the state line at this particular location that ran the old state line ran basically through the north with Pond over and down Stanford Road going down into adenville and then along the West Branch of the Westport River in other words Westport Harbor at that time was part of rhod Island that's the reason you have the only way to get to Westport Harbor is to go through Rhode Island so I'm living in RH Island I am intimately familiar with the r State L went straight through the middle of my father's house we had three bedrooms in Massachusetts and two in Rhode Island there's the there's the conf part of the confusion now that has something to do with water right the issue was as the city of Troy now the city of Fall River became uh manufacturing and there was a war effort on they needed the water right so what they did was they very conveniently they decided that we're going to this line which was established in the 1700 and monumented this Stone bounds along that line all a sudden became in question and then all of a sudden it became part of Massachusetts strictly because the entire North wapa now became Fall River hook Pond which is right on the Fall River became part of Fall River and that whole section of Fall River the South End where that all the water is including the South and it's the reason that we all know they took a little slipper of land going into Saudi pond so when you look at the the town lines and the state lines at that time and you look at what happened it makes no sense other than one reason the Mills and Fall River baby petitioned to have this discrepancy or change and you ended up with this configuration here of the state line SL pound line between Fall River and Sh and what you see here is this little slipper here all of a sudden became part of Massachusetts and part of Fall River which is why when you drive up 177 you get a 100 foot STP of Fall River because they wanted salty P salty Pond flows in the South wo which is part of the north wupa which is drove the quick Shan river which drove all the Mills and Fall River and if you notice Bourne Mill which is in Tian is on the south end of the cook Pond that's the only sliver of the pond they left in Tian so there was a there was a method to the madness but what happened was they changed the whole state line going down they decided we're going to move this and shown you there and cut right through which where it would have gone up the West Branch of the river and up at what is Adamsville Brook they decided just draw a straight line down through and along braen Point Road so it cuts off Adamsville in half Adamsville Rhode Island The Village of adenville went up to St Vincent Ball Camp now became part in Massachusetts part in Rhode Island so what happened to all these parcels and our Parcels located Parks me right here on this state line they chopped off the back half of all these farms and in doing so you know at the time there was no there was no uh zoning so no one thought much about it at the time but as zoning became more prevalent it became you have these mostly Upland Parcels of land here that were usable that became orphan Parcels because they were in Massachusetts people didn't pay taxes on them there was disputes and it's not an unusual circumstance for instance that little sliver of Saudi Pond that you saw that all River people still argue about there are lots that are these are all Fall River residents this is the Idan line this is all their frontages all their axis is from Tian just like we're asking tonight it's the same thing it's been done several times these people I think are thrilled because tax doesn't fall river somewhat less than Tian but however sorry it it's something that cut off all these Parcels all these Farms all these things because Fall River took this sliver for the water rights to Saudi Pond now as far as what's happened in Westport the same thing happens to Westport you have parcels going along this is just the AAL portion of parcels they go along uh get North up here so basically State Line this used to be all rhod Island in here now Massachusetts my father's house actually right here Cuts right through old Harbor Road which makes no sense which is a Massachusetts layout goes into Rhode Island comes back out this was all Rhode Island at one time now became Massachusetts we have a bunch of lots along Old Harbor Road who H have Frontage in Massachusetts but all their land and all their houses are in Little Compton and it's not uncommon for them to issue building permits in Little Compton Ro island has a little less stringent zoning than what Massachusetts has for buildability they only require basically a certain amount of access as opposed to a frontage so you can get by and this is what we're petitioning tonight with this plan here the only thing tiban requires is adequate access and a 20 foot easement to get to that adequate access so we are creating and this what this plan does this adequate access goes back to that 20 acres of land to build one single family house in a residential agricultural District in the town of Westport that basically the zoning the zoning whole chapter of zoning is for to control density use and everything like that this is a compatible use it's on a less dense than probably any half the places in town and it's a hardship it's Unique parcel because it got chopped off and the state line got moved now they weren't alive when the state line got moved I don't want to make that impression but but the parcels were created because of the state line now they only want to put one single family house yes I'm Kelly live in and this piece of land would be strictly for like extension of family because it literally goes right by our home so it would be my daugh are are there any possible similar to this Sean well there's a whole SL I mean this is this is a I don't want to say it's going to be an ongoing problem if you look at this some of these are contiguous families the weights still own this whole Farm but I I think I don't know if everybody knows Dean Martin Karen Martin they have a similar situation over there at narrow Avenue there's a punch of parcels on narrow Avenue I I did I took the time to contact the fire chief asked what his what his thought process was for this and he said that the plans that are shown there and he mentioned narrow Avenue yeah said the he's responsible for that fire district he know was if there's a fire at that location it goes through Westport and then the it kind of comes from tivid they help out kind of do whatever but he did say that there were more than just this one place that like that so right I just wanted to bring that up because I thought of it as a safety issue I well how do they get the fire trucks in there we went to the Tibetan Town planner and who approached the DPW the concern from the emergency response in tient is adequate with grade construction for road to get back to the house should there need to be adequate access the way 911 works is I would almost guarantee that the phone number for this particular parcel will be a 401 form number because what would happen in 911 if it would ring he no he mentioned the fact that Westport was responsible for that parel right even though they have no access to it that was the other question I was going to ask is the access from the right away on Sodom Road accessible for Fire Equipment it's all it's all swamp land yeah there is there is a cart path that runs throughout the Soom road yeah but driveability it's all it's all than tank nothing tank getting through through weather Farm yeah so there's plenty there's like the the co of Polo Club is up this way and further south right they're right up they're right up against uh I was only concerned about how safy was going to be of it so Paul but basically if it was Emergency Response Ambulance who would most likely be coming West would contact TI and TI and would send the ambulance pretty much what he said too now I spoke with um Jim White and the planning board chair of the planning board and he said that they regularly very often have uh things similar to this but just the opposite where where uh the frontage is in Westport but the backland is all in Little Compton as as Sean has indicated uh but the difference is they have Frontage right problem here is they don't have Frontage what would be the address what's that what would be the address that's a good question I don't know what like would it be Tri address because IM be Michael I think it would be a Michael's Lane address so in that regard regarding safety even though the property is physically in Westport the address is a TI go to zero Sodom Road they' be driving up Sodom yeah yeah it's assessed in Westport yes don't mind collect the taxes but don't got do anything for it it's a weird situation because literally when we have to do the perk test and the septic design they're going to have to come through here to get up there to do the perk tests and whatnot for and everything would be by Massachusetts standards and we always obviously it's a we would agree to all the offsets that are required you know side yard B yard and all the other things that's that's a gimme we're not too worried about that it's it's a matter of you know you have 20 acres of lande you have 700 ft of Frontage but you can't do it because it's a State Line run through the middle of your property okay let me read you something from uh our attorney uh uh on the variance matter which is this this particular applicant the applicant must meet all the statutory requirements for the qualification of variance in other words the applicant has the burden of proving one soil condition shape or Topography of the land not affecting the zoning District generally so uh essentially there are requirements for a variance as you have to identify a hardship right and the hardship has to be based on some aspect of the land like there's a ledge or there's a pond or there's a there's something related to the to the land number two substantial hardship related to Unique soil shape or topography if the bylaw is enforced three no substantial detriment to the public good if the variance is granted and four no nullification or substantial der uh derogation of the intent of the bylaw if the variance is granted so how do you comply with with the the well it's a very obvious you know hardship here uh due to the St line chopping off a contiguous piece of of property the uniqueness of the land is that is that in itself I mean if you we're going for a frontage variance mhm not an access variance not a uh offset variance not you know where you know Ledges all over here so we have to tuck it against this property line or you know we can't access across our Frontage because the grand Canyon's there so we have to come around the Grand Canyon come in and get that kind of variance this uniqueness and of this property is created by a state line shutting off a contiguous piece of property U sua you want to want to uh chime in on this I don't have any issues with it it's just it's you know basically I Deni it on the fact that it doesn't have any fronts J old way M right so there's other properties in West like been said earlier that come in from they've got their driveway on on Old har to get into TI or little comp I mean I work with little comp inspected twice on on driveway on of road that our access little confence West a similar situation just reversed just reversed I mean uh but have we have have we have we come across a situation like this in in your term of office in Westport yeah this is the first one for Westport but basically um the ones that have happened is it's low comp and looking to to get the f West okay and one and one of them is they owned a street with into the land so that's I was able to allow that looks like own district and they pretty and they own pretty much of it too I have a question S I would like to have gotten a drone out because I didn't I didn't want to go I usually you can't get there right I usually visit all the sites before because I better to see them but I wasn't going to go and drive back into some property like that but um I was curious from looking at this what is this land I mean it's obviously been cleared what is what has it been used for what is just Agriculture and some storage uh basically I mean it's been clear like that's six of the 20 acres basically the the parcel is much bigger than that that you see that's where the house is going to be cited on the existing clear basic property so it's not like we're going to mow down 12 acres of tree and there's a concern there was a concern just you sure of tan that are you getting access to put a solar field back here and cutting down 20 acres of trees and that is not the intent we you know the Rodricks are more than happy to put a restriction on one single family home and so is there a is there a pond back there what is the Topography of well there's a there's a intermittent stream that runs down through which actually was the original property line for this particular parel looks like a pond is looks like there's a pond down on Michael's Lane there's a looks like there's a car in there there right uh could or mightbe a boat is a pond a pond I think it's either a piece of equipment or a car or a truck yeah okay it's just that it's yeah it's all Upland everything you see cleared and of the 20 acres 16 of it is Upland okay so yes you know it's it drops off very sleeply down to this intermittent small portion of wetland yeah oh yeah it's a great property yeah it it runs down into adenville Brook it's one of the intermittent streams that runs down to Adam Adamsville Brook and of course wood at the other end going through madas and that's where that is that's right through there it goes right to tiid does it AB but the old mad yes AB buts yeah it does yeah I mean Milky Way Farm is right over here and they have the same issues and then like I said all the Saudi Pond uh lots that are live in Fall River but everything comes through titon uh it it it's not dissimilar to what's going on at Blossom Road where they have you know Westport addresses but Fall River They Fall River residence well it's not unprecedented that that we have to go through Ro Rhode Island to get to other parts of of Westport and uh I see this as being very similar to that only a little bit different distance but anyway uh as far as hardship I uh I'm not sure that the uh traditional H ship uh guidelines that we uh follow uh apply here it seems to me that the government created this hardship and I think the create the government uh has a responsibility to take care of it uh that's the way I can can you go once again in describe access to this to this parcel okay so the access for this piece which is off of Michael's Lane which is off grand road which is the property that their uh the Roger Jesse and Kelly live at right now right here and the reason I'm showing the septic system the wells is part of TI's requirement is to show that that you're not running over a septic system with the with the access so the access is coming off Michael's Lane running along the north side of the property so that's like a 20 foot I mean what's the if you look at the aerial photograph it's pretty much existing it is built is that a right away do they own the property they own the property in other words the Rogers will own the property the only thing and I I gave the well I mean the is it part of this parcel it's not because it's in West it's in West no you can't do that you can't do that it it would be the same in Island hadn't moved right um well all I'm trying to get is um what what are the legalities of that of that access road the titon requires as Westport requires for the houses in titon whatever the required access is with grade construction whatever and I think I exhibit and your package is is that requirement it has to be adequate with grce for a VM vehicle to get to wherever so it's actually an extension of our existing yeah so the the existing driveway comes up it may mean a little Improvement but it's basally built into the property but the the Ricks own that yeah okay my my question mostly is it would have to be a deed easement for the it would have to be a deeded easement because otherwise suppose they sell this property to somebody else you know 10 years from now the and the rodick decide they want to close that road off because because their daughter isn't living there anymore they couldn't do that this would one of the requirements would have to be as it R is a little different when it comes to access and Frontage and things like that they just require access not necessarily Frontage little comp like that but you have to have a deed 20 foot right away going because that's not something we can mandate because it's on the Rhode Island side yeah Tian will mandate it because they will have to do that so they allow them to do the same mandate is that once it hit across the Massachusetts line that the driveway that's there is still adequate for emergency vehicles that's correct but it would be most likely not be our emergency and I had to go back to my father's house where it has Frontage in Rhode Island he splits the house we had to replace the septic system three of the bedrooms in RH Island two are in Massachusetts what you do the garage is in rhod Island the woodsheds in Massachusetts you know it's got all kinds of there were all kinds of and you're paying taxes on basically half a house and half a house it's a really weird situation they actually pay taxes to both States yeah oh grow growing but growing up that's why you became a Serv apping for my Massachusetts driver's license I had a Rhode Island mailing address and that always confuse people yes when you filed your Massachusetts taxes State of Rhode Island because you had a r Island mail address sent you a nasty gram say you're not paying your taxes on Rhode Island but you weren't a resident it's a really strange situation and there are a lot of people in ad go with the same situation okay I I see no problem with this all uh the only thing thing I question is how to get there yes you know because it's not a typical variance but we have to get there someplace and then as Ray said what are the other properties there what's going to happen after that now the other properties are probably not like this one because the other properties for example Warren messia he has one of those lots in there uh he doesn't have a budding properties he doesn't have can actually make access he does he doesn't own own like she owns getting in there right yeah if there are a lot of parcels and land trust has picked a piece behind the old sa vinc the Paul Camp that's an issue just exactly like this uh the state line splits it yeah today I went into yeah half of it is on one side and and it was really confusing when I was doing the work for the land trust because they were trying to they they don't have any Authority in Rhode Island anyway but this is this is a problem a lot that's why a lot of these pieces although there may be continuous a lot of them like I think this one's the tax title I know Mr Messier picked up his tax title uh I think W far picked up one a tax title but they were all part of these right but they were you know and if the deed isn't written land in Massachusetts and Rhode Island you lost it yeah interesting the ACT if W far picked up one of these Jesus let's say they picked up this one here because they have Frontage on Sodom they could not come in with the same petition because they don't have a hard shift they could access across they could prop through their own property right I hear they're accessing it's not even ask they're asking to access to their own property yeah and that's the biggest part yeah and so Rhode Island was just fine with that when Massachusetts said we're gonna small Rhode Island picked up a piece of barington and a piece of pucky because they wanted to get the most most of the front seon on the Providence River basically but the thing is you know OT and and Little Compton and Westport cunk towns that basically were just farming communities yeah I don't care right you know doesn't matter to me you know because and there's no zoning and there's no there were no taxes back then so it wasn't a big problem it's just I only land them both and now as things move forward now it becomes complicated and more and more complicated and it becomes a real can under I mean Fall River has a real issue and I can tell you the people in ton that are on those roads and who are to they want to send their kids to TI in schools but they fall over residence and what do you do so wasn't there uh wasn't there two um efforts to secede the harbor I mean they really made a mess of it when they did that the thing there were there other ramifications legal ramifications between Rhode Island and Massachusetts for instance in Island you own to high water Massachusetts you own to low water right right so when that part of the harbor became Massachusetts Massachusetts acquired all the lands that Rhode Island owned which was between high and low water so everybody in the harbor owns the high water they're the only place in Westport that owns the high water all the rest of Westport owns to low water it's a problem for docks and all kinds of other things it's a legal nightmare you know if you get if you want to get into the weeds of these things and eventually the way the real estate values are going up it's going to get more and more convoluted and complicated that's why I think there's going to be more of this since 1984 there's not been one of these that has come before this board well it's good have feeling that they will I mean that's the sad thing it's really good land compared to most of Westport does yeah wet right I mean it's and they're not using it use it for Farmland but you know unless I mean the weather is I guess when L have brought a home before WEA bought this property I mean if I was them I would have bought that right I mean the the increase in the tax revenue to the town of Westport from basically what is being taxed as nothing to a single family house lot will be substantial well if nothing else mrisa I I I really want to thank you for the history of lesson a lot of these things and again there's going to be a lot more like I I worry as you do how much complicated can this get yeah because every Everything is a case-by case basis I don't think you're going to find a lot where there's Frontage and tient in this access most of these are landlock when I there's no can't so there isn't a contiguous ownership there is unfortunately on the piece of the north which is the weight Farm which us to go the yeah they're in different names but I'm not sure if what can happen but all but all the person on the Massachusetts side has to do is negotiate with the person on the Rhode Island side for access it it's not and only needs a 20 foot easement you don't need to own the land right it's an easement right it can get and but that's only for a single family house lot you start doing five house Lots or a solar field or something along those that would be more of a fear on this land because it's very high and dry land yeah and the they got all these Ving Parcels let's just mow down 80 acres of trees and put a soli couldn't get access through the r property because they would have to cross Wetlands yeah there if you see there's little Wetlands Crossings showing where two weights properties were in the same place you could see that the one of the weights would that parcel would ask for you know easement to their but you there's a million walls in here cuz you can see in the 17 and 1800 from these contiguous Parcels that they were old farmed mhm but they again for the last 160 years this has been screwed up and it was basically because Fall River wanted the water race it was it was a water grab all the way to the head of Westport so maybe they should be paying for our sewers well yep so Sean as far as the hardship from your point of view um would you uh would you indicate that the hardship would be the government created it and therefore we got to deal with it yes I mean they you know again created 160 years ago but they didn't you know there's no thought of zoning or any kind of restrictions to land back then I mean you could have put a land landfill here was there any point in time when this would not have been a problem if you wanted to build a house on any even if you owned a th acres here in this particular piece and you wanted to put your house right here we would still have to come no back in the 1800s oh no they would throw this houses in Adamsville that are that old my father's house built in 1820s it's split by the state line right there was no thought of it okay but at one point but at one point in time it wasn't yeah right but just way prior to zoning this happened and nobody but they kept Shifting the Massachusetts line so at some point in time it was probably either in Massachusetts or Rhode Island right well was all on Rhode Island that whole basically the the and you look at the purchase of Dartmouth the dmouth purchase it runs up the West Bank of the Westport River up through the adenville brook up going up into this whole Watershed Saudi Pond Deval Pond and that was the r Island Providence plantations Plymouth Bay County yeah which a lot of us that live over there have wondered for a very long time why it isn't in Red Island everybody asked that same question and again there's a lot of complicated issues because they moved the adenville brook to create the pond the mil pond in Anville the M Pond the brook used to go right by the mill obviously was built in 1600s they damned it up and then they rerouted it around with his break's gas station yeah but that made what I'm what I'm trying to get at though is that if any point in history this was a viable piece of property with access in Massachusetts then we can just say then no it wasn't but it never has been a viable access in massachus this was this was all Rhode Island up to here oh everything this way was Rhode Island so VI piece in Rhode Island so okay right okay just all a sudden because of a land grab water grab massachus became part of Massachusetts yes okay so at one point okay all right right and if you look at stone walls especially at the St vinc B Camp the one you walk up the main path is about 6 feet off the rhod island line and they knew about where the line was not exactly obviously they can just today and then one side two different ownerships oh yeah is there any board member that feels we should not provide relief okay given that I think we should concentrate on what kind of conditions well before we do that I want to open it up to the public yeah but I'm just saying I think we need to address is there anybody who wants to uh comment on this uh petition I I guess you're all here for the last one okay what does this do for you Ralph just longer drive if the boards I'd be issuing permit for the house that's going to be built and i' be going through through and then okay how are you going to get to go look at it go ttim oh okay he's got a longer Drive they allow you when run take my truck drive the electric car if he has permission he can come you can get through from actually St P Paul camp this cart pass I get up through here I mean I think it goes to the you know the new regul or law or Bill or whatever the the governor put in is that we need more housing we need more housing correct that I mean this is a this is a beautiful piece of land yes just for for Westport they have that much acres with that little bit of wet you know I mean that's something actually that we should put in our decision because that is something that Massachusetts is pushing is that we need more housing yeah uh and this is I mean more housing yes there's obvious and and there's nothing there's there's really no drawback to this other than it doesn't pass our zoning it's it's a weird because because of the way the property line you know that the state line has moved over the years you know 100 years years ago it would it would have been a rad island problem and they and they would have had no problem because they would have had Frontage for it that's why need Frontage planning board in Westport grants those Frontage Lots all the time because R Island doesn't care as long as you can drive there as long as you can get there right okay now would be the the predominance of those lots uh be currently utilized for agricultural use I think not most of these are wooded now they're all there pasture walls all over through here probably was yeah and if you look back and I didn't bring a 38 photo if you look at the 38 photo they still used his pastur for up 78 there was I I cut down that lanway for for Smith it was after the Blizzard of 78 when things dried out and they couldn't get back there so we were getting stuck a lot but uh I mean there's obvious reason were some clear areas if 61 is going to get uh you know to mess it up even more legally one of those be on the chapter 61 I don't think that any CH uh the I believe the Milky Way farm and human governance pieces up and along there and that part of it and up along narrow Avenue uh Dean Martins and those are on 61a but they don't care about what's on that side of the line yeah they don't care I mean if we needed a release from this obviously the taxes are so small at this point in time because it's considered quote unquote unbuildable lot uh and the town's not going to buy it and and you don't think the land trust would buy it if they were continuous Land Trust would have any access to it except for a foot pack if it was contiguous with that will broke but um with low Farms is in between and I don't think the only the only one who would be interested in we Farms to buy it right but then they yeah you can't even have there's so much Wetland you can't cross it well I like I say there's no way a subdivision go here right conditions we say we look at in you know 2142 too like there's I mean as long as the line stays the same it would be hard to get a subdivision in here because we'd have to like if they just you know after the the rods have moved on they you know they have one house on a 24 AC lot that's a lot of houses you could put there but the chances of getting the permission through Michael's Lane which is probably partly Town owned to the private part of the rods to get a subdivision back there would be probably slim to none that's not NE so true not that that do any intent to do that if they built a 40ft way with drainage and all the other perance required we subdivision Road in the town of titon basically they could extend that road into Westport and have legal Frontage yeah yeah and and there are a couple of subdivision roads off raen Point Road that go into Little Compton if you go to uh Pon that's a a good example of a subdivision and go into both States and there's roads in both States and it's split by the state line all right but there' be a lot to get there because in the br oh no it would the BRS would have to give a 40 foot line way also the Michael's Lane would have to increase which maybe impinges on cil's property here if the concern is you know does this parcel want to put in a trailer park here and put a roadway in and do all kinds of again Tian had that concern because they would have say over well you're building a 40ft road and it's 24 pavement how many houses are you going to be on that road right right they have the same Duty planning board that the planning board in Westport would have to say maybe the RO Rodricks could put up a toll booth get the property but you in the beginning you said that they only wanted to put one house yeah and you would you would take a restriction to that yeah absolutely yeah there's no problem that's that's what I'm talking right yeah I mean but I'm I just to answer ait's question you could put a road a subdivision Road up into here and extend the culdesac in here and it would have legal Frontage on a Road in Westport I don't know how you would deny that yeah not but they have no intention of doing anything more than one house I don't want to go down that road and it it again then becomes the T would to get involved because then it's their Emergency Services T both planning boards would have to get involved it would be their Emergency Services servicing that and they may not be too Keen to that all right okay um I'd love a single family house in 24 Acres there's no other the discussion um attempted to close the hearing I'll make a motion to close the hearing we can still discuss it Ian that that that would then allow us to discuss it so I have a motion to close do I have a second second second all in favor say I I I'll oppose no all that means is that we're going to make a decision uh uh if we have questions we will ask it of you Mr Le otherwise uh uh Jerry you want to start start this off well I think the the first the first and obvious one is to restrict it to one single family house on that Fel yes and I I'm not really sure what else we can you know realistically do I mean it's a it's certainly a big and a partial for it to do anything so so what if they wanted to put an accessory apartment in place at some point they can because it's a matter of right right yeah they would have had right on tton also has the same right already has the same rights on the Adu yeah Massachusetts just passed a law right saying that now adus are are uh by right by right they clearly had the room I suppose we could also put uh that it would not be further subdivided yeah I think that's yes yes is there any issue with not subdividing that that that property okay this little guy doesn't want to piece for himself yeah but he might when he gets older house will okay look at after for that little guy's interest you may want to have a nice big house he's got a nice little track of ATV riding for 24 years well I suppose we should also condition that that they do provide and maintain at least a 20 foot um access you know for vehicle vehicle passage well B Bas on the plans that are submitted today yeah right yes uh the pl submitted today show that does it I think that's exhibit a I'm not sure we can actually do that because that's actually in I don't think you can right that's that's in that's in ti so TI is going to like so Ton's part has to put that restriction on because that's on their land Ton's land right the the access is that laneway is actually ined so we really can't put restrictions on that part of it not restrictions but conditions on it but um well how can we how can we assure ourselves that there will continue to be access for the Westport fire department and so forth if they if we don't say that they must I I I certainly believe that we can we can stipulate that they have uh that they have a 20 foot access because that's really what it is because we don't because the rout the access is actually in R Island which we have to we can stipulate that there is access to it right but I'm saying they also have to maintain it so that you know a year from now trees fall on it and but um I think that's we can't stipulation that's between the property owners we can't put stipulations on things that are r r Island yeah that's between the property owners so when and if the the property is separated from families then whoever is buying that lot is going to make sure there's a something appropriate in their deed for Access I mean obviously that that access road has to just not stop in the massach at the borderline it has to actually go into the property and service the property right obviously I mean single family houses so every driveway every mean change the driveway right I mean you kind of as much as you can but you'd be kind of crazy not to you know how would you get in and out how would anything get in know well the flash she he was going to go that way right but Idan would probably go first yeah he would call they'd still be responsible for the site Westport would be responsible for the S say that he was clear about that it's most likely it's going to have a TI address so then it really isn't I mean even though it's Westport we're technically responsible for the people here he did say that access is going to come from there it's going to go there the fact that the call is going to come from you know 27 or whatever Michael's Lane is you know it's going to it's going to be T it's going to end up in t right right which is right up the street anyway uh so uh can we it's a regular Street until the Rod's property it ends here the street and now the rod is providing an access an access road right but that's Dion's so we have a deed restriction for a single family dwelling uh the the only condition is is uh obviously it has to comply with the drawings that are supplied I mean they'll have to obviously they'll have to submit house plans to Ralph and we'll have to do an as buil plan that shows it Sidelines all the stuff that I mean the only septic system at the United septic system as required by the westf right those are all things that are H it's a weird all has it has to conform to our zoning laws of front not front except for Frontage setbacks uh and uh septic right that's all the stuff that Ralph is going to take care of yeah Tian has a very strict front yards headback they go they go 75 ft in this District yeah that's why this house is sitting where it is when we uh say single family dwelling I think we also should say an accessory uh uses or whatever a bond uh uh in accessory structure accessory dwelling whatever so structur it goes with it okay it does not mean another house right okay I think treating it as a single family house single family house basically really the same thing any single family house can put a garage on you can put a garage on it you can they put a barn up as long as to the space right I mean right you know I can't put a barn up because I don't got more space in my property okay uh any other any other comments no let's move any comments uh be proposing a motion go ahead uh I'll make a motion to Grant the variant for Jesse rodri and Kelly Rodricks from section 71 and 76 because the property elect Street in away is non forming lot the subject property is located at zero Sodom Road and is shown on the sucessor map 60 uh 11 right um in conjunction with the that are presented in front of the board today right and with theed restrictions that the hardship yes we we need to identify that the hardship is based on the government on the the government changing of of the state line which now makes his property inaccessible through yeah so move anything else and then just say restrictions you know again I think it's it's also in line with the the governor's request of right building more building more houses and this is also right yes I'm not sure we want to do a restriction on subdivisions I think that could complicate things I think if they want to subdivide they have to come back to us and we can still deny it and if we put a restriction on subdivisions you know 100 years from now be a little bit problematic well even then I mean technically if they have enough land to subdivide they could right right they have they still have to come back they' have to go to the thing planning board so I think I don't think we want if we do in 100 years from now we're all you know in in a restful place and westport's different they may want to and then they have to UND undo undo our little tie that we put in right right but we have the the right to deny a subdivision if they came before us two years from now right because somebody May pick up a bunch of ceg pars run a Road between Sodom and cran Rhoden right okay uh you have a motion you a motion do I have a second second second any discussion all in favor say I I all oppose no that's unanimous uh there's a 20-day waiting period uh Mr Lee again thank you for the uh history lesson I mean hopefully all things got screwed up by government well well that's not the first time you don't got to convince us about that part yeah well it's funny how Supreme Court took this important matter up in the middle of the Civil War y it was water it was very important yep hope everything out works out well for you all thank you okay the last order of business I guess what everybody is here for uh 1180 American Legion Highway applicant of mck LLC for a special permit to construct three additional storage buildings in the aquafer Protection District as mandated by zoning bylaw article 6 section 624c subject proper located at 1180 American Legion Highway Westport Mast and is shown on assessors map 28 lots 32f 32h and 32j uh those voting on it will be Jerry coutino uh Ray Elias myself Rog ar e and ktz and again once again process will be we'll let the applicant or the applicant's representative provide whatever information is available uh board members will then ask questions and then I will open it up to to the public uh before we start though um you know we've I've had several um well first of all I had uh uh an email from our town planner that says that uh you really need to get a uh a site plan uh we I'm sure you've seen the emails we've had emails from our lawyer saying it uh that really the Precedence is that you should be going through site plan permit first before you come from an ACA for protection because if you went to the ACA for protection now and we approved it and then you went to the site plan and they modified it you'd have to come back to us again for a modified act for protection so what they're suggesting is that you we continue this until the point when you have a site plan approval I I I wouldn't say withdraw just go through the site FR approval once that is approval we can continue this and and then uh and then work through the ACTA for protection that's the recommendation if I may attorney M long for the uh applicant here with Shan Lee also representative I spoke with Town Council ear today George pooie um and talked about you know our reasons for going the way that we did and making the application first first and foremost the cost of going through the planning board process is a lot higher and as you know you issue a special permit it's good for three years so we'd have three years to act on it the thing I wanted to state was when you said that if you grant us the special permit tonight and then we have to make any amendments under the planning board we'd have to come back not if we Grant the special permit tonight with conditions that state that we would have to require get you know that we would have to get site plan approval and also go before conservation so if you a plant approve the special permit contingent upon their subsequent approvals then we we can go forward no the the the scope of your Authority according to the bylaws states that you're looking at this for the use yes and the use alone and that the plan um we are looking for how you affect the aquifer yes now if you go to the site plan and they require you to make a change that affects how it affects the aquifer then you come back to us okay I mean we we could do then we could just amend the special permit at that point the biggest reason for us was we do not not want to go before the planning board get everything done go through site plan review third party Consultants etc etc etc get all of that and then come back before the board at that point and and get a no yeah but we so make our decision without that information you you can we can't you have the authority and I did confirm that with Town Council yes yes I reviewed I reviewed that in our bylaws that that Fe L well actually there is a clause in there that I was reading and six something uh page 36 I believe yeah okay okay where's maybe 36 it was aquifer protection section starts on page 40 40 that's what I thought and then goes to page 45 okay um it goes through all the you know you can't store pesticide all that kind of good stuff all the all the list okay section c says the uses set forth below are permitted within the act for protection by by special permit only and are subject to the approval of the granting Authority which is his own inv Bo of appeals with And Then There are a list of things underneath that that that are required all commercial and Industrial activities permitted in the underlying District after site plan review that demonstrates compliance with requirements of this section so it says in there specifically that we do this after site plan review okay if I may yes this entire section name addressor I'm sorry SE Le Northeast Engineers representing I'm working with uh the applicant uh the the language that you're reading was drafted before there was an actual site plan review uh requirement at the planning board the site plan review at that time when this act for protection district was passed was what's stated here what needs to be on the plan for you make your determination so it doesn't mean I know it says site plan review but they're meaning site plan review under your purview that's in this bylaw you're reading it as site plan review as opposed to the planning I I highly recommend you change the wording at some point to reflect however you want it to be the Zoning Board of appeal doesn't do a site plan review it does initially under this under this bylaw before there was a site plan review at the planning board planning board does that no prior to oh prior to and this is just I'm just reading the words here I mean it's it's a site plan that complies with the the this section of the bylaw meaning that we comply with and have the plan submitted per just because the that language that was in our bylaws before we had planning board site plan review it's the planning board that changes our bylaws not us we make recommendations so the fact that they decided not to change the bylaws to take that out of our purview or I think it was intentionally they left it there because it originally it was our site plan review but when they did subsequently do planning board site review they decided to keep the language because it worked because it they were still the intent was out the the planning board site review the way I would read it and there's no doubt and we're not trying to do an end round or anything of that there's no doubt we know we have to go to planning board for site plan review for their third party and all and that is that is planning to be submitted next Tuesday right Tuesday on Tuesday October 8th 10th right 8th 8th okay October 8th that that's in in completely intended to be done and it's actually sted on the plan that we shall meet we shall have to meet the requirements of the Westport planning board and all their requirements for site plan approval M so you a meeting with them on site an approval on on the a no no no no we're submitting our application we wanted to do this first we spoke with Ralph we I've spoke with the planner earlier today he in the email that we were both CC Donnie stated that there fine either way the planning the town planner said that he's okay if you grant the special permit and then we go forward with our site plan review and and at that point we're going you know that's where they're going to have their third party consultant review the you know Hydro CAD model and all the calculations and the drainage plan and all of those things because that's on on their end and we have to comply with the aquafer protection standards which as it states on the plan we fully intended this was in front of well this was discussed last night at the planning board and it wasn't a unanimous vote saying well this is what they have to do actually uh one of the I think Manny s Manny s spoke up and said doesn't it make sense this was entirely doable he actually said that I've done other types of special permits in other towns and typically we get the special permit first because if if you go through all of this as I mentioned before you go through all the site plan approval pay for all the things do all of that and then you ultimately say no it's a waste of time but why would we if you if all the other because it's within your purview if you if you wanted to I mean I'm not saying that you would but if you chose to we would have wasted all of this time money and energy so versus doing it this way we get the thumbs up from you guys we can go to the planning board and say they like what we're doing here now we have to comply with their plans their requirements just be advised there is the there is a possibility that if they require you to make changes yeah significant amendments if if there's an amendment that has any impact whatsoever on the on on on a potential aquifer you're going to have to reapply to to this board for any for any as a whole new a whole the special permit would be know void at that point the one we issu if we issued that because it was a change because one of the thing one of the conditions that we would put on is uh based on the plan submitted if the plans are changed then that nullifies the the uh the permit you could you could put the condition to be major components of the plan yeah that's a that's a tough one because who who who determines that yeah I I understand I think I think you know one of the reasons and this is part of the problem with you know who has whose jurisdiction is what over what part of this I mean there's specific language in here of what you have to show on the site plan for your approval and there obviously very specific things and the site plan approval at the planning board which are actually more stringent than on yours so the possibility of them having a less protective uh part of this Aqua for is highly highly unlikely because one of the things that weren't considered even when this bylaw was drafted was the 200 foot Riverfront uh the all the wetlands 25 foot no activity all these other things that are not mentioned here you know I that's actually the reason why I would say we should do it after because if you say that our our our level stency is less than the planning board that I would assume that if the planning board and the conservation committee would approve it we would have no we would really have no basis to not approve it you well could say you could say that the use the use is not is not approved by under 6.2 we're here for the for the use and the procedures under this exact bylaw 6.2 um the procedures for a special issuance of a special permit special permit granting Authority being the you know Bo of appeals shall Grant a permit only Upon A findings that the proposed use does not pose an actual or potential threat or material damage to groundwater quality and that all adverse impacts to groundwater and disturbance of natural vegetation have been avoided or minimized to the maximum extent reasonably practicable I think that we can demonstrate that with the plan that we have I I have no problem what are you going to store there it's it's household storage but sometimes you have Cars and Cars have oil and cars Le oil well we're yeah we we can get into all I have no problem you know if you want to continue with this I'm I'm fine with it but the exact this to to that exact point exactly what you just asked is a perfect example of why if we go before the planning board and get that approval and get all of that and then come before you and you have concerns it changes everything yeah but but they would also have the same concerns they're going to have their purviews less and has less to do with the aquafer and more to do with the site plan itself in words parking access you know grading Etc I agree I mean we're zoned commercial here and the commercial District allows certain things that aren't allowed in the aquafor Protection District no I I get I get all okay I mean because we're trying to figure out if you say no we think this is a overburdening of the aquafer with these buildings as proposed and the access lanes that we're proposing we we would go back modify and then we know okay you only want a you know a dog house here that's all we're allowed to put so that's what we'd have to do we'd have to come back with plan and showed that right so it's hard to go to the planning board and say we know we can meet the aqu Protection District we think because zba said well we'll decide when planning boards decide it's kind of you know it's kind of like well do we wait for the board they don't look at they don't look at how it affects the ground water they look at oh no conservation does but but they're not really don't it ABS absolutely they look at that because M uh one more the guidelines require you to look at that require you to infiltrate require you to have separation in the groundwater right just like the Board of Health with the new accepted septic system requires you to protect the aquifer also okay so why why don't you go ahead and continue on with your your presentation there's a whole bunch of I mean and I I'm assume you have't front of you requirements for how you are going to mitigate U or or protect the aquifer which is what we're here for why don't you go ahead and describe how you're going to do that okay so uh again Sean Le Northeast Engineers representing uh the long the applicants this is an overview of the property as most people know it's the old St George school if we've been here long it's the old St George School which has been turned into a storage facility and they're looking to expand it by adding three buildings to the storage facility semi in the footprint and meet the requirements of the aquafer Protection District and that's all mentioned in the notes that are on the plan that we will meet the requirements of 6.2 pointb which is the prohibited items obviously if we're prohibited we can't do it and also uh everything else that goes with that including meeting the requirements of the site plan of the planning board so what we're proposing are three buildings this kind of an overview I kind of blew up the section of what we're doing around the existing School what's happening is there are going to be three buildings 8250 ft to 6,000 ft buildings with they're going to get rid of the existing gravel driveway provide an access road here to and from the buildings to use as storage units some of this building will be taking up the existing impervious area we are increasing the impervious area and as required under the Acer Protection District we have required to infiltrate all the water that we take from these new buildings into the ground itself as part of the aquer prote can identify in there uh what area is covered under aquifer protection the entire parcel the entire parcel the entire Parcels in the a protection okay additionally we we have this laid out to meet other parameters that would we know we would have to meet one is everything out of the 200 foot Riverfront area everything out of the 25t no activity Zone that the Conservation Commission requests and again meeting the infiltration requirements of all the storm water runoff over time and a low impact development because we're below the required area to mandate a low impact B but we're still doing it Anyway by using grass whales and siment removal techniques before the infiltration and before anything gets anywhere near the wetlands that's what's being proposed this is what's being asked for the use itself again is storage there are concerns about storage because you never know what somebody might do everything but there are restrictions that can be put on for the storage of the property that meet the requirements of the restri with the storage facility as it is that there's no hazardous materials being stored just to add that into there we show the existing topography this is a weaponless line that was flagged by a biologist uh all these things will have to be accepted obviously by the planning board by the Conservation Commission the existing septic system there is an existing septic system for the school which is humongous because it was a school obviously that's being abandoned to a new uh septic system that only requires the amount of uh sewage for a warehouse facil facility which is like 5 gallons per th000 square fet as as opposed to you know 500 students being in in the school itself so we're actually reducing the impact of a septic system now by moving it and modernizing it and we're infiltrating as required under the aqua protection isue we must infiltrate because we are above the 15% coverage uh it's pretty obvious is existing but it we're allowed to do this under the guys that we can put everything into the back into the ground that comes off this site it's very good soils before you I'm trying to just catch up on yep uh years ago it was was the school right and then it took it over for storage yeah but at that point you didn't come for an act for protection because it was under a percentage limit was ex no new uh percentage increase in in no changes to the struct change the footprint no it's an it's allowed use under the zoning bylaws but we weren't change nothing was changed on the existing footprint as far as pavement yeah boy that's you know that's really stretching it because aquiver protection for school has got to be a lot different than aqu I mean I would have been worried back then that you have all the storage things who knows what stuff you're storing in there it could you know and that would affect the aquafer could you address that so I I can there was a concern that I had uh and I mention it to you uh uh you don't know who's bringing what in there but you told me something very different you're not like a regular stor we're not like a traditional storage facility here whereas you have a rollup door people show up at any hours of the night and put whatever they want in there our facility is run on a strict basis we're open 9:00 to5 Monday through Friday 9: to2 on Saturdays every single person that comes into our facility is Led in by an attendant an attendant stays on the site with them at all times while they move all of their things in and our own contract for the storage facility requires no hazardous materials no gasoline none of the things that would be a concern are ever to W be in there no are now well the the cars in the parking lot that are parked there where the par where is the parking lot on this plan the it's the existing pavement to the left hand side of the the West that was existing pav yes that was existing pavement that was there for the last you know the building was erected in 1960 and it handled cars being parked there every day for students you know throughout the year for all of this time so and we're not asking to increase the parking area or anything to that effect we are strictly building three storage buildings that will be used for household storage alone so that and again I can't stress enough that there will not be any hazardous materials one of the problems I have with this is we have to look for the future yep you say you're going to do a good job and I'm sure you will you saw what the Joe show down the street and he says put anything you want want in there how do we manage that I mean we could put it as a condition on the approval of the special permit record that with the registry of deeds and if they don't adhere to that then you have the full authority to go after them you know full Authority law that's putting a lot of money on the town that we don't have to well that's yes I mean it's okay anyway that's one of the concerns I have here is is that you know you run a great operation you make sure okay that's that's fine but we have to look for the life of of that property and and making sure that the Acer is protected no matter who goes in there so uh so I have to we have to be worried about that I think we recently did similar to this we within the last year or well yeah Silverback construction which is located at Cheryl's way just they had hazardous commit they have concrete forms and and they're parking trucks inside and and all of that I I think that they you know we went through an awful lot with them of how we're going to mitigate it I have the minutes for both of them viewed them through and through I don't think that any of the concerns that you had for them for them apply to us we're not you know storing any of the same things you know and as I said the vehicles that are there stored there currently are typically they RVs a lot most RVs and boats are the standard we have a few vehicles and and honestly it'll be completely transparent with the board if it made you feel better that we don't put any Automobiles and limit it strictly to recreational vehicles and you know boats I don't think we'd have a problem with that you know I I I'd be open to something to that effect and you know we could put that on as a special condition I think if we if we condition the hours and the attendance that he we just adhere to our own policies you know that's in our conditions I think we're protecting ourselves uh for the future that the next operator would have to do the same because to me that's a big deal I I want to hear more what's going to happen to this water that's all over the place okay so currently I mean there's a p there's it's paved and it goes out to Forge Road uh the water flows very nicely south to North actually away uh until it get to a point where it flows towards the river and there's a wetland system about 100 ft wide between uh the what is the West River coming out of Lake nooke and the uh edge of the river bank which is not very wide at that particular location the requirement it says you have to infiltrate all the storm water runoff on site that so we're increasing this thing like I said by this amount of area we have to infiltrate that because it's part of the conditions under the act for protection you go above the 15% the only way you can get a special permit is by infiltrating all the water back into the ground that you're creating well creating well that doesn't infiltrate by itself so that's what this has to do we have to meet that requirement now the planning board consultant will be the one who says yeah they are meeting it cuz we're going going to run the modeling and everything and say okay we need this x amount of square feet the fortunate thing about this area as I told along it's this is pretty much all gravel so it infiltrates very easily the bad news is because it's gravel you have to have 5 foot separation between the infiltration and the groundwater itself that's how the storm water standards protect the acao in other words every it's it's certain types of soils that require a certain amount of Separation so there isn't a comingling of groundwater with water that's being infiltrated storm water the treatment for the storm water is required you're supposed to take out 90% of all of everything that's flowing off site all the sediment grass clippings whatever may have you so that's going to be done with grass whales and vegetated buffer strips before the ponds trap everything we have a similar situation down at the handy house same thing it takes care of all that and so 90% of what's in the storm water runoff which is usually in the first inch of rainfall will be taken out and then when it go infiltration none of that will reach the alaer that's what's required under the Bots what's required the massachusett storm water standards it's what's required in the site plan review I also think it's notable to point out that the land that we are working on here is all open grassland yeah this is we're not taking down any Treese line the tree line is the wet that's where the playground is uh well the playground is where that infiltration Pond would be so this the two buildings are directly in front closest to 17 77 as you can see here so those two on you've already excavated we we prepared the site pad it's about as far as it's gone so and then that rear building is is the next phase but you know we want to get the approval all simultaneously last night's planning board meeting they they came up with you guys were already doing too much and and and Ralph was actually mentioned uh maybe we should take this to Ralph well they they stopped uh there was some work being done to the front of the property but it it was stopped right away as soon as we were notified that when I notified Mr long that it was in an act for protection he stopped nothing went any further and that was what triggered us the Machinery came off the property everything came off the property triggered it to come here originally that we were going before the planning board we had everything geared to go towards the planning board Sean and I have been working on this for well over a year at this point and we came to the discovery that we were in the aquafer UN you know unannounced to us it was a mistake absolutely but as soon as we found that out we pivoted and came before and made an application to come before the board because of the fact that we were in the aquafer that was and we felt that we needed this as I mentioned before the special permit prior to moving forward with any other plans because of the concerns and everything else you know we wanted to address the board and and answer those questions and make sure that but you were going to do this without a site plan what do you mean with all the stuff that you're doing there you were going to do it without a site plan approval absolutely not well then why didn't you apply to them well because we were in the process of finalizing the plan for the the only building it all already all that has been done is grading there's only been grading there's nothing else there it's been prepared there's no found there's no foundations all the time no it it we prepared grade as we were moving towards the planning board I mean as you all know the winter comes in and you know we're on tight control construction deadlines and had everybody lined up we didn't realize that there was an aquafer here or we were within the district and as soon as we were we pivoted we would have been before we were on par to go before the planning board in August but as soon as we realized we were in the aquafer completely changed our plans okay because of the fact that we have to infiltrate 100% of the water because of the change and you know all of the concerns that come along with being in the aquifer so we were just you know preliminarily grading the site for those two front pads we haven't done anything in the you know northeast corner over there again that was all open grassland before so there isn't really been anything um actually part of the storage building is going to be over what is existing pavement right now uh and one of the other concerns to come here tonight in regards to this as you want to hear I'm sure they want to say the abutters and concerns and things that we can or cannot address or may address very easily absolutely uh the concerns because it's something we can incorporate in the site plan rather than coming here and hearing two different things they would be notified I believe most of I don't know who's here but most people who would be notified a site plan review also to express concerns but the concern would be you know if if they you came here you had the site plan and all sudden somebody wanted to appeal it you could have easily taken care of it before the before before you got to that point public comment so you rather you're trying to get the public comment ahead of time yes because and your comments as well from the board get the input on that so if we were have approved this with conditions pending approval for site plan review planning I would condition it more Broad and just say what if there are there is there a minimum like is there well we're going to make this small change here would that if they asked us to decrease I would look at that this way any increase in impervious area would be a condition that you would put that we would have to come back to this because it would be more detrimental more detrial the plan they said no you can't put this 82 100 foot building here and we had to remove it from the whole site plan whatsoever I don't see how that impacts what your decision would be for the impact obviously I was just only asking that no no that but that's our that's our thought here is that if you approve it as we see the only thing the planning board is going to do like we're already at the strictest level possible we're saying we are infiltrating 100% of the water we are doing everything that we possibly can to comply with the bylaw so if the planning board comes back and says you need to change this or that it would just be a red reduction in the size of whatever we're doing we can't it is impossible for us to go any further with the infiltration with the groundwater with all of those things so any conditions that you put upon that would be an addition and and if the planning board comes along and says well you need to add this this and this or we have public comment and that changes AB C and D it's all going to be in the other direction as opposed we cannot go more detrimentally you know we're essentially coming before you with a maximum plan and if we have to step it back we will but we wanted to come before you with everything okay and then back off from there can you run through uh the uh the special permanent requirements in in the aquifer Protection District okay there's a bunch of things that say you know you can't start pesf all that so under all the thing under the use regulations right under the use regulations uh this is obviously it's not obvious I shouldn't say that this is use that is permitted in the offer Protection District providing you meet all the standards on the 6.2 pointb which I've rather than listed everyone individually on the plan I just made a caveat statement on this plan that says we will meet all the requirements of 6.2 pointb as listed in the zoning bylaw we good now tell me how you're going to do that well basically because okay for instance you go for each one if you want to go through each one y the manufacturer use disposal of toxic materials that's not going to happen and how do you manage that as he mentioned before this is a household storage and they have attendance that will be monitoring it okay I mean we're also not a manufacturing facility yeah we're not okay and if that was to become a thing it we have to require a change of use which would therefore require and then they would have perview at that point to make comments I think further down you're going to be that's where you're going to your concerns are going to come in further into this list so I'll get to that Sean excuse me but you just pointed out a minute ago about you you put that U cave uh where is it it's on the in the notes okay uh performance with the section 6.2.4 used regulations of the town of Westport bylaws okay just 6.2.4 well the next one down is all development must meet the requirements of plan board all new development this is number one shall meet 6.2.5 right all the requirements of the special permit yeah so it's not all of 6.2 it's just well .24 is a b and c which is 6.2.4 is is is our job 6.2.5 is a site plan job yes right right there's two different sections here and we're saying we're going to meet those requirements rather I mean we could have listed everything there be shell no it's easier just list oh you could have said 6.2 and everything yeah I guess we could have because uh one of the things about 6.2 is there are allowances that if you meet like for instance if you go over 15% and you have to meet this requirement and that will be determined by the consultant at the planning board actually so we will and that will be on the site plan review so we're trying to cover all the basic here if you want us to add a note or be more specific on the note I don't have a problem with that you want us to keep going goad okay sorry okay so where we up number two car wash car washes laundry mats junkyard storage disposal Solid Waste obviously we're not running there's not going to be a landfill here there's not going to be a storage of the hazardous waste of that type of things storage of animalur I don't know if you even need to go any further on that one we there's no animals going to be here storage of commercial fertilizers uh within a structure design to prevent generation some of these have caveats where you can do it if you meet this the nrcs guidelines or you meet the guidelines required under D has its waste rules which I would recommend that you take those out at some point in the future but you you can meet those that's why we're saying let's just meet all of them rather than specifics uh removal of soil LOM gravel or dirt within 4T of the historical High groundwater that's not going to happen uh can't happen because on the storm water guid lines and everything you have to go through the Board of Health and other things to do such a thing that's not being planned these are on slab grade they're not foundations and the groundwater was determined at 76 in which is basically 6 Fe 3 in in the ground okay so that would be a heavy excavation so that's not being planned uh but it does allow you know 40 5 4 ft ex installation of utility Works roadway construction so utilities if we were doing water lines would have to be 4 feet in the ground for frost I don't think that's the plan this is a storage facility not a restaurant or something along those lines so uh impervious cover of any lot and this is the 15% rule including building structures driveways parking areas gravel areas parot Etc that exceed 15% of land area or 2500 ft which is greater obviously we're above that uh uh unless a system for artificial recharge of prec precipitation is provided and that will not sight result in the degradation of groundwater quality and exempting land primarily used for agricultural Horticultural purposes well it's not agricultural Horticultural purposes but that's what we're doing we're infiltrating the precipitation from the site as required under that section of the bylaw about because we're above 15% we're above 15% pre-existing before the uh bylaws even passed sewage treatment facilities with the exception of individual sewage Disposal Systems we already have approval for a new system which is about 15 times smaller than the one that was for the school that was obviously more detrimental that type of flow actually within the 200t riverfront area within 100 foot buffer within the 25 foot no activity Zone stockpiling disposal of snow or removes highways and streets on site of the O protect that contains sodium chloride calcium chloride chemically treated so so we can't use chemical treatments other than sand on this site for ice and snow removal we can't you can't store it if right you can't store a giant Pile in a giant ConEd building uh truck or bus terminals it's not a truck or bus terminal disposable of solid waste with the exception of brush and stumps which I think should be removed but that's something else but that's not planned obviously storage of liquid hazardous materials as defined in the Mass General loss chapter 21e and we're all familiar with 21e and the monitoring of environmental monitoring that's required uh except you know so none of that's being planned and it would be monitored Again by the applicant storage of liquid petroleum products of any kind except those incidental to normal household use and outdoor maintenance of the heating of a structure which means I guess you can have an under you can have an underground oil tank or propane tank but you can't have which we don't put that out there no underground storage tanks industrial uses that discharge processes again this is not a manufacturing or industrial facility so we're not going to be doing that floor Drainage Systems discharging to the environment there will be no floor drainage systems on this and not required storage of road salt this goes back to the deicing and the plowing so all those conditions are being met and stated for in that in that note on the plan as far as section c uh the uses set forth under the special permit only are subject to the approval of the the granting Authority that would be you obviously such conditions that they may attach to their approval and subject to section 5.2.4 all commercial industrial activities permitted in the underlying dist District this is permitted in the underlying District a storage facility all such commercial industrial users may be constructed and operated in such a manner as to discharge waste water except normal sanitary waste to subsurface Disposal system so basically we're just using the amount of flow from a half a dozen employees on the site is very limited as opposed to 500 students that were there previously uh replacement Rehabilitation modification of pre-existing non-conforming uses just which is what this is in accordance with Section 5.2 of the Westport zoning bylaws we do meet required zoning use and so we're allow allow to do that with the special perier granting Authority you shall not Grant an approval unless it shall find that such expend shall not increase the risk to contamination of groundwater so we have to show to you that we are not increasing or anything detrimental to the aqu for protection or any other resource area on the site basically uh and that is the plan and that will be determined by two things one the Conservation Commission has to look at this that will be basically after all the calculations everything because they don't have a a consultant to look at all the storm water grant the application fee the that the applicant will give to the planning board they will look at all these things and they will make recommendations or say they don't meet it or they do meet it at that time that's when the planning board will approve it because it does meet the requirements of the site plan review which is basically Echoes and mirrors these requirements here and they can put special conditions on it also you know they can say you have to paint the building's blue or something uh it they have the ability to do that because it is a special permit on their end also uh I don't know if we want to go any further and that's it okay so you're upgrading the you're upgrading setic system it's a Well upgrading downg upgrad is downgrading because you're going from 500 person flow to about a half a dozen person flow so you're going into a setic system that basically is probably 30 by 50 to a you know 9 by 20 I mean in terms of aquafer we're upgrading in that regard I mean it's a lot it's a brand new system and so it's you're putting in a brand new system brand new system approved by the Board of Health that's there needs to be denitrification no because it's an existing um It's actually an upgrade and you're actually putting less nitrogen in the ground because the existing system which was built some 60 years ago yeah 1960 is probably sitting in the groundwater MH I don't know that for sure we haven't dug it up but I would almost bet the ground determination if there only 722 ft down yeah it might not be I shouldn't make it as but it's probably closer NE close because at that point when they put the system in the these regulations weren't in effect there was no there was no sanitary bylaws at all in the state of Massachusetts in 1960 you can do what you want the system was put in in the 70s as far as I know but oh upgraded it when uh and Lenny Potter was actually the one that put it in so so this will meet all the requirements of Title Five which we feel is up and obviously 100 times smaller so it's an upgrade in that way we're not trying to say that that makes up for adding 30 2,000 ft of additional area but that will be made up by the infiltration of the water as required all right so you're going to be uh having a two big areas that are now going to be imper they're going to be build building yeah basically so can you can you go back into DET detail about how you're going to manage the uh the storm water okay so I mean I know you talked about it but all right so highway is the highest point on the site everything flows actually off the highway this is elevation 61 6059 58 57 56 flows in this direction okay and towards this direction because obviously the West for river which is over here drains the whole you know catch B uh subbasin of drainage you know the not late nool which is artificially created uh and this Wetland system that's around it that we can't touch uh takes in account all the storm water that runs off this site currently right now what you have to do before or while you're doing or while you're doing development and after the development is your post-development flow has to be reduced by 20% over your pre-development flow so there actually be less water coming off the proper site into these Wetland areas on top of it will be infiltrating it all right what about the other way what about the other side nothing's going to change on the flow this way we're directing all the material all right now everything can goes this way and there's no controls whatsoever I'm not going to push any water that way no we're not pushing any water that way it's all coming this way only the newer only the new proposed stuff and anything to the east of the school which already naturally flows East there's which will be caught by both basins yeah there's a number of roof drains that just spill out onto the ground right now and every one of these little RDS you see on the plan that go all around basically are just spilling out of the ground with no treatment whatsoever okay so what's going to happen with them and at the then the new buildings with the existing roof drains or the ones no the with your new proposal how is all this water going to be going to be managed it's going to go into two it's all going to be pitched into the uh infiltration uh area ponds they're open Pond you say you're going to it's so you're going to have a catch pond or you going to have yeah it's almost like a A detention Pond you see detention ponds these are not detention ponds infiltration ponds you have to infiltrate a basically a storm event over the Thursday within 24 hours so within 24 hours you go from I don't know let's say it's 3 ft of water to zero mhm and it goes down it doesn't overspill now if there's a 500e storm you have to have a requirement to over spill into the existing swell like everything else does you're not going to be able to INF rate 8 and a half inches in three hours right right and all the storm drains go where from the buildings so all they're all going to be directed towards the INF they're all going to be directed towards the catch Basin yes this water that comes off here will be will continue to go run off here everything that now spills off in the school those roof drains all on this side will be coming heading towards in this direction okay so you route those no we're the ones on the west side will remain as they are and follow the current flow but anything on the easterly border which already pitches to the east because the only the only way to fix that would be to raise this grade two feet and you couldn't really do that and then we're disturbing the pavement and all of that which we would rather not do the requirement is offsite drainage must be 20% reduced from predevelopment post development right right right so they ponds they hold a bunch of water right and then they slowly drain they' go straight into the ground so it's do good it's not running directly into the river isn't it getting there eventually anyway it's being I don't want to think I don't and I'm just asking for curiosity not for well what's happening is you know along these things there's grass swes that you know with check dams that stop the sediment from accumulating at the bottom of the pond and therefore making them noninfective uh yeah it's going into the water just like it is now if water falls on this grass right now it goes It goes right into the ground right we're just directing water that comes off here now untreated just goes right now it just goes wherever it wants to go I don't know if it's trickling through there's no controls coming off here there's number of roof drains that like I said just fill onto the pavement and that just goes somewhere M untreated mhm well our requirement under this bylaw and the massachusett stor water standards is to treat all that stor right you treat it so that it uh it infiltrates down through the ground and right so it's the whole idea it's not for a recharge District you want to recharge the oer right I have a comment are you all set with the water pot yeah um my my concern uh in your existing storage facilities uh you told me it's going to be operated the same way 9 to5 uh and so forth um do does the U Clerk or whoever you want what do you call your tenant yeah we call them an attendant yeah the attendant okay are they trained in any way to to recognize uh what we have yeah we have policies and procedures that in place for every new attendant you know and and how they intake a customer what they can store I mean when we take in a new customer first thing they do do is go over you know what we can store there it's right in our contract you know limiting what can be stored there something that came to my mind when we were sitting here is I mean if if we want to be extra thorough which makes sense in this situation we could put a sign right when you drive in that none of no no no no no just to be even additionally thorough you know and put that out there it's like saying don't go above 45 million yeah I know well well we can only do you know do do what are going to do the fact that man from 9 to5 you don't have people living in there like absolutely not no and we're different than any other facility in the area as far as I know there are everybody else is a 24-hour access one up on uh gated facility it's not currently I mean we've tossed around the idea of gating it but again the facility itself is locked there's no way to get in and and the only people that have 24-hour access are the you know people with RVs and boats and things like that so they can get in and out with their trailers but that's the outside of that you can't get into the building the crossroad storage is like that but they have gate they have gate a little one on we have a gate at our our main facility you have to I don't think you can get in from outside yeah it's small they're small comp on 177 our our main facility at 519 is gated yeah that all those buildings are gated from your point of view what's the benefit or not benefit of gating it um I mean it's it's an added security it keeps out anybody that doesn't belong but in terms of security with the buildings I mean we have 32 cameras monitoring at all times I can pull them up on my phone and show you right now I mean constantly there's alarm almost makes it like oh it's gated what do I want to get in yeah it does kind of I want to get in there versus like oh it's not gated I'm going to walk around there not for exactly you know the only thing the only benefit to the gate is you know keeping out people that don't have a key to the gate outside of that you know but in terms of getting up to the facility I mean I'll be we'll be completely honest when we bought the facility in 20 19 or 2020 um we had a problem with break-ins and so we immediately just from like neighboring you know whatever people coming in and uh immediately put up cameras changed the lighting system you know upgraded everything and knock on wood it's been great ever since so I mean we we're we pride ourselves on being very secure very you know highend storage facility from my point of view you don't feel that it's necessary to that as a condition in terms of of the aquifer and that I don't think it has much of a benefit in that I mean if it would make the board feel more comfortable we we did talk about doing it at some point but you know haven't needed it at this point you know but what also say stop Wildlife it would no you know excuse me wait minute backet you're not no we're not doing public yet yeah it's used I mean a fence would keep Wildlife from walking across which isn't good detriment yeah well he's saying is the only gate is on the on the side of the north North portion of this which goes up to unav that's the only part that's gated there's rocks on both sides I mean we have no intention of ever using that portion of the property um it's just pre-existing but you know is most of the storage people who store by the month or is it a lot of your storage through your moving company where you're storing the moving company is actually not correlated with us it's a relative okay but uh no I mean typ most of our clientele are a monthly basis I mean our contracts are monthly basis and even anybody that moves in with the moving company is on a monthly basis so no nobody I mean the long term in the sense of some people keep their stuff there for a while but nothing we're not signing a fiveyear lease or anything like that I I just have a curiosity question um I'm where is the river the that's not nooke how do you say that nooke yeah so that is nooke yeah it it basically it's a strange thing so you obviously you know where Lake nooke is on Route 6 with the Confluence of 177 and the bend on Route 6 the real bend on Route Six right where under that road Dam there's a dam right right so that flows under the road that's just immediately up UPG gradient of this and then there's that building where the um it's not titled yeah I'll tell you that it's where the billboard is on Route Six where they just changed all of that that water flows through the woods in here under 177 and then eventually gets into the Westport River which is why I mean it is there's actually an approved uh detention Pond right there on the corner of 177 Route 6 that was allowed that did not infiltrate and dumped straight into the river and you said that and it's owned by Fall River I mean how it water the water RS of Lake nooke they loan they own everything above one foot above the elevation of the dam and they have a water line that runs up Route Six there's a pump house right on the corner brick municipal building it's supposed to send the water up into Fall River should they needed it for an emergency they never used it but they own the rights there was another water grab by the wow we they own the water rights one foot above the bank from here all the way to the head of Westport the river Westport River wow okay by uh titom Brothers by Forge pond that's all owned by the city of for yeah this is just further Upstream of where Toom that's why you see you see the bank of the river and we're showing a line one foot off the bank of the river as the prop quote unquote property line they took all these things from unn know people uhhuh now in your existing storage facilities do you uh is there any inspection by the fire department or anything like that that I mean happens well so ironically fire department used to practice uh for fires in the storage facility a lot of the time because they shuttle the lights off and could practice using the cameras and things it hasn't happened in a few years but I mean we do have regular fire inspections uh Lieutenant brisk has been made aware of these plans he's seen these plans um what do you mean by regular fire inspe that's what it matters was that you or me um you I mean they like annually have to certify you I mean we don't h no we don't have any annual requirement to do so um but you know everything is is up to date in terms of you know we do our own but you know what I thought where I thought you were going with that question was inspections I'll go one step further and say that we do inspect all of our units on a on a that's on an annual basis I'm looking but by inspecting you open them up and see what's in them y double check make sure that they're not storing things like gas lawnmowers things of that extent we do that on a on either six-month or annual basis yeah Ral yeah this scps an Su grp the building code doesn't require an annual inspection for this but it you the if well like you'd have a lot of angry I mean I know that they're you're not responsible for it but you'd have a lot of angry customers if that oh absolutely yeah well again you know that's why we are double-checking and going in there on a regular basis and making sure people aren't you know doing that's where the issue with a 24-hour facility is that turnover and people in and out you know someone lights up a cigarette standing in the hallway we that's why our attendants are on the premises at all times to avoid things like that and this these new buildings are a little different than the ones that we have up the street right now those they're metal on the outside but those are wood framed these are all steel construction so they're even you know of a higher fire rating so you uh you have a way to make sure that people aren't living in those absolutely they have to be in by five and can't get out until no and you're everyone is signing in signing out being led into their unit their unit's locked by the attendant the attendant is leaving the premises with them you know so people are not left should we open it up the audience any other questions I'll open it up to the public so anybody want to come up name and address not a speaker in front of anybody so bear with me name and address name and address excuse me excuse me excuse me John M can you speak into the mic and your name and address John Maduras 44 Union Avenue okay this is my property here okay I'm sorry I'm hot of hearing so um this retention Pond here how close is it to my property line it it's required to be at least 10 ft off the property line 10 ft do you realize this is all Wetland yeah there's Wetland that goes how deep is this going to be the way it's sized right now it's about uh 25 by 50 how deep 2 and 1/2 ft deep 2 and 1/2 ft yes that's going to hold off that's going to hold all this runoff from these roots it's going to infiltrate the runoff yes I don't think that's going to hold it it's going to hold it to a certain point in other words it starts infiltrating as soon as starts raining then it's going to then it's going to flood my property no it's not going to flood that section of the property is already Wetlands anyway yeah this section that portion of the property is Wetlands to begin with but what Sean's saying is any overl to it I mean the intention the intention of the retention Pond or infiltration chamber is to flow like this size roof that's going to overlow how was the build up that's going to overflow 2 and2 ft is not going to be enough this is all wet land so all this water is going to overflow into my property that's not your property yes it is that section this section is their property if it overflows yes it is this this portion I have a block I should have brought it this is you here right along this line all the way down then it comes down it comes down here see this this is us I I mean we're we're standing here with the engineer that did this survey they're they're closed right yeah they're closed yeah I you have a question I mean I I should have brought my plan well because I had a survey I got a survey plan yeah and the school also has a survey plan and this is straight off M Mr L listen I know this prop Mr L bought an AC off of me who to sell to the school so they could increase the leeching field which is here no the leeching field is here it's here in the back right here and then this was the school and then they had that was the whatever you want to call it the basketball yeah the gymnasium then you added all these little things there and these things on St George uh closed it down they then they was somebody else yeah they rented it for a while I don't think they bought it but I'm not sure but anyway regardless my this is my my property goes at an angle it it doesn't I'm positive I I'm just as positive as that it doesn't I'm not trying to be an argumentative 47 years this property's been there since 1960 and before that I know but the the plan and everything is has been in existence long before okay can we can we all right time out time out that's a site plan problem not an aqua for protection problem okay so what you really need to do is you need to when they go in front of the of the planning board for for this project you need to be there with your plans W with your with your deed to show property lines if you if you don't believe they're proper lines that's the time I know for fact it doesn't go straight well that's the time that you bring this up is at the at the site plan review I think there's a little confusion as to I I don't disagree that it doesn't go straight all the way across the river it comes down in the angle point at the river and he owns on on the other side I think that's where maybe some of his I don't want anything beyond the stream the stream goes all the way along this is the assessor map over here and it shows you not owning that so once again that's that's not an aqua for protection that's a site plan review so I'm still concerned what's going to go in here like you said yep after he sell once he sells it he has no control in terms of the water land what's going to happen if something happens these buildings going to have sprinklers no so you have all these buildings so how's that going to affect my property it's going to burn all of this down if that happens to bur they'll never control this I mean again we're kind of getting off topic but you know again they're all steel construction so they wouldn't they're not going to jump this you know we have a brick building there what they're going to put in there cuz that's way too much storage area and especially this one which is so close to the Wetland here on my on my property I'm concerned with that we and I'd be happy to stand on site I'm sure my father would too and and talk to you about exactly what's being stored in there and and those sorts of things yeah would you how about would you sell it I mean who's we have no intention of selling it I'm I'm that's today I understand that I was to buy that you that from you 10 years from now I don't care what they put in there I want them full I have to pay that mortgage there's still the the contingencies and everything that we're stating that they would be putting on the site that you're going to put something all of the things that we read into the record about what would be stored on site I'm still concerned with this Pond here I don't think that's enough well so what what we saying is you worried that if this Pond overflows it's going to flow into your Wetlands what we're saying is if this Pond overflows it's designed to flow into the river and then travel Downstream it's very unlikely that it go to the north how come you allowed to put water into the stream and I just did a $300,000 addition on my property and I wasn't allowed to do that we're not putting water into the stream if we have a 500e flood yeah right like in 2010 I mean I I don't know were you there in 20 were you there in 2010 yeah yes yes I actually went to school property flooded was Mont my property flooded because they everybody's property flooded It was 95 flooded it was it was in a sense it was Far River but it was that they didn't want rewrote the flood so they closed the the gate mhm they opened the gate rather yeah flow down here yeah and flooded everybody Downstream everybody got flooded Pond had the same issue exactly so yes I'm concerned about that okay thank you next name and address well I live there okay uh my name is Kimberly can you get up to the microphone I'm going have to lower this I just have a question could you repeat what you uh stated regarding um area that will not be used you you mentioned and I I couldn't hear a no activity Zone could you just repeat that yeah that's a reference uh there's a policy at the Conservation Commission this is the flag Wetlands line it's still the wetlands to have no activity within 25 ft of the wetlands so this dash line you see the snakes around and see no activity beyond that dotted line that's correct from here up yes all the way around all the way trying to get my bearings as to the location of the building you know where the septic system is and the grass the septic system is right here the tree line is like right goes right along the property that's pretty much where the property line with that with the yard this this that building will be in the grass area this corner here is going to be 25 ft is right on the it's right on the line outside that yeah 15 about 15 ft off your proper now what happens with this whole area here which this this when they made the driveway is built up fit but what what's going to happen anything we have no intention of doing anything with nothing in there whatsoever it's going to stay Lo this is going to stay as it is as it is right now with the bricks nobody's going to be driving in and out walking in and out of there access from the road sir this right here well you have access access 177 existing access 17 so nothing is changing on the other side just for those two southernly buildings here and it'll stop there and then you have your approved septic here y now so this will all remain driveway and they will have to access that will all stay existing from the rear um that's what this wrap around is here this so this is access right near this buffer zone area that you indicated well the buffer zone is here this is the 25t no activity zone so we'll do nothing in there and then this is on outside and you see reduced reduced after construction the storm water run off is mandated to be did I understand that right yes 20% reduced after construction right yes than it is currently right now right correct yes because right now there is no storm water management whatsoever on this site so we are adding storm water management to improve from where it was before so your father's concerns about the water we're we're mitigating that trying to trying to help no totally I understand I yeah there's other concerns too obviously that's not for this forum regarding what we had started security the size of this rear building which is huge how many how high is this building by the way uh we believe I me we haven't finalize the height on that but I mean we weren't planning to go higher than you know a standard like if you're familiar with our other facilities if you're going down 177 towards Stanford Road on the left hand side there a building right along 177 about the height of that watch from the church across from church exactly exactly it's not going to be 50 ft high it's it's you know in interior ceiling height is less than 10t yeah it's a single story building be smaller smaller yeah it doesn't have a pitch the pitch is going to be less it's not going to be as high as that one you wouldn't even be it's going to be half the size of the height of the gymnasium at this point so it would be significantly smaller okay and only storage is is uh right now in this building only storage currently that's the only activity it's storage it's storage that's what the purpose of this these additions are anything that we're putting on is storage I'm going to give someone else a chance to speak thank you very much next anybody else name and address uh Robert Kirby 7 Union Al um what about the parking lot I mean right now there's trailers there there's cars there what's the stop you know from Joe scho putting this car there then doing work on it I've already I've already seen two sailboats condemned sailboats and then saw people chopping them up and Hauling them away yeah we we put a stop to that we as soon as we were alerted to that we stopped that that was a customer that was renting from us that unannounced to us was doing that as soon as we got noticed if you notice in the last two to three months that hasn't been happening anymore he just stores the boats and hauls them off stop that from happening again the fact that we monitor it on a regular basis and then you know the the runoff goes into the Westport River Westport River's polluted enough already you know it's like I go Cog and and all Cog beds are are going away they're closing down gradually quickly I mean we're not doing going to going to damage that we're mitigating the storm water here and we're willing to limit and as I mentioned to the board we're willing to put a limitation on the fact that we wouldn't have any automobile stored there and limit it strictly to campers and and boats we are a storage facility least impact in terms of of anything here you know limited access a boat a boat still stores gasoline I mean something happens I mean they're contained with the with the plugs typically in the back of them so if something were to happen you know in that instance but I mean we can't we can't prevent everything from from happening but we're we're doing everything we possibly can to you know like I said I've seen work being dyal no as I mentioned we we put a put a stop to that as soon as we were alerted to it so how how come you need to be alerted to it if there's always a tenance on the property well we as I mentioned it's 24 hour access there attendance they already they already have attendance there for yeah yeah but that's not that's for the inside inside okay and this guy was coming in after hours and and doing this and as soon as we became aware of it that down and it wouldn't help then to have a gate because he'd have a key he'd have a key anyway so we'd be in that same there a gate like where you drive out to one S7 so nobody can get in right now there's not but we were talking about that what is it we we could we could yes absolutely I mean but if you gave everybody a key that wouldn't help it wouldn't help in terms of the people that well if you opening up at a certain time certain hours then you shouldn't have a problem you open up at 8:00 in the morning you open the gate but if you if you have a and you store your camper with us you have a key to the gate so if you want to come in at 2:00 in the morning and go to Florida you call somebody to come and open the gate but you could also I mean I I've seen other facilities that it really wasn't a key it was more like a exactly it swipe card access key fob then doesn't allow you to come in after hours after hours yes we we have talked about doing swipe access that is an option exactly there's no really reason picking up their RV at 2:00 wouldn't have picked it up early yeah get it and I mean again if these are thing that open to conversation if it would make people feel more comfortable to have it gated and opened in the morning and closed at night then that's something that we could talk about MH and be open be open to that anybody else no hold on uh my name is Caitlyn Oliver I live at 64 Union so I'm the property on the side of the meder is up here in the corner okay um I agree I have some concerns that are probably more focused for the planning board once the actual Arrangement comes up the security the Privacy the way that everything's going to be addressed um but I am a little concerned just about um give us all your concerns because because want information well I mean even with this it doesn't show any type of privacy plan it doesn't address the lighting concerns it doesn't address what's going to happen it's all existing nothing nothing on that of the property is changing you're you're set almost 10t above grd I mean with all due respect none of that's even been addressed so this property was a school up until 2022 and the lights for the school were all warm soft lights that were on like normal um telephone pole style lights that you see on the highway or on regular roads since you guys have shown up there's all LED lights that are now outward facing instead of inward facing there's been no updates that match the other store facilities like the addition of abraitis or things to create privacy for the neighborhood um I understand that there's a a movement when you're taking something over you have to do things in stages so I think we've all suspended our complaints for a little while just to give everybody some room I honestly anticipated it would come in connection with the further plan because when you're making a plan for one thing you would have a plan for all of it um and I think some of the things that Kim was Raising about you know if cars are coming in here this is where our properties are so those headlights coming in all of that stuff it's not a concern until it is um and there are things that can get worked out they just address point out the one thing with the headlight situation you're because you're correct me if I'm wrong you're saying you up here you're about 10 to 12et above grade yeah come sit in my dining room and see how many headlights you can see I I'm not I don't all of the lights on the building every single car that pulls in people in about if if arbori in that section of the are would make you happy I mean I think that conversation needs we're very willing to work with every maybe as a as a group the neighborhood needs to address the things that are there I agree that that's more for the planning board as it moves forward but when we're here and we're talking about the aquafer district there are still exemptions that need to be addressed you know I have to agree with Bob RVs still store gasoline they store propane there are huge tanks that are sitting there there are waste storage tanks underneath them and there are people there all hours of the day all hours of the night doing things making noise it's it's not as simple as oh well we have an attendant and we have rules you're only one person you're only a member of a staff you can't control what every single person does on your property and if you have 20 some odd RVs campers boats and other things just sitting in the back lot in what I would argue is the most you know reserved area because it is along our property lines it's not on the street front where if you're driving by people are going to see that people can do some sketchy stuff back there before you guys took it over and it was an empty lot we had a lot of instances where the police would have to roll through people would go in the back and park and we had people that broke in I'm sure that's the spot where they do it so if somebody is going to disassemble a boat or do anything else they're coming in the back and they're doing it in our backyards um and that's just a problem that needs to be addressed understand but if you're talking about agreeing to not have cars because cars have gas tanks then perhaps the limitation needs to be that none of those vehicles are being stored on this specific property because they all have gas tanks they all have propane they all have generators they have waste tanks gray water tanks all these things that could rupture or be disassembled in the backyard um you know there's a lot of talk about storage here but I think we're missing the elephant in the room which is that there appears to be a commercial batting cage that's been going on in the gym as well uh I was under the impression and I I believe what we were told originally was it was a volunteer batting cage open to the police department here in town who was doing some type of charity work with a little league team that has since come to people being in the backyard they're practicing in those fields they come and go there was like 25 cars in that lot before we left for this meeting today um that's all headlights that's all traffic that wasn't anticipated with all due respect that addressed that pered SCH for 50 years with people coming in and it was an elementary school with toddlers who left at 2 p.m. first and then they weren't there and it's since been closed a long time it was closed for there are use issues that I just I think there needs to just be a little bit more transparency we're willing to be transparent this is the first excuse me sir let her finish talking thank you Miss G I appreciate that the other issue that I I have is the beginning of the meeting was brought up with this idea that whether or not the board has the opportunity to take action here whether you need to have the site plan review completed and come back um I believe attorney long is suggesting that there could be some type of approval contingent on those plans but um I believe what you suggested was as long as they came down on the risk level and not up you didn't need to be involved anymore um with all due respect I just I don't think that that I can answer that we can't do conditional approvals I'm yeah I'm untable with the idea either Grant or reject but when we Grant we can grant with conditions I would request if nothing else that perhaps this would be addressed with a continuance pending the outcome of the others knowing that there needs to be a larger discussion with the things that the community is bringing up I think it's very likely that all of those could be resolved and that some modifications or tweaks to this plan or the plan down the road could be agreeable to all of us if the concerns get addressed if not then we can have this discussion based off of what's outstanding and not agreed with the community but I'm very uncomfortable with the idea that the board would agree to a plan that is not set in stone that we don't have I mean we don't even have dimensions on these buildings we don't know the heights we don't know what they are we don't know what the can I stop you right there for a second absolutely we're here to discuss the aquifer yes not the height of the building there are obviously there are a lot of concerns and and those concerns are something that you bring to the planning board and and because after they get done with us they will go to the planning board for a site plan review which is going to look at everything and then they have to go to the conservation committee to to you know to to get their approval so this is like step one of three steps now generally speaking you go to the site plan review first before you come to the but they are separable they are two separate and distinct functions coming to to to to the uh the zoning board of appeals who only handles the aquifer is is allowed uh but like I I told them before if they make any substantial changes when they go to the site plan uh that may impact they may have to then come back to us again to get an update on the on the aquafer if in fact any change that uh that was mandated by the site plan uh uh approval process affects the aquer aspects of this right but that would also depend on the height of the buildings the amount of runoff the roof the way that perhaps the gutters are structured the way that this is actually getting put to the infiltration ponds as they're laid out I'm not saying it's a no I'm saying it sounds like there's a lot of stuff that needs to get worked out and with all due respect again tying back into the way the bylaw is written it says that it has to be tied to a permitted use and at this point we haven't really addressed whether or not the bat en cages of permitted use the type of storage and exactly what storage is going to be permitted so the special permit is tied to the use the use is still a vague question which needs to get hammered out and what is and what is not going to be there so since all the pieces fit together my request would simply be to table it so we have a little bit more information and hopefully next time if all of that stuff is worked out you won't have a neighborhood full of people here objecting you can put your approvals in and there'll be no nay votes coming for you once again we're going to sort of round back again we're here to discuss how the the square footage of what they want to put in affects the aquifer and that's that is now we are really we are very concerned about what goes in those things right because that affects the aquifer yes how high the building is got nothing to do with this there's a lot of these things that are site plan specific and not aquafer but certainly aspects of what's stored right it were very very concerned about yes but so my concerns are raised under one two six and 11 of the special features that were discussed earlier in 624 B one two 126 and 11 and then tying back to 624 C which is that the special permit requested is contingent on all commercial and Industrial activities that are permitted within the underlying District yes and it's are pered these are permitted activities there's almost nothing it's not permitted the commercial District right but you know recycling right with the propane tanks and the things I'm raising with the number one those are my concerns I I'm very comfortable that everyone is vetting them I just wanted that to be on record I'd also like to say that I I think they can be resolved and I think that the concerns are more just making sure that the little things that come with having one of this in your backyard get adjust and that's not for the aquafer that's probably for planning so I mean we would be happy to if I may I I apologize for cutting you off before I just I was trying to keep up while we were going through and I I do want to make that note I didn't mean to cut you off we are happy and and our neighbors across up at the other facility and across we are on top of it and you know had we known these concerns ahead of time we would have called a meeting with you guys before we came in this is just the first time we've heard about it you know we can we'd be willing to talk about putting up you know arbori fencing mitigating the light you know changing colors things like that he's an electrical contractor so you know we put in all the lights to limit the Riff raft that you were talking about having people come in and out of there and like I mentioned to the board as soon as we Chang the the lighting scheme and upgraded the security it's limited so you know but I totally understand not wanting to have lights coming through your backyard and and we'd be happy to work with you on that well you also mentioned that you were coming here preliminarily to get some of this out of the way so I think a lot of us are bringing it up knowing that it may not be on your plate right because of their requests um but this is benefit you know u in a lot of cases I would have cut people off because it's it's not our job to manage the site but it is certainly impacts him yes so hearing all of your complaints whether they're about the aquifer or not is beneficial to the whole process because then he'll be able to modify his plans before he gets to the site plan abely I think that's the best way to address it I think that's what all of us would so and the site plan will be more aggressive than this far more if I may uh again to address the concerns uh the lighting and Landscaping and that type of thing is all part of the site plan review and they make recommendations or they make conditions on the approval of and there's a big push and it's come in the last few years of always having downward lighting and that type of thing and that's a requirement under the site plan review so those concerns that you have and I encourage you to show up at the I think we'll work because I think the applicants again you go through a three-step process you'll get notified at site plan review you'll get notified at Conservation Commission and all these things will all be hashed out if and I'm not sure if everything gets perfect usually if everybody's goes away upset then it's the perfect solution but I don't know you know if everything can be addressed or everything can be addressed or those type of things but I think the intent of the applicant is to do that the concern is you know we don't want to do put together all these plans and then come into here and say you know you say okay no and they say no and now we've kind of just spun the wheels in the mud I think kind just want to few things my son didn't want me to speak IAD you guys can comeone come up and introduce yourself where your address is all right I'm Jimmy long uh I basically some of you know don't know who I am I've been in this town over 50 years as a living here and also um my Contracting firm's here my storage is here um and basically I pride myself in my developments um on the lighting you're talking about we haven't got to it because of if you go up the street um my Plaza the storage that I have it's all downlighting I'm an electrical contractor I de it all the time with banks um when we do banks uh they're in the communities and there there's a lot of houses around them and we always have to do the down lay and I always change it they come up and I change it 15 years ago not a PO Maring um I'm neighbors I want to get along with um I pride myself on my storage I run a really tight ship uh 20 years in this town with my storage I've never had a complaint I've never had an issue with the police department okay fire department like he said I used to use the fire department let him use my facility for training at any time um so I'm going to address your concerns when we leave here we'll talk outside anything I can work out with you guys I will um so I just wanted to tell you who I was um this is my uh my baby I bought it we're expanding the storage my storage is run 9 to5 one day to Friday 9 to2 I run my storage very tight I used to do U-Hauls work for over 15 years so I learned a lot of things not to do in storage the way they run their facilities I don't want to run their facilities they're 24 hours 24hour facilities bring the stuff that you're talking about brings a bad element brings uh drugs brings stolen property prostitution okay when I say that to people they look at me with two heads I go it's crazy my facilities are run really really tight like he said I do camera systems that's another part of my business my the state-ofthe-art okay the issue that you brought up with the with the gentleman we caught it on camera and first when we found out about it as soon as I saw it I went up to him I said either don't do it again or get your stuff off my property I nipped it right away okay so your concerns will be addressed um I wanted to just stand up and and basically tell you how my facility is run I pride myself you put your stuff with me you get it back the same way and the way we run it my attendance like my son was telling you people come in we go we unlock their units they do their business we keep an eye on what they're doing then when they leave we lock their units they have to sign in and sign out okay the uh the traffic with the the obv usually it's low once in a while they'll go out late night if I have to put a gate on up there I will put a gate it'll and if I have to mitigate it to have the gate not work at certain hours that's a quick way we just shut it down there's no lights on the back road we're never touching that I've already actually talked to the other neighbor I don't was you guys um when you're driving out I said I'm never going to use it on one side yeah I said I'm never going to use it you've never seen me use it I locked those Gates it stayed locked I'm not coming into that street I don't want I don't want to affect you you got dogs and stuff never going to happen that gate stay unlocked I could have opened it up and had traffic coming through not happening okay cuz I I feel for you I don't want you get beautiful piece of property that's the way I want to keep it so that's me I just wanted to come before you you didn't want me to come up thank you very much okay thank you I'd just like to say one last thing in regards to the RVs we've been storing RVs boats all these things for well over 20 years now and in those 20 years knock on wood we have never had an instance of a leak never and again we monitor these things regularly I can't sit here and tell you that it'll never happen but we do try to keep the you know types of equipment and material and RVs that are kept there of a higher caliber and I do realize that some of the stuff right there that's there now might be lower maybe the stipulation that we put is that nothing older than 15 years old can be stored there so that we can ensure that it is up toate you know clean no rust no rot things like that and like my father just said you know we want to work with you guys and make sure everybody's happy and you know comply with the board so we're really not trying to be abrasive whatsoever okay thank you uh any other questions comment from the board do we have a do we have a list and they talk about what can be stored there is that available to us to see what the contract is of what is allowed to be stored there and not um I I could provide that but I can assure you that it's everything that's listed in the bylaw there's none of the items that are of concern here I would just think that it would be you know an a good idea we we can provide a list of well what what we're concerned about are things that affect the aquafer and that's what's in no pesticide no gas no petrol you know no manure no yep you know all the things that would affect the aquifer you know you know if you want to store you know you know microwave oven then yeah but we're not putting you know gasoline and you know any type of acid or anything of that nature chemicals that we're worried about getting into the ground absolutely it was brought up for one of the in one of the conversations that the batting cages were not permitted Ral are they permitted because I when it was said I said I've been taking little leue teams there for quite a while already we did we did go for the the change of use at the time but you know it's it's bad in cages now and that's as it is for now but as we pointed out the intention is to remain storage facility I think he would like to speak again question real quick you need to come up toic need come to the microphone so everybody can hear you bring up you guys are trying you're worry about what's coming in so I've R my facility pretty tight um when stuff's coming in we've turned stuff away lawnmowers propane bottles we don't take them in take get take them back out um we've caught stuff coming in sometimes somebody brings mold in whoa can't come into the facility those buildings that are going to go up I forgot to tell you there's only two doors there's one door in this end and one door in that end that's it and then all the rollup doors are inside it's all climate controlled so it's very very secure so getting back to your getting back to where you're talking about as people are getting unloaded and stuff my attendants are walking around and watching what's coming in so uh addressing the concerns of the board um for the most part I think we do a pretty good job um and then you walk well another thing that we do every morning and every night they got to walk the facility every morning have to go in walk through all the facility they check all the stuff making sure there's no spills nothing coming out of the units if there is something we pop the locks and I always have two people go to that and check it out so and addressing your concern we do the best of our ability watching what comes in on to the to the facility okay not that's really our our purview but what's the you're saying it's a storing facility but you have a batting cage well the so when we bought the property that's not a that's no no I I to just to explain when we purchased the property as somebody mentioned you know you got to cover the mortgage we had to build out the storage facility and bring in you know people to rent those units so right now y this section of the building here is the storage the gymnasium there was a police officer as she mentioned Vic Medina who coaches baseball um who approached us and said hey I'm looking for an area to be able to put a a batting cage in and so given the circumstances and you know in income from that we have permitted him to do so as he is right now so it's in the interior of it's in the interior of the building I mean as she mentioned you know sometimes the kids go outside and they play basketball in the you know in the area between the two buildings um but you know outside of that it it our least with him is for the in interior portion we've allowed him to play basketball you know kids want to go outside and r brought I didn't want him to think that this guy was doing something illegal he no no not not at all we're we you know we we did do that originally we got the you know permission from um the necessary yeah once again that's not an act no no I know but happy to answer any questions whether they're applicable or not so it it is an allow use yeah within the I mean that as Sean pointed out within the commercial District there's a lot of allowed uses like almost anything pretty much yes and and of those allowed uses I'd say that were you know the least detrimental to to the area right right okay if there's no other comments I'll entertain a motion to close the hearing I make a motion to close the hearing I guess that's a first and a second yeah uh discussion no all in favor of closing the hearing I I I'll oppose no all that means is now we will discuss it and make a decision if we have any questions we will ask it of you but but uh you can't offer any more uh information uh with you know without without being asked uh again and I will ask you some questions because uh overall I think the AC for attention part of it is is is reasonable I'm still concerned about how for the life you know for eternity how we make sure and I'm sure you know I mean very you know upright as far as as how you manage but when you sell this 20 years from now to somebody else who isn't as forthright uh how do we control that so what I'm more concerned about is is if we approve this what kind of safeguards can we put on this to make sure that it remains this way for you know for the life of the of the property am I go ahead you can answer so I mean again we could put a ulation on there that anytime there's a deed transferred that they got to come before the board well you're allowed to put any conditions on this as you want so if that was a condition that you wanted that yeah I'm just thinking of of How would how could we and I'm I'm I'm struggling here what kind of of a deed restriction or any deed transfer would require the approval of the zoning board of appeals Cynthia so if we go to sell it look at me I'm a fat attorney if you put a deed restriction on there under the special permit that any transfer of deed to a new owner we would require a zoning board of appeals approval and so the next owner would have to come before you and give you guys the very same assurance that we have I we have no intention of of I I understand everybody it's a business you know you never know what's going to happen but at that time the next guy that comes in needs to come here and do the same thing that we are I think the issue here is that if it does change and I mean we're taking them on their word that they're run their businesses well and I think we have some proof of it because there are other businesses in town that they're running that they're running well but doesn't mean that that's going to always stay so I don't think we need an assurance from somebody else because they can give us the assurances they don't have to follow it we' see that all the time but I think the if they change the use from store to something else they'd have to come up about they'd have to do that and I think by the nature of the design of the buildings it only it ites it lends self that has to be an attendant facility because there is only effectively two doors the you know because you have to BU fire code to have two doors right but effectively it's just one door right so you can't just you're gonna always going to have to have there's always going to be some control over the buildings because of the way in which they're built and if they were going to change the way they were running the place and being a 24-hour facility they would have to make substantial trangers to the building which will require they could give everybody everybody who is a would give them a key yeah I mean you could but that'd be a wild idea yeah again I mean I'm open to a limitation that if we sell it it has to be you know you you know we can't we can't manage how they run their business no it's a business business and something I'd like to point out too the you know the the storage portion of it is the way the buildings are constructed you know they you it's not like it's open frame building you'd literally have to dismantle especially these new buildings that are going up are built kind of like an Erector Set where it literally Clips together and it's all storage units so you can't it's not like you're go oh I'm going to come in here and knock all the walls down well the building would fall down yeah so I think the way they're designed prevents it from really being used differently and I you know I think just we can't we can't control it's a business dor we can't tell them how to run their business but I think of the thing we could do is we could mandate which they do now pretty much that the facility is only is only available between the hours of x and x 9 and five or whatever what you know but how does how does that affect us as a zoning board that doesn't affect the aquer well yeah it does because what what it does then is it it allow it it makes it so that people just can't come and go and do whatever they want there after hours after hours yeah but there's plenty of places where people but that other places don't affect the aquafer I mean this is but but but 20 yeah but I don't I don't see if it being 247 and 9 to 5 Monday to Friday has any effect on the aquafer well it does because it it limits what people can do I do see I do see the point I I think it's fair I mean I I get what you're and I'm as from our perspective I mean I don't know if we want to go 9 to5 maybe stretch it like 8 to six or something so in case we change our hours but like you know limiting the access so that we don't have people coming in that can speak anymore you're done talking it's on a 6 in slap so it's on a 6 in concrete slap All Storage so you guys are worried of a spill it's going to go the concrete floor it would be it would be contained it's going go on the ground somewhere no I mean what he's saying you have you you need to but what he's saying is is if something were to leak within the unit he got uh if something were to spill in a unit on the inside it wouldn't be going outside would be caught immediately because we're there every day and it would be in the hallway that's only because you're there day managing it I think your concern is that someone's going to come in at 10:00 at night and they change their oil or or I what how who knows I got a lot I got a lot of hazardous way I want to get exactly and I'm just going to throw it in infiltration Pond yeah right they'd be on camera fortunately yeah yeah I mean but after the peer in the river no right I hear that I I mean that's where the gate comes in I do think that controlling the hours does minimize the stuff because they can afford to have an attendant there the attendant's going to be uh monitoring so I do think that should be one of our considerations the thing that throws me off a little bit that didn't even come up early in the hearing was uh this batting cage is your batting cage also 9 to5 I would think not I don't not I don't want to spe I don't know his specific but I'm going to tell you right now at the end of the day it's it's our facility and our building and if you if you say these are the hours then hey those are the hours you I wouldn't want to restrict an recreational activity that would be good but we just have to make a distinction between the the storage Po and the understood and in reality having uh a bunch of children in their the batting cage is actually really is affecting the septic system it's not just five or six attendance it's actually a larger yeah larg for an hour you an hour and you got 10 kids you stand in front of you for the whole whole hour no and it is I will say as much as there might be a large amount of kids they are there as Ray pointed out for a short period of time and how does that factor into deceptive approval they they I mean they it went all through the Board of Health and the Board of Health did the Board of Health know there was a bading cage in there I mean it's an existing use in this did they know about it we didn't know about I I mean I I did not go before the Board of Health our septic engineer did and he design he assured us that it was designed to specs and standards you know to right broed use but they're downgrading the septic to be only well right now it currently as we are sitting they're upgrading the they're downgrading to upgrade it I mean the existing system failed Title 5 so we had to we had no choice to but to resize and redesign and our septic engineer designed it for you know what what is there for storage and the batting cage as far as I'm as far as I'm aware well the storage don't have any facilities except for the yeah one bathroom for the storage but again you know I it's designed for if we see a hundred people in a month I bet you five of them use the bathroom did you say the uh one bathroom one bathroom for a building or one bathroom no no none the only bathrooms that are in existence and will remain are the ones in the school and we've even eliminated two of the like the bigger bathrooms with multiple stalls those are all gone so that was probably had those are all gone single yeah exactly that exactly that factored in as well there the only thing I I think I have I have an issue with storage of any Vehicles there I know you said that you know it was a school and there was a lot more traffic but that was before there was an a for protection dis District so in my view is that just because there's always been cars there sort of doesn't really make the point that the whole point is we have new regulations for this area and that means we don't we want to mitigate how much is going into the into the water and I think the your your argument that there's been more cars than the five or six or 10 cars youed cars in RVs and boats you store there um doesn't really sit well with me um and I think storing I mean they're storing things that not are not to be stored there right it's in there it's in our bylaws that you can't have propane you can have gasoline and all those things have those um and they have you know they have oil they have you know they have oil even if it's just an RV that gets hooked up onto a truck there's oil in the bearings that can leak um so I would prefer that I would would see no car storage at all there am I allowed to respond to that or what's that can I so what I had mentioned um to one of the comments was that maybe we because it is a part of our business and you know if we can keep some sort of it would be great but I'd be willing to say what if we limit that specific facility to only storing vehicles that are within 15 years old so now we're assuring that these are you know again and they're registered they're inspected they have to travel over the road and in order to do so they need to be you know they can't be leaking anything could be the old car St vehicles that are unregistered uh we I mean we don't well let's say I don't want I want to register for 6 months and then I'm going to put my camper at your place but is it registered at that point I I I mean we typically require you they can only be a registered vehicle yeah we could we could limit that but that doesn't change the fact of I mean I think most stor facility requires them to be registered insured but I I think there are bylaws say you can't start propane and campers have propane in them and they and boats have gasoline in them and and if that's I think that goes against I we would have to have make an exception well we we approved the water protection for the for the Deo place they have they have trucks and and they were washing down stuff with chemical they they actually managed it though he's managing it no they're they're managing storm storm drain I mean correct me if I'm wrong Sean but if if we cuz right now the only storage of vehicles we have is along this Westerly portion and we're saying all of the water flows to the West would it be Poss most of the water yeah North North North sorry I had my directions wrong there if we put a catch Basin like Dello did which I saw you guys required for an oil separator as a c as a catchall nine times out of 10 it's just going to be water because we don't have any spills but on the off chance that there were we're directing all the water flow to that Northerly portion I mean could we do you think that's feasible or is that it is uh within reason if it's if it's an exorbitant undertaking the question would be okay you're catching it you put to an oil water separator then where is it going well we get we would pump it out in the same way that Dello had because we wouldd have an alarm on it or something to that effect so you're saying basically a tight tank on what you like to do well with an oil tight tank for the oil portion cuz can you have an alarm that goes off for oil oh yeah you can have a high water alarm and in an oil tank no I mean that would be difficult to do and it also Trigg trigger more false negatives because you could have somebody with a leaky gas tank out of 177 and have the gas go into that yeah it could happen now I guess my issue is that we let them have outdoor car storage what prevents somebody's later having indoor car storage the property the way the buildings are designed you could never bring a car about the existing building there's no way the doors are all standard walk doors the no rollup doors even in the gymnasium and again put a stipulate put a condition in there that no indoor car storage we have no intention seven cars I know about car storage so there's not enough of it so I appreciate that you're you you're providing that it's just that it is in a predicted area and I we have no int none of these buildings are designed for car and at least we should not have uh maintenance being done we agree we agree that is not allowed yeah that is a that's in the yeah in the rules for us other than uh maintenance which I would oppose uh I I I don't think it's uh unreasonable to allow uh vehicles to be uh U parked there well they're not being parked they're being stored they're stored okay which is different than being parked I'm saying I'm not opposed to okay uh and uh because I think it's uh highly unlikely and if if something you know a condition sort of what he had indicated that it's just frosting on a cake as far as I'm concern and uh I don't think it's likely that that uh we're going to have any active uh leaks all all up and down rout six now I realiz yeah I'm saying that and there's the car there's the car dealerships right right and they're in they're on the border of the aquifer right I was I was aware when I yeah no no I it's a concern it's a it's a fair concern certainly I think that one of the things they and and I know you don't allow this but is that we that no maintenance of any of any right kind any vehicle RV boat be be conducted on premises absolutely no we don't allow that as it is right you don't allow as soon as we caught that the guy that they were all talking about doing that we put an end to it immediately so it wasn't only because he was taking them apart all but you're saying you don't allow them working on absolutely not okay no it is purely storage nope we don't have I mean we don't have a water hookup for tenants or anything like that I are we capturing any of this I have a question about um the smaller infiltration Pond or whatever you call it that's uh at the end of the the northeast corner yes um um a gentleman uh expressed his concern about that it wouldn't be big enough to um to capture all because it is a large building uh the run off of the roof and I'm just curious as I'm I'm sure you must I'm sure you've got um calculations and how you do that and at at what point like it was that is that something that you did after speaking with concom or someone else I mean how did how did that work because okay so both concom and the planning board fall under the state Massachusetts storm order guidelines there's guidelines you have to meet you have to meet this that in this Westport has a little additional thing when it comes to the O for protection that if you have 15% in prvious area you wouldn't have to do that anywhere else in town this much water for instance a lot of it you you allow infiltration and you allow some to just discharge that's your typical detention Pond the ponds have to be sized to infiltrate the water now when you say it's not big enough it's not like it's it all goes in and then it starts infiltrating it starts infiltrating as soon as the water starts going into the pond so when you have an inch of water in the pond and in this material one inch of water falls in about 4 minutes so as it's picking up and there's a tremendous amount of water that's going to come off off these buildings there's no doubt it's all in prvious Era you're talking you know 82 8200 square feet of and you're talking 8 in rainfall you have the size of for so you're talking 6,000 gallons of water basically a minute coming into this Pond and it has to infiltrate so you you like you would do with a septic system or something along that line you have to size the pond to infiltrate enough bottom area to infiltrate x amount of inches per hour with the stipulation that obviously you have to filter everything before it goes to the pond or kind of makes the pond not work and on top of that you have to do it so it never supposed to over top now if you get 20 inches of rainstorm and there are rainstorms that we all know that you can get three inches of rain in an hour we have to handle that if we get 8 inches of rain an hour which is above a 500-year storm it's going to flood like it did as the gentleman mentioned 2010 when every road and you know when the two what of ponds were connected again across 195 during that year there's not much you can do about a catastrophic flood there is not much you can do you could you could size this thing you know you'd have to size the whole property to be a pond basically to handle a storm like that the whole point is any uh is is any none of this uh that you're talking about uh already impervious a most of the site is imper there's there's over a little over two acres are they adding that much to it no right now there's no infiltration whatsoever and there's nothing going on whatsoever it just spills out on the ground and goes we're half passively so the difference is now everything's going to be controlled and infiltrated we're improving the we're improving a situation that yeah it's already going not all going into the ground right there but there's more imperious uh area now this is this is ground there are but we're going to be infiltrating what we're adding and most of what was already there so we're impr I think it makes sense to add that this is all Gravel drive but we have to count that as impervious surface which is not done in any other District simply because we're in the aquafer Protection District this will not be pavement it will be a gravel driveway so if we were outside of the aquafer that would not count as an impervious surface but because we are it we factor that into the calculation as well right the whole point basically is to meet the requirement of your special permit let alone the storm water standard that is going to be guided by conservation we have to infiltrate this water but you're treating the Dr the pavement as black top in reality it's not it's not exactly exactly but the the the standards of the storm water standards just throw out just for instance so imperious areas is a number 95 on the runoff curve which is like 95% of it runs off basically if you think of it that way typically gravel it's about 80% this planning board makes you treat gravel as pavement so the part that would actually be going in they're considering it as runoff originally this all this this where you have your gravel was probably all originally there's an existant Gravel drive there now that's closer that you'll see underneath the it's still black top on the Westerly portion and that's going to stay that's going to remain as it is but I think you've got more impervious um square footage with the build building the buildings the roofs than you do with the gravel yes oh Absolut yeah absolutely absolutely I mean whenever you have a school building or or a mall or something like that there's a tremendous amount the amount of roof runoff is astounding uh if you go to do the calculation right now there's no control on anything out there to ask a question no no we close the hearing okay I mean it'll be verified just for his sake he doesn't believe it sized correctly and it'll go back and forth the consultant will also review them question who also review all the calculations all the storm water runoff all and we'll make comments and recommendations or any type of things that they don't believe they're working for the town they don't believe meet the requirements but you have to meet the requirements one way the other thanks you right so weird I do left I can't even read it he's an engineer that's why now my wife works she hers is worse but she's like well left-handed we've had two different viewpoints on on whether to gate the entrance or not and U my own thought is just to leave it and as constant indicated you know you don't want to put barriers where where Wildlife can't move through and all that any more than necessary so my own thought is leave it be if they find that in an actual operation well they it doesn't really have to be a limitting gate it can be a swing gate yeah whatever and animals can get through that yeah I was just talking about fencing fencing yeah okay but the gate for the driveway I mean I I don't know I think maybe gate would be good cuz I think I don't you know I think you want to I think you want to discourage people coming at all hours a night because there's no way then if you don't do that then you can't manage maintenance of of the equip of of cars boats very fair and I and in regards to what constant said you know I hear you Jerry but if we just put a gate at the where you pull off a 177 similar to we're not we're not stopping any animals from running around I mean they're coming off 177 they got to go over the gate it's just a swing gate or whatever your people with the storage that you mentioned earlier from accessing their boat uh RV and depending on if if we put a restriction on the time that we limit that I mean we like I said our facility in up the street is gated now and the people that have outdoor storage have a key to that gate so you know we could do with doing that well that's what we do now and you can also limit that saying that after 10 o' you can't you can't well and if we at this point in time it's easy well I don't want to say it's easy but you can do swipe card yeah well that's the other thing I mean directly across the street from us is the nooke village I believe it's called The nooke Village with you know I don't know how many residents are are over there you know um but your other your other place up uh by the Yeah does that no that's not no no no but you have there there's like a ton of development behind in the in the back yes and they I mean honestly everybody that lives back there likes it because it's quiet I mean the storage after hours they like L enough to a cemetery exactly except for C so there's not no we don't have any ghosts running around well I mean if um if again we're discussing you know how how we would approve or or reject this uh conditions that I would think well first of all the condition always is based on the current plan because if the plan changes then all bets are off y we always that's always part of our condition uh I I believe we we really need to limit access and whatever hours 8 to six whatever is is appropriate is fine with me uh a condition that no maintenance be done on cars RVs boats you know no maintenance or or uh any any worked on on on on on vehicles and you know you have to adhere to the prohibitions of 4.2 Point uh 6.2.4 B and C which has all the prohibited things about what you can and cannot store do you want to U uh limit the vehicles to registered and uh maybe 15 years old or whatever well that's that's up there yeah I do think I have no problem with that they have to be registered because no they could bring them in on a flat bed we do I'm not going to I'm not going to sit here and tell you we don't have unregistered Vehicles somebody buys a car and hey I'm going to get to it you know and they put it over there but again like we're unique because we do have these two facilities so if we have to rearrange things to where this facility is strictly limited with what we put there then we'll just put the other ones at the other facility they're not in the aqua I mean I'm not trying to be smart but you know what I mean we can we can work with it it doesn't really cause a big marckus I I think AG bigger concern is that you're you're not putting some deric piece of junk yeah I agreed well you don't want that either no no it doesn't it doesn't do any good I think you I think you know I don't how we write that in they have to say I think I think the way we write that in is is the is something about the year because you know that's going to keep it relatively new I know you said 15 years old is an old car but you know 2005 isn't it's still a runable car yeah you know I mean again we're okay with not with limiting it to boats and RVs I think that takes it even a step further yes to where we don't have any cars on site I would be well if you want that I like I like that I I think and I think that kind of takes a big chunk out of the yeah because people who are storing cars outside they're they're not nice cars no right right no I mean we all Park our I park my truck outside it's pretty nice but if you're parking it at a storage and not using it at all I I agree with that it's not you know from our experience yeah I would agree with that yeah okay that's that would that would be a big help I'm I'm open to that that would be a big help and you can send them to the other place which is why I'm agreeable to that there doesn't make cars there either I no I mean honestly we don't get a across both facilities I mean we maybe have five 10 cars it's not a common it's outside a lot of people want to pay for you know again and you don't want to pay to have a spot a lot of people find cheaper like we're not the cheapest with indoor or out Park in somebody's yard somewhere yeah you know as long as it's not the my street there's a bunch of those anyway let's Bes uh I'd be fine with the RV's need to make any distinction for the batting cages I I thought we might have to deal with something with the hours but if we can if that's okay 10 to six I mean 8 to six is 8 to six a good number I mean I I would re I would ask maybe we do like Ray you probably know more than I as to what time he does you know I don't I don't think the younger kids are using it after 8:00 I mean so if we did 8:00 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. that eliminates the nighttime issue and and again we're 9 to5 so yeah and we can limit the 8 to8 would kind of solve all problems I don't know what he does for 16 to 18 year group I don't I don't either but I I I college kids are I've not seen him there that late but again I mean I'm not there every day so I'm not going to speak to that is any of your plans eventually make that space in the storage um yeah yeah it is intent eventually but you know what it is what it is right now works but eventually yeah the plan is to transform the entire facility into storage oh is that is that going to have any impact on the need for parking spaces not necessarily related to the ACA but when the batting cage or the Banning cage you know I mean there's a lot of lot of parking oh they're kids they're not they're getting dropped off right and there's there is a lot of stay in watch no I mean we if we were to draw lines which we don't have right now now I mean I'd be hard pressed to think we have less than 25 to 40 spots there even with the RVs and boats that we have stored so I I think parking wise we'd be fine and again long term we're limiting that to begin with I mean is there a is there is there a sto is there a parking requirement for storage facilities probably is I think it's just it'd be warehousing right yeah it's under warehousing it's one spot for th000 square feet it can be waves on certain instances and then there's like one for every employee that will be there full time but that's a site plan review [Music] deal think and even then if we have 30 to 40 spots we don't have even with the new buildings we wouldn't be over 30 to 40,000 square ft of of building so again I think we'd be within the parking area I would just I guess the only other thing is when the plans do go to the plan board I'd like the fact that this is not using is not being used as storage and is using as a baded cage so they're aware of it Mark and put a mark on the and then this is this first story dwelling is being used as storage and it just Mark put a label on that that's that's EAS you know other than the gentleman here is saying something with bat cage said May R knew but none of us knew that's fine put that you had mentioned before about propane tanks and the RVs yeah is that any ISS issue you want to address yeah they got them right I mean if you're going to let RVs they're going to have a propane tanks attached to them I I think take unreasonable to especially a big RV you can't move them unon no you can't tanks are internal yeah you can't you can't take them out unfortunately but I again and I mean correct me if I'm wrong propane tank would leak it would leak into the air it would leak into the air it wouldn't leak into the aqu propane it's a gas it would yeah it's a gas I don't think it's an issue myself no I don't either all right uh anybody ready for a motion so ready we I'll make a motion I where's the thing I read it we covered all the all of the aquaa concern yes went through all the okay um I move that we approve this pardon Grant we Grant oh I'm sorry I thought you said Grant I'm like I'm it's been a long day yes rant I move that we rant I move that we Grant a special permit to construct three additional storage buildings in the aquafer Protection District as mandated by zoing bylaw article 6 section 6.2.4 c the subject property is located at 1180 American Legion Highway Westport Massachusetts and is shown on accessor the accessors map 28 lots 32f 32h and 32 J with the following with the following conditions uh condition number one uh related to the current plan as provided by by the applicant at at this meeting uh a gated limited access with hours of 8:00 a.m to 800 p.m. uh no storage of automobiles no maintenance on RVs boats Etc well I can't say Etc because that could be anything uh adherence to the provisions of 6.2.4 B and C uh of the AC Protection District anything what that does it say you can't have fertilizers or any of those things now you said no automobil no automobiles uh no storage of automob I'm curious about uh the word Vehicles as opposed to trucks motorcycles is that okay okay say cars cars trucks and motorcycl or do you want to say only RVs and boats only R and boats I would I would rather be very specific and say no cars no truck okay yeah that's fine no cars no trucks no motorcycles well okay be specific because if I the other way yeah it leaves it open to my back over there no tractors no tractors no tractors no ATVs that's what I'm saying yes right that's why I said I think it's best to say only no no no motor vehicle Vehicles except for except for except for RVs and boats they're not really considered Motor Vehicles well well well I'm thinking of an R anyway trailers cuz like I have a horse trailer there and I like to keep that part there there's no oil and no nothing on that there could be manure it's not a motor vehicle there could but we clean it after we use not a motor vehicle yeah all right that's true not a motor vehicle do have a motor in it all right yeah uh are we at all because the number an RV does have a motor of RVs and boats uh we we we were just talking about this Western Edge there's really nowhere else to put them yeah outside of that there's no room on them yeah but you just said a minute ago if you lined it out you'd get 30 30 uh parking spaces why stop you from doing it no I'm saying on that Westerly portion but why would so whether there's five or six or eight or 10 I that's what I'm asking I'm not does it matter I'm if he wanting to to rent out I think the plan the planning then they have certain many par they have to have enough parking for their specific yes right and then anything else then anything else they can use use for storage I mean not not Cars oats and boats and horse trailers yes cuz I mean some RVs have M Motors in them yes which is yeah except for right RVs yeah but I did say no maintenance to be done yes on anything on anything that's right because that's obviously a big because obviously you're going to get leaks when you do that yes else with um taking the junk off the bottom of boats whatever you call that they can't wash I think that qualifies under maintenance yeah I mean nobody's walk we don't have a we don't have a no water mobile washers to come around and do that so you saying you no maintenance not no main that's maintenance no maintenance is that maintenance mm I think yeah that's definitely maintenance I boat it is yep that is yep is brushing your teeth maintenance well we could say maintenance and painting cuz that's another big thing with an aquifer is is what mean you know painting painting of the painting of anything Vehicles you're not going to paint your you know paint your boat paint your no it would not be maintenance too I mean you can park it there that's it you park it there and you can pull it out of that that's we have not deal how do we write that well that's that's what's in the uh 6.2.4 B and C yeah I think anything that you didn't mention is definitely covered under 6.2 I don't know any storage facilities allow you to do any of that right no who wants to second that motion yeah I will second so so we have a motion and okay you second excuse me no I'm I think it becomes complicated if if you guys are okay with it then I'd prefer we don't yeah these all of these restrictions will live with the proper I mean I don't know if I mean we you talked about a d restriction that just says if you sell a property you have to you have to you have to come back to the Zoning Board of I have I again I don't have an issue with that okay I think that's because that at least then covers alleviates any other concerns so change change of ownership would require y zoning board approval the youth you want the youth not to change of ownership they're not going to they're not going to approve the new owner well that's what they okay I mean that was yeah it's up to you it's up to you guys I I think either way I guess the approved use is only for the current owner and therefore if any change of ownership they have to come back and see if it's still an approved use so well there's two different things a change of use would mean because if we just sell it and it stays storage that's not a change of use right right but if you say no if you sell the property we want to come back and that's that's what because then we have to make sure that they're going to manage the property the same way you do they don't approve the owner they app they approve for the use yes okay yeah I mean yeah exactly the owner's use and they have to get they have to re property change the use anything else we have a motion we have a second any other discussion not yes yes raided yeah Mr second yeah Mr he snuck it in there yep uh want a second a double second just so we don't have to come back in okay from the voting members all in favor say I I I all oppose no that motion is uh is granted there is a 20-day appeal period and what's again I know we may hear from you again if there's any big change when when you get the site plan and all you and all you uh all the abutters I really think you should attend the planning board meeting you know and hopefully they can work out all your issues before you get to before you get get notification but I be honest I'd like to meet on site ASAP and I know he would too okay we got any others for everybody get down there all right can we all we have business we have to finish overcome thank you Ralph thank you all problem have a good night night um we we have meeting minutes that we have to approve today did you give them to me probably need all this paperwork somewhere Gary yeah must be this one did you watch did you watch the uh yeah thanks door businesses meeting minutes for August 14 2024 that going to come most of these were continuations going to come by the way this is the first time in like six months we have no continuation that whole thing well actually we sort of did but not really so um excuse me excuse me excuse me we're conducting business you got read that a couple hours okay uh thank you the um uh we have uh meeting minutes from August 14 2024 uh I make a motion to approve the meeting minutes as provided by Maria we have a second oh it will Oh I thought you guys you guys paying attention here yep okay do I have a second a second second all in favor I all opposed no they're approved okay any other business no uh let me see who's are you the offici think I have I make a motion to adjourn the meeting is that the cor that's got it hey the third time make a i second you did that really well all in favor hi okay Val for