that's going to win she's already won good evening I'd like to call to order the uh agenda review for this the 7th Day of uh February 2024 roll call please yes Mr Mayor commissioner Mercer here commissioner danler here mayor temp Yates here and mayor B song okay and then we'll have uh here here we have an invocation and a pledge of allegiance and these presentations we'll do them on Monday night is that correct yes sir all right so then the minutes four sets of minutes um four sets of minutes and then comments from the audience then the audin ordinance's second reading 9A so 9A this is the second reading of the adjustment to the Marine structures requirement that we discussed previously uh better align the maximum roof area requirements uh with our code and the types of structures that are most likely to be built by residents okay there are no changes so Commissioners you have any questions all right then we will move to the consent agenda 10A I got a qu are you going to give us a presentation on that I can give you a quick rundown on we want to run yes yep and Gary hubber here is here as well if we need additional information but uh in 2021 the city began collaborating uh to update lift station 115 and there's a 50% cost share with main State Health they're the folks developing the old banion beach site uh since the design effort began the cost of materials and labor have increased uh from the original Engineers estimate uh the original Engineers estimate was $545,000 uh the actual cost is $892,500 um main State Health is committed to sharing cost sharing 50% of that additional cost so that aligns with the original developers agreement um so the this item is amending that original developers agreement to include that additional cost share uh so the city's additional share would be 73,9 45 question I got a question it did it doesn't say why they stopped four years ago what was the reason they stopped the development was it our fault or what was the reasoning on that um Eric might be able to speak to that yeah yeah I mean we we don't have a um a clear reason for why they stopped they they did commence construction they have approved plans they have pulled permits um I did reach out to the developer several months ago and they indicated that there were delays with the project the list station being one of them um it's my hope that if you know if we um get the lift station going that the site development um will will commence shortly thereafter um I am happy to reach back out to the uh developer though and and see if I can get some clear answers well I'm just trying to understand help me understand so the lift station is something that we own or we have to have I'm trying to understand why we're on the hook for something that if it was our fault four years ago because costs have gone up considerably I get that and I feel sorry for the development or the developer but why are we on the hook for for a cause of they may have stopped Gary can you speak to that and and what what reason can you give me to make me feel comfortable saying that this is a good ide good deal for us to do this good evening Mr Mayor Commissioners um so this this liation will not only receive flow from uh this new development but from existing development in the area so with all projects where we have developers come in we try to treat them fairly and and cost cost share where we have you know existing conditions like this where we have have a commitment for the existing needs of the system so that was a justification for cost share with a with a developer and I mean four that was four years ago and prices have almost doubled so it seems like we're on the hook for something that they've done or am I seeing that the wrong way uh can I maybe explain a little bit better to you uh a development is is only pretty much responsible for their development he's saying that there's additional developments around there that will be using that facility too so it's either the city's responsibility to pick that up that's that I guess you'd say capacity you know you're not going to make someone build a lot larger than the their incapacity than what their development will use it's the city's Li station at the end of the day and ultimately it needs to be upgraded because it serves people other than just that development so they're sharing in a portion of that Improvement but I but I think what commissioner dancer's point is is if this would have been on schedule and on time three four years ago we wouldn't have this price increase that's exactly what I'm saying and to Tracy's point if they weren't doing this commit if they weren't doing this development we wouldn't have to spend anything so the fact that it's it improve unless you're telling me it needs to be done regardless that's what I'm getting the the station is quite old Antiquated so yeah we were going to have to uh replace that station at at some point it was in our plans to do so and it just worked conveniently with the development but I understand what you're saying you know should we foot the additional because of the time delay I'm not so sure we should that's what my point is I I understand your your point um another thing too um their permits like for water and sore uh I know we're good for 5 years so they're probably uh trying to get in under that too so right and what if they don't go through with it and they come back five years are we going to pay another overage you know what I mean it's like seems like we're just like the the bank here the ATM we're going to give them half of whatever it costs whenever they do it we're going to have to do something with that station so um I think it is a benefit to the city now would we have preferred that it happened four years ago yes definitely but we were going to have to do something with that station anyways well who pushes back on how much we pay and how much they pay is that just is that just that they come in and say this is what we'll do or do we have a negotiation or trying to understand how these numbers because it just seems to me like it's little skewed so so the initial agreement was for 50% of the total cost um and I think I think that they had come back and they had looked for the city to carry a bigger share of that and I think the city team got back to 50% and we don't know why they stopped four years ago no sir you think we can find that out by Monday we can we can look into some of that and try to get you uh we can try y okay I would like to we can reach out and make contact and try and dig in that with them we'll try to get you some answers before the the meeting on Monday well thank you because I'm just a little uncomfortable with this one that's all so thank you and I'd like to understand too in that is the is the delay in four years property values are now higher so are they done to stand to make more money off of whatever they were trying to do in the first place and that that's where the rub is yeah well it's it's going it's planed to be Assisted Living uh facility so I'm not sure you know how much additional they might make off the property um we can we can reach out to them and we'll try to dig into that and have some answers for you okay 10 B I'm ask Julie Adams to present item 10B our Parks and Recreation and culture director good evening mayor and Commissioners uh the award of the swim team program management to the blue Marlins aquatic club that was we had our previous contract end with our previous service provider and we went through the RFQ process evaluated those we had the PSC and the choice is the blue Marlins aquatic club so the recommendation tonight is to approve the choice that was made by the Professional Services committee and that was members of our parks recreation and culture team a member of the community who is an avid swimmer and commissioner dancer said on that as well uh as a liaison happy to answer any questions about that if you have them any questions I've got one I I will I will tell my fellow Commissioners I sat in on that it was a really good discussion we had changing changing horses out there at the pool it was very very respectful everybody a lot of speakers and it was a good thing did you ever get to the bottom of the getting the the uh equipment back from the former club we have reached out to them uh Adam our aquatic supervisor is here with us tonight to provide any further clarification but we have reached out a couple times to the previous board member from our previous partner um I will also Elevate that request as well to try and get something worked out uh as early as this morning right there was there was a attempted contact made to try and get that so that we can get the the lane lines and U the reels what I would ask you to do is maybe update the City attorney on all this because if we have to take legal action or something because that we shouldn't have to rebi all that equipment new again so that that just to be clear that equipment did belong to that club that team that was not City equipment uh so we we want to work something out with them so that there is no longer a need for them to have it as as you're stating because there is not a they are no longer a team but uh that isn't they're not taking our equipment that was never ours to begin with just to be clear what would they equip but the scoreboard doesn't work without it but then they kind of go together we paid for the scoreboard right I mean so the equipment I was referring to are the lane lines and the reels which we utilize to create the lane lines in the pools in our pool rather but I'm not familiar with the I don't know the details Adam do you know about the scoreboard um I don't know the details of that I thought it had something to do with a padding on the side or something where their foot hit or yeah when when they touched it I don't know if it's Bluetooth but it yeah puts the time up on the scoreboard that's that's the equipment I thought we were talking about maybe I'm wrong but I thought that was we can Circle back with them and try attempt to get that contact made it was uh at the end of the the contract and agreement there was a pretty clean break between uh that group and the city but we can definitely reach back out to get that resolved and and I would if you can Loop me in on that cuz I had an understanding that we were perhaps reporting something to the law enforcement agencies that was a previous situation that has been corrected okay yeah that was my advice that we in addition to pursuing getting back what is ours that we make a report to the police department well understand this equipment six figures from what I understand it's pretty expensive right and it uh that predates me I would have to dig back and see if I can find the information on the cost that was purchased and taken care of prior to my joining the team but I can find that out based on the the mood at the meeting it seemed like everybody was sort of in conjunction kumay let's try to get that stuff while the attitudes are still good versus having to having to reile it stuff because it's if I remember expensive stuff it is okay it's an investment for sure all right thank you that's it any other questions all right teny is just uh travel and also 10 d 10 e yep so this is U if you guys remember the conversation we had in Tallahassee uh related to reasonable Assurance plans uh so the lake Idol is one of the impaired lakes in our area and because of that impairment FD would look at um putting in place what's called a tmdl that would require the city to take certain actions on that Lake as you know the city takes a very uh proactive approach to Lakes management and so in that they've done that in this instance and they've created what's called called a 4E plan so this is basically the city coming forward and saying here's a plan for how to improve that Lake um so we would submit that to D and if D approves that uh that becomes our adopted plan versus the D implementing what they think from the state level is the appropriate action so it lets the local um knowledge kind of Drive what the what the practices that get put in place are so this is a draft of that we we would just submit it to D um and then kind of negotiate a final arrangement with them okay is this the property we approved for that subdiv or that it goes way down on the corner so it's that Lake yes it doesn't really have anything to do specifically with that property but it's that Lake and that Lake wed y there's a there's a big drainage basin that connects to that Lake all the way down MLK Boulevard and then up back behind Hilltop church that whole area all drains that it's a big deal I mean okay yeah so this would be this is basically outlining some strategies some inl some uh Watershed level strategies would be things like um street sweeping and storm water retention some inl strategies would be things like sediment inactivation or vegetative removal but we're we're working with d to kind of Define what that would look like but this this again is a proactive approach from the city to be out in front of a state mandate okay um just to ask some questions on it I when I was reading it and I was reading about the chlorophyll a and and the I'm familiar with total nitrogen and total phosphorus so familiar with Chlor a cuz we um don't like any of that in drinking water but uh in The Lakes um I was looking at the limits and I think it's 40 was that it or over 40 um I believe I have to look at that a little closer yeah a little rusty on that stuff uh chlorophyll a I think is 20 micrograms per liter but the limits for different things it's like uh I was looking at some of um let's say Recreation it it may be 15 to 30 and then if you look at um fishing it's like you know um maybe 20 to 40 or something do we classify the Lakes as to what what they so the the city does not uh the state can place classifications whether they're fishable swimmable um that is done I believe through D I'm looking for a nod from Dustin it's either D or the Department of Health um they both kind of play a role in defining that uh but this is really based on water quality nutrient criteria through the de um it isn't tied directly to that classification okay any other questions all right 10f I'm going to ask heart our Public Works director to kind of give you guys an overview of 10f good evening mayor Commissioners so in the late 1980s to the early 1990s um there were two fuel tanks underground at our motorpool site on the west side of the site that were discovered to have been leaking um fuel into the ground um in 1991 they pulled those tanks out of the ground and began remediation work um and we did that under um a program with fdp the site has been routinely monitored um in 2017 we granted access to FD to come on site and continue doing some additional so soil samplings that was done under Mr her um and we were moving towards a closure of that site um and it revealed that there may still need to be some remediation work um the SK the site scores extremely low it scores a 10 out of 00 um so it's not really been a priority of FD to put money towards remediation work because it's not it doesn't have a lot of contamination we've done a ton of remediation work um so FD contacted us in late December of 2023 and said hey you know funding has become available um to remediate this site it is a 10 and so money is available to you um however in order to access those funds we would have to enter into a pcpp agreement which is the petroleum cleanup particip program agreement with FD and what that means is that they we would cost share with them we would 25% cost share into that program up to $125,000 um with with knowing that $125,000 would be our maximum commitment um so that has been put on the table and we need to enter into that agreement however there are still some negotiation that needs to be done right now we are working to obtain scope of work with an approved contractor through FD um to determine what else needs to be done my understanding um just from conversation I heard earlier this evening is that what needs to be done is additional sampling needs to be tested um to determine how farther remediation needs to go my understanding is the samples are extremely low and they don't believe that Munch remediation work needs to happen at all um in a ballpark figure we've we've been looking at is about 20,000 however in this fact sheet I put that our maximum commitment would be15 ,000 so you would know up front how large it could potentially get um so that is this program we have until February the 19th to negotiate that agreement which is why we brought it before you this evening it's because we won't get another opportunity before that deadline um arises um drawbacks if we do not participate in the agreement is we will be required to remediate the site on our own dime within 30 days any other questions do you know what kind of remediation process it'll be is it is it like the biological remediation um or is it a more traditional method so my understanding is that it's likely more of a traditional method of removal of soils um through kind of research of what happened back in the early 90s we removed um close to 3,000 tons of soil from that site already and have removed that um talking with Department of Health who is managing this on behalf of fdp they've said that we just need additional soil samples and that will be the first scope of work to determine kind of how further mediation Works um but based off of the the previous samples they've had in previous years they don't think that it'll be extensive work another questions thank you thank you all right resolutions 11 a John you want speak to this one certainly uh mayor commission you may recall that this is the second public hearing on the resolution that is establishes the green reuse area for blue Winter Haven we had a public hearing at our last meeting in um January and this is the second required public hearing under the Florida Statutes that govern the designations of this area this is based on an application submitted by the developer back in February a year ago roughly and once this happens uh they will then be eligible for um you know potential Brownfield uh area incentives and other reimbursements which presumably will facilitate uh the further development of this site any questions Mr Mayor go ahead um John or maybe MJ what's the difference between a br field and a green field what what's what what's that about I I think you I I think that they're synonymous somewhat um I think a Brownfield designation is the overall designation and then a green reuse area is statutory nomenclature that um suggests that there may be um you know uh an overall um uh other methods that you could use but I don't think there's any significant CH difference uh commissioner dancer okay that was question number one number two don't you get all this ground Brownfield designation before you develop not after how how did that happen and generally speaking you do we did on properties you may recall we've designated some some of our own sites uh as Brownfield down by the chain lakes and right that area but uh in this instance uh during the process of their development they they discovered after they had closed that they had um uh had some areas that needed further remediation and uh and they met the statutory criteria um for the be eligible for this particular designation but yes in general it does it has occurred keep in mind this application came into the city about a year ago right so it was in a further time earlier in time when they were in their very early stages of development so um the they do meet the criteria but yeah to answer your question it normally comes in before you actually are committed to moving forward with development in this case um that the development is moving forward but this is something that they are allowed to do Under the statute so they if this comes out to be Brownfield or if it is to me I thought of Brownfield like for example I keep going back to the the property on Taylor prel owns there on 17 that's a big Brownfield and we were very limited on what we could do with the land we you know they I remember them saying you can't tear up the dirt you can just pave over the top of it and there there were some very strict criteria on what you do with brown fields or green fields if they're the same thing that's not the case here or is this has nothing to do with the land that's already developed so so in that instance um when you define a Brownfield there are very specific criteria based on the specific site conditions so that site that you're referencing um has some very specific site conditions that require very specific remediation uh these are a little more general for what I understand it was you know use as um old agricultural property and some of the impacts from that and some of the cleanup they did in the process and they they' seek funding to offset some of that cleanup cost funding coming from us or from the feds or from from from the state and or possibly pass through funds from the federal yeah and just to follow what MJ has said this based on the application is because this used to be a Grove and had agricultural uses for many years they used to use pesticides and other types of things and so these are really not considered to be recognized environmental conditions which is an Rec which would be alerting to a land owner or to a prospective buyer these are more business and there there's a there's a term of art that's referred to um but they have found that they are um that because of the nature of the use that there are certain conditions that may be applicable that they could Advantage themselves if they were able to have this designation and they can re get so there's there's not pollution on the land per se there's not like a buried tank or there not some spill that we're trying to correct they're just saying in the event that there is some sort of a chemical out there because of the historical use because and that would probably be the case with any Orange Grove sure it's long term they've probably sprayed it so that's what this is in regards to that's correct yeah it's not it's different than the the um site where there is very specific contamination that needs to be remediated before any type of development can occur when I read this I'm like uhoh cuz we've already they've already developed a site what if they've paved over some dirty dirty land or something uh that yeah they call this a business environmental risk that's what I was looking for and it's set forth pretty specifically in their application in their letter and uh they talk about because of the actual historical use of the property there maybe actual contamination that they have to carefully manage during their Redevelopment uh process and so as a result of that they're going to do that but they have to incur some additional cost and expense which they are then can get recouped so we've got no skin in the game if we approve this if there's any money coming back it'll come through the fed or from the states correct okay which is correct that that's the context in which is this being presented thank you f 11b 11b is pretty simply just accepting the Bradco property deed now that it has been recorded all right yep successfully closed on December 15th all right 11 c um 11 C is reappointment of uh members of our affordable housing advisory committee uh so the the goal of this is to reappoint um most of the members terms have expired and so be looking to reappoint most of those members uh of January 1st 2024 they have all submitted paperwork to be reappointed uh so this is kind of just Shoring up the membership we have within the aack as it exists today uh there are also currently four vacancies on the board uh which are being advertised and once we have uh candidates for those positions we'll bring those back to the commission at a later date okay thank you any questions AUD it's first reading 11 a uh 12 item 12 a and 12 B are companion items 11 a but I meant 12 um items 12 a and 12 B are companion items and I'm going to ask Eric Labby uh to speak on those sure mayor Commissioners um this is a request by Timothy Campbell um he's a petitioner uh to assign neighborhood uh so 02405 uh deals with the future land use and it it is a request to assign neighborhood mixed use Hub uh land use uh to the property uh to a recently annexed property the parcel is located uh at the northwest corner of Cypress Gardens Boulevard and lamp light Lane it's total 2.16 Acres um surrounding uses uh of course include um Cyprus Gardens Boulevard to the South um a dental office and single family to the north and a gas station and convenience store to the West um we have uh in your fact sheet the table um showing that we have adequate capacity in all um infrastructure elements uh it is consistent with um the the F the zoning will be consistent with the requested future land use of Neighborhood Activity Center um consist consistent with the comprehensive plan there is no direct Financial impact to the city the Planning Commission did hear this on January 2nd uh of this year and unanimously recommended approval uh no members of the public spoke and um the next ordinance uh the companion item 0246 is the companion zoning to assign assign C3 zoning to the property a question yes one Eric would you go to page two of seven on our fact sheet the infrastructure I just want to ask a quick question on that chart you did yes sir and the chart's great thank you for that but explain to me what the what the bested demands mean exactly what's the term what's that mean those are projects that have already received if it's a residential project they have a plat approval or if it's a commercial project they have a site plan approval so we take those projected capacities out of the out of the mix out of the mix okay so the what I'm what I'm most concerned about is traffic we're all hearing every day about traffic and I look at the vested demands are 93 trips those are trips that we've already approved that hasn't been developed yet this potential development could create 241 trips and 231 trips and leaves us 96 trips left for suff Gardens Boulevard or is that just on for that segment of Cypress Gardens Boulevard yes sir and that seems a lot or sufficient I mean it's very much so it is okay 96 trips is a lot it is okay yes sir okay that's all I add sir one question is the commercial going to be on sa Gard Boulevard more on that quarter or on the corner there at lampl yeah it's at the northwest corner of cyber Gardens Boulevard and lampl um I would suspect and of course we don't have a site plan at this point but I would suspect they would um have an entrance one entrance off of Lamplight and probably a right in right out off of um Cypress Gardens Boulevard okay right so my question was along the same lines on the on the trip count the 90 so what is the 93 trip what what development is that tied to I don't know specifically which projects are in that vested calculation Sean may have a recol recollection just off the top of his head but it's it's it's um basically projects that have already been approved right so what is the corridor that that you're so where does that go from do you remember this where the the segment of Cypress Gardens Boulevard goes cypess Gard Road 27 Okay so that that these trips then would not be inclusive of the whatch iall it um Carlton at Lake Dexter or the other one that's right next to on the other side of cyp Gard Road or the hospital so Pro uh Pros Apartments um they're in that segment right they're a percent yeah yep so so they would be part of that 9 three the pros because they have not received a CO yet a certificate of occupancy portions of Carlton at Lake Dexter have received a CO so as as the cosos get approved which means the the building is constructed and can be occupied then we pull those trips out of the vested number and they become actual trips on the roadway that's how the concurrency management spreadsheet works sounds like government accounting I know like so is it is there a way to like I I get your the segment there but shouldn't we be looking from Highway 27 to 6 Street I mean should shouldn't we shouldn't be looking at yeah so it's a it's a DOT road right and the county maintains the um Trent the trip counts uh on County and and um state roads that are uh within our jurisdiction they set the parameters for what a particular segment is okay but the PE my point is the people that are setting these things are not in Winter Haven every day all the segments well yeah yeah yeah we do account for all the segments so the next segment that has also has a um a trip count and vested capacity associated with it so in totality we are tracking the entirety of of Cypress Gardens Boulevard so so so one more question so if there were 500 units that haven't been coed yet but I'm just I don't know I'm just saying if there were 500 units that haven't been coed yet are those in this remaining capacity are those already deducted out of the remaining capacity or are those still to come out of the remaining capacity once they get Co if they have site plan approval or a plat approval they are in the vested category so we we take them out and it's no longer in the remaining capacity column that's not remaining capacity because we've we've we've taken it out right so everything basically that's along Cypress Gardens Boulevard is already out of of these numbers is that correct that's what I was if yes if they've got an approval to to begin construction which everything's under construction right now so now now if it's a vacant piece of property and it's zoned commercial and we've not approved a site plan on it that's not in these numbers we'll evaluate concurrency when we get a site plan submitted from them which I don't think there's anything like that left right I mean what about the one at the corner at 27 in Cypress Gardens Boulevard would that be that's got an expired site plan I believe correct that's an expired site plan so they they need to resubmit so so once it's expired do you add those numbers back they they're available again okay and so those numbers would be so if if that wasn't backed out we could be at zero when that comes in we'll look at the capacity at that time and we'll tell them there either is or isn't capacity and if there isn't they can't [Music] build I hate to I hate to be at uh zero when target comes in and now there's not enough spaces for Target to come in and we'll be the worst people on the planet see the Dilemma is this is the Dilemma Mr Mayor is we kind of get it and because we've been doing this a long time but when we talk to Citizens out there all they know is it takes them 20 minutes to get from Publix to legol land and we try to say oh we got permitted permits we got you know got this segment has still has some use and this segment doesn't and you try to explain that somebody body and their head just it just goes right over their head that's the Dilemma that we run into and is cuz we hear it all the time from people traffic traffic every traffic you know and we get it I don't I drive on SS Boulevard every day I hate the traffic too but I think a good note with that you know um a few meetings ago uh you guys approved us to move forward with a task order with kimley Horn uh with the grant funding from the state to do a transportation master plan and that looks really in depth at a full buildout scenario of the city um and where we have pinch points and identifies how we make improvements so that again we're proactive and out in front of that stuff um that's looking out through 2040 and Beyond um with actual data yeah with actual data and really drills into it and and that you know can probably serve as a as a model basis to um add to the conversation we're having here in the future well keep in mind that the conversation he's referring to is with DOT generally and their fiveyear plan and the more data the more actual you know information that you have you're probably better off you being us the citizens because when we are at that table having those conversations with the people that hold the pur strings or that hold the determiners of who gets what and where that helps I think the other good example to talk about that you know a staff we use when talking with residents is you know that the destinations change over time and I think a really good example we talked about the other day um you know if you think about all of Southeast Winter Haven right now if there's somebody out there that needs to go to the hospital they're going to the Winter Haven Hospital right they're all coming to that same place but you know within a year or so um that will change and that traffic going to Winter Haven Hospital will from the southeast will probably now go to the hospital in the Southeast so I think as that development comes and fills in um new destinations are created I mean South Point Elementary is another good example right all those people were maybe going to traffic that were contributing to other um areas of town and now it's it's a little more Consolidated so I think as that changes that's something we always use when we talk with residents so so in that same category of once Thompson Nursery gets widened does that potentially add back capacity to Cypress Gardens bivard and how long does that take like do they have to do studies and is that years of of studies before okay now we see that enough traffic has been shifted from from this road to this road now will add back or is that I don't know the exact time frame on that but yes I mean I think that that's the idea right is the Thompson Nursery Road acts as a reliever for Cypress Gardens Boulevard in the same way that um increasing the capacity on dundy road acts as a reliever for Cypress Gardens Boulevard um and I think one thing that's kind of um great for us now is that that data is a lot easier to get our hands on so I think all of that happens a lot more quickly than maybe it used to so I don't know exactly what that time line would look like but I think um I think you're thinking about that in the right context just so from matter perspective the TPO doesn't count every road every year they just don't have the capacity to do that so in some some roadway segments they'll get counted in a given year some of them will just be a multiplier based on what they see in the growth right so they add a multiplier but with the with the data that MJ is talking about we now have real-time data and we have the ability to go to the TP and say this is what we're seeing we're seeing a reduction on Cypress Gardens Boulevard after the construction of Thompson Nursery can you send some counters out there and we can make that request and and we can get things in the hopper much much quicker and that that would let us formally change the available capacity number then right and reevaluate it to to your point this is a dangerous question but so could we also delay on going to the TP with that information to say let's take a step back here and this is a way to kind of take take a step back on development to say you know yes it's it's filled there could be more but we're going to take a step back here before we go to the TPO to readjust the roads I mean anytime we see that you know there are complaints or or constituents or problems particularly accidents with within any given roadway we want to take a look at that well I wasn't referring to that yeah I mean yeah you know we've re we've reshift all of these roads we're at zero on Cypress Gardens Boulevard do we are we in a hurry to get that off of zero to get more development going or we that that's a nuanced question I don't know we're going down the rabbit hole a little bit but I was just because there are property rights and there are certain things that we have to take into account so that's hard to give a real definitive answer to that's a strategy what likely would I guess what I'm asking are we prohibited in following a strategy like that no what what likely would happen um commissioner Yates which is set up in our code and in and in our growth management rules and regulations is that if a developer comes in and he wants to develop a vacant piece of property and we tell them what we have is zero capacity in our concurrency spreadsheets you can't do that they would likely go out and do a private um traffic analysis on their own and to try to demonstrate If there really was capacity that analysis would be reviewed by us by TP by if it's a DOT fdot and everybody would then everybody would start looking at the road and say do we really have capacity or not yeah and again I I'm not trying to set ourselves up to be deceptive out there I'm trying to get as everybody's pounding on us that traffic is horrible traffic is horrible the more answers the more solutions the more information that we can arm ourselves with to to try to educate the people that want to be educated on it um we can do that well that's the great thing about that master plan that you've approved cuz that gives us just exactly what you just said that's exactly the goal the thing about uh the master plan and and getting looking at RADS and projecting one of the the challenges is that even after you uh make a determination that there needs to be an improvement to a road from the from that point to the time that that possibly will take place is not uh a small window that's the problem that's one of the major problems that uh not just in Winter Haven but that that we are facing in the State of Florida especially in district one where uh the money is being allocated is not being allocated to uh attack some of the problems that we have it's being allocated to keep the roads that that are in there for instance the dot secretary says I'm talking the state DOT secretary comes to us and says to us well we've got several projects that are going to be moved out one year back in the fiveyear plan because the money that we have is has to go to the the resurfacing and the and all of that stuff and so basically that's real I'm just saying that's a real problem that we face and so that Transportation plan that we're doing that's that's going to help us to move forward a lot faster and maybe get into the plans because that's that's the problem is that do state only gives them so much money per District and even though the fiveyear plans we have those in place saying what we want to spend if you don't have the money they don't do it they move us back and that's what happened years ago even with the dunde road uh we were in the 5year plan for the Dundee Road at least 10 years ago and I know and I can remember it vividly because JD Alexander was in uh Tallahasse and they took dundy Road widening out of the plan they took that out of the plan they took the 98 uh bypass in Lakeland they took that out the plan and they took out the uh Lake Alford out the plan and when it came back just and I'll be quick when they put it back in the plan you know which one got done first the Lakeland then Lake Alford we were the last one so I'm just saying that's that's the reality that we face with these roads and so it's it's great that we're moving ahead with the plan just a small point of clarification on commissioner Mercer's question uh your first question um I don't suspect there'll be another curb cut on this property because there's already I forgot until I looked at the aerial there's already an existing front Frontage Road on this property that connects to the adjacent parcel and lamp light so they will likely utilize that Frontage rad just one more quick question Eric or who is the controlling interest that drives all this between County Roads and state roads and City roads and City developments that we approve is it is it the TP or who who who makes the determination that I'll let you ask go ahead go ahead and ask it the determination that there is capacity or the deter all that we're talking about you know all that we're talking about is is confusing because citizens complain to us or want some action and it's a state road I'm like we got to deal with the do or we're dealing with the county there's got to be a controlling interest I think the controlling the the major controlling interest is is us and and the citizens of of wter Haven but um you know roads do have jurisdictions so there are City roads there are responsibility there are County Roads that are County responsibility and there are state roads that are the state's respons responsibility now we work closely with um you know district one and we work closely with the county to collaborate around improvements that would help our citizens Thompson Nursery Road is a great example um of that dundy road is a great example of that you know not all of the property along dundy road is within the City of Winter Haven um not all the property along Thompson Nursery Road is within the City of Winter Haven a lot of traffic is passed through traffic that's coming from one Community you know to another Community or coming to Downtown Winter Haven or or what whatever that is using you know that roadway as an access point so um I think that we are in a very good position as the city because of some of the things we've done like our Master planning and some of the data that um tools that we have built over the the last the previous few years that you know we have we can go to those entities that we don't have jurisdiction over the county and the state and present information and data to them um including Master plans that say this is within our master plan you know we have the data showing that it's needed and we need to strategize on how to fund this how to get it done and so we're we're in a much better place as a city I think now than we were five six years ago around Transportation yeah I just want to say to uh commissioner dancor when you look at the roads around win haven uh we you can go you can go in and determine what's County what's State and that sort of thing and so at the end of the day we've got to try to work with with each entity but the I think we've been very successful especially on uh Cyprus Gardens Boulevard and 17 with with you know those intersections and so I mean the master plan I think is we really need that we really need that roads are tricky and but but it all happens through a lot of collaboration a lot of good relationships between staff between your guys service on the TPO boards um but but each one of those is a kind of a case by case got it all right anybody else all right uh 12C um this is a this is a pretty simple clarification within our code um so traditionally we have measured the high water line for developments uh from the back of the seaw wall but that was never actually written into the code uh so this is going back and actually just writing into the code specifying along canals where we will measure the high water line from against the back of the seaw wall it also relocates um the list of high water lines uh from one section of the code which is in uh Marine structures right now uh into the section of the code where it's actually most frequently used uh and then aligns the uh geographical data with a more modern data so is this just seaw walls on canals or is this like if somebody has a lake front house and they build a seaw wall does it pertain to them as well does that make sense yes which is it's it's really no different canals I think is where it has traditionally been the question of where exactly do we measure it um has come in and so this staff is seeking to just kind of add that clarification of from the back of the sea walls where it gets measured from okay any other questions all right and the only other thing that I see is uh Leon for RFQ for the uh Professional Services and we'll we'll do that on Monday Mr Mayor yes I had a concern I wanted to bring up and I think it probably qualifies under new business well it's old business but kind of new business Okay so Carlton at Lake Dexter had their ribbon cutting last week this week last week last week yeah all the weeks blur together at this point um and they touted you know all the fancy stuff and it it it looks phenomenal um and they touted some of the r rent specials that they had going on and it's like $100 off a month for the year and reduced fees or or whatever I remember specifically on that project and I think it was written into the the Pud or or that 10% of that project had to go to affordable housing and I met with a family that actually reached out to them on that and they got quoted three bedroom $2,300 a month and uh you know I other no any of the bedroom capacities were not anything close to what they could afford so we implemented that we put that strategy in place they agreed to it now what we will reach out to the um owner developer and uh strategize around how to implement that I think that that was a condition that carried over from the previous PUD that was had been in place um I think since the early 2000s um that was on that site and it carried over into the new PUD um the Pud didn't specifically identify a mechanism for for how we would carry that out they did indicate at the public hearing that they would have rents available that were within that um HUD rent table um and so we will reach out to the owner developer and strategize on how to Implement that if I'm not mistaken it was Tim Campbell was the representing attorney for that project and I mean I see his name you know on on the agenda for other items so I just you know in the blink of an eye these things will be rented up because they can rent them for higher amounts so and if there's not a mechanism or anybody knocking on their door to say Hey you agreed to this hold your feet to the fire and get it done um it's not going to happen so I don't know if we can get an update on that come Monday or um if we could do it that fast but I I I mean they're actively leasing these things and selling them and or or excuse me they're actively leasing these these units and the time is now and I I think you know they got to figure this out I can I'm I can reach out before Monday for sure whether or not we'll have a strategy outlined on how to implement that okay likely not by Monday but well hopefully you reach out and they say Yep this this building right here is 100 is is 10% of the project and it's dedicated to what we agreed to that's the perfect that's what I really want to hear um not hearing that so far Mr Mayor to to demony I I just want to say to that that that usually in a u in a in a project like that you wouldn't want to put a certain group of people in a particular unit I know when we did it out at the Village lak smart it was yeah and and I didn't I guess I didn't mean to okay group them all into one but I mean it's like and you're absolutely correct that day that we were that we did the ribbon cutting um they stated in fact they actually show the family that that they let move in the day before so yeah so they it's not yes so this is more of a question I guess for John we approve things all the time with these type of caveats okay you know how do we go back and make sure they're enforced because and I'm going to bring this up at our planning Retreat next week or in two weeks about let's really if we're serious about trying to do Workforce housing let's let's let's write it into our codes and let's get it into some let's put some teeth behind it they may not agree but that's what I'm going to Advocate anyway we've done that already cuz I remember exactly what commissioner yat said we gave 10% and they they agreed to 10% right there at that Podium that's great we're happy I don't I don't doubt that they're not going to do it but going forward when we make these allowances for people like we just approve something for for charging stations for a development who goes back and makes sure they put the charging stations in so you know I mean those kind of things yeah so so we inspect once the property is is developed we inspect the property to make sure that they've put in everything that they were supposed to put in that was identified on the site plan or a condition in the Pud zoning or or something like that if they don't it is a code um compliance issue and they can be cited for from Code Compliance so that's us on a physical Improvement like a charging station but something like rents that's a very unique yeah this this condition is actually very unique I think it's the only PUD that I'm aware of in the city that has this particular condition really uh yep placed on it other affordable housing projects like like um like like blose sky or um there's uh you know or the um lake Lakes smart um Village at Lake smart project um they are all all uh low-income tax credit projects that get funding from the state and there is um that's all monitored inspected annually by the state to ensure compliance and audited by Hud to ensure compliance we as a city don't really have you know the ability to to do all that um so that's why I said we need to strategize with with the owner develop confident that we have not approved any other developments with these caveats in it for Workforce housing because I know we talk about it on every one of them but maybe we don't actually approve it that way at least I always bring it up yeah now we do you know we do have other pots of money that you know like the ship fund um that is you know used for um income eligible uh you know low-income individuals to either purchase a home or uh rehabilitate their home or do emergency repairs or disaster you know assistance um so we we help with Workforce housing in in that way um but you know with regard to um actually having the ability um to provide enough funding for something like a like the blue sky project or the vills at Lakes smart U you know they received Blue Sky received uh $20 million from um from the state and and $2 million from po County in order to be able to provide those low $60,000 from us I know I know in order to be able to provide those I get it with blue sky that was that was that was the whole intent of that project but I just I'm just a little I'm just confused because I thought we'd approved other ones with this same caveat but apparently we didn't so well and we've got a good mechanism right and we have the affordable housing trust fund all set up so if obviously we we can't really do it on the project that's already at hand but the next one that rolls around and we are able to negotiate that commitment if you don't do it then you're putting $50,000 a unit into the affordable housing trust fund those are your options and and as they these developers want to come in and build in our communities and and grow our communities they need to be good stewards and part of that is providing a level of housing that's affordable in my opinion well I think that's a very good potential strategy that we want to look at is to um it's almost similar to a deed and or fee andl um and you know we have the supplemental affordable housing trust fund ordinance of 2159 that we all adopted and that's that's a that's a good you know start um to that that that allows us to contractually with developers as they come in to to try to negotiate that and and I think probably would be some receptivity to it um certainly uh coming in on the front end is much better than than having a contract in place than otherwise um the other thing I would point out and Villas at Lakes smart they have refinanced at least three times yes and I'm familiar with that because they've asked for releases from the city from various things we offered them back in the early days and part of the review that I've made of that is they have very stringent um HUD requirements yes and I assure you they they and they have lots of um professionals working on the refinancings which are huge numbers and very strictly enforced in terms of the number of units and the yeah so that's that I assume that's reflective of all of those types of housing units um um the more of those we can get in Winter Haven probably the better for us and I'll add um that I think you know that's something that we're looking at much more in depth than we have in the past and Eric just added a member to staff to his team that has a lot of expertise in this realm um and I think even just in the last three days since he's been here we've had some really creative conversations about different ways to to try to um different strategies we might be able to implement to achieve what I think you guys are talking about well I think that the state is making it easier for the developers because they're waving zoning requirements and allowing things to be put in wherever and you know that that that helps ultimately the end you know live live affordable and um you know that that's cly our tools that we didn't have before yeah and and and we've got some momentum in that area as a community as well I would only add that um you know blue sky is going to be open um I believe in March um towards the end of March March they'll be they'll be open and done and um I've actively within the last couple weeks spoken with two other affordable housing um developers that utilize low-income housing tax credits that are looking at properties in the City of Winter Haven oh good you be like Bruce and so he can't give us any names until I you know you should just see the things we have coming it's just not my news to share I don't think yeah if I tell you I have to kill you all right and else I've got something else I want to just bring up real quick just point of clarification you know we had that problem with our sewer and water plant that broke down we had two of them went down at the same time is that all fixed now or where are we with with with that are we at risk anymore Gary or we're good all three are up and running or just two we're all up and running okay so crisis averted and it was quick was quick I didn't think it'd be this fast it was quick and there was a lot of creative thinking from from Gary's team and from our contractor on that yes okay just anybody else if there's nothing else motion to a join move we are join